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Old 03-15-2018, 02:26 PM   #1
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TV Question

In the next 5 years we are looking at going full time. We will be upgrading our current tt to a 5ver. Some of the ones we like currently have a gross weight around 18k. Pin weight is going to be in the 4000 to 4500 range I am guessing. I am looking at purchasing my TV in the next year or so so I can get it paid off before going full time. I am looking at either a 350/3500 drw or an f450 drw. The payload on the 350/3500 is in the 5200 range. The pin weight is going to eat up most of that. I really don't think there will be much in the TV besides me and the wife and some small odds and ins. The 700 difference should be ok even with the hitch. The F450 has a payload of around 7600. I am thinking for the extra couple thousand to go with the F450. Is the F450 overkill or is the F350 fine? Will be traveling all over so going thru the mountains as well. Just want to make sure I don't have any issues. Which would you go with? Thanks
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Old 03-15-2018, 02:35 PM   #2
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If the 450 is only that much more that's what I'd get because plans can change due to unexpected needs and it would be a shame not to have the extra capacity available if needed. Better to have too much than not enough.
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Old 03-15-2018, 03:40 PM   #3
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What configuration is that? The 2018 numbers show the F350 DRW Crew Cab, 4x4 can have up to 6530lbs payload and the F450 DRW up to 5310lbs and is only available in a crew cab.

http://pa.motorwebs.com/ford/pdf/bro...super-duty.pdf

I'd pick the F450 because it has a tighter turning radius and from what I hear larger brakes.

We're contemplating a move to full-timing and i'm researching trucks as well, DRW. Ram or Ford. I have zero brand loyalty. I just go with what is best.
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Old 03-15-2018, 04:10 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwinger73 View Post
Is the F450 overkill or is the F350 fine?
The F-350 DRW is fine. I wouldn't call the F-450 "overkill" because it won't tow any heavier trailer than the F-350 DRW

The F-450 has more GCWR (and thus tow rating) than the F-350 DRW. But GCWR is not the limiter as to how heavy a trailer you can tow without overloading anything in the tow vehicle. GVWR is the limiter. And GVWR is the same 14,000 pounds for both the F-450 and the F-350 DRW. A full-timer will reach the GVWR limit way before he gets close to the GCWR limit.

The F-450 has limited configuration of CrewCab PSD 4x4 and 4.30 axle. The F-350 DRW can be ordered in regular cab, SuperCab, or CrewCab, and with your choice of 4x2 or 4x4 drivetrain. And the F-350 DRW can even be ordered with a gas engine if you want to struggle up mountain passes and other steep grades.

A full-timer has to haul everything he owns with him when he changes RV parks. So you're probably going to max out the payload capacity of either the F-450 or the F-350 DRW.

Assuming you'd configure your F-350 DRW to mimic the F-450 (CrewCab 4x4 PSD) then the only practical difference is the slightly better towing experience with the F-450 because of the shorter legs of the 4.30 axle. The F-350 with the 4.10 axle wouldn't climb the Rockies quite as easily as the F-450 with its 4.30 axle.

Tires are a lot different, but the tires can handle the GVWR without any problem. Some folks prefer the 19.5" "real truck tires" on the F-450 to the light truck tires in the F-350 DRW. And if you're into bragging rights, then F-450 sounds like a lot more truck than F-350 to those that are not "into" truck specs.

Which would I buy? Depends on the price difference. I'd pay a little more for the F-450, even though it won't tow any heavier trailer than the comparably-equipped F-350 DRW. Bragging rights don't turn me on. The main reason to order the F-450 is the 4.30 axle (N/A on the F-350 DRW). The main reason to order the F-350 DRW for me is I have absolutely no use for 4x4, so I'd probably order an F-350 DRW 4x2 PSD with 4.10 axle, and thus save several hundred bucks. YMMD

Quote:
I really don't think there will be much in the TV besides me and the wife and some small odds and ins.
Think again. When a full-timer changes RV parks, you must haul everything you own with you. The 5er will probably be packed to the rafters and your TV will probably be loaded to the gills. Maybe not the first move you make, but DW is going to insist on hauling her aminities with her when she changes RV parks, whether it's one mile or 1,000 miles down the road. And the longer she full times, the more junk she's going to accumulate and insist on hauling with her.
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Old 03-15-2018, 04:27 PM   #5
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The F-450 is available in 2WD.

In terms of 5th wheel towing, both 4x4, the F350 can tow 27300lbs with 3.55 gears and 31300 with 4.10.
The F-450 can tow 32,500 with 4.30 gears.

But with the same GVWR rating the payload on the F-450 is 1,220lbs less than the F-350. I wonder why?
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Old 03-15-2018, 04:33 PM   #6
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The F450 is more capable than the F350 DRW in every way. Its payload limitation is another example of Ford tagging it with a GVWR to keep it in a certain class. The GVWR is not accurately representing its actual abilities.
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Old 03-15-2018, 04:34 PM   #7
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The F-450 is available in 2WD.
Chassis cab yes, but pickup no. At least not for the 2017 model year. I don't have a 2018 SuperDuty Order Guide, so it may have changed.
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Old 03-15-2018, 05:10 PM   #8
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I just went through this. I kind of wanted the 450 based on the reduced turning radius and bigger brakes. I'm nowhere close to payload on a DRW but too close for comfort on a SRW so the slight payload loss wouldn't have been a big deal.

The gearing works out about the same since the 450 has bigger tires.

Those tires are also limiting: my favorite tire chain, Discount Tire, won't touch them. That may not be a deal breaker but it was for me.

I'm fairly confident that the 450 pickup (class 3) is available in 4x2 this year: expect to lose about 400 pounds of payload vs a similarly equipped F350 DRW. You can gain 2000 pounds or so if you get the cab and chassis model (class 4) with an Aluminum flat bed but that opens up a can of worms in the insurance and registration world.

The 450 would have been much more expensive since the volume dealers don't stock them but they do stock DRW 350s.

Now if I could just find some quality A/T load range E tires in like a 265 85r17 my dually would be perfect.
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Old 03-16-2018, 08:47 AM   #9
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I found the payload capacities just googling them. By looking at the brochure you post it is a lot less then want I found. The price difference was only a couple thousand. Now that I see the F450 is a lot lower payload I am going to lean towards the 350/3500. I am not a brand guy so I just buy which I like the look of the best and price. I currently have a Ram 2500 gas. I assume payload and towing will be about the same between brands. Thanks for all the responses and pointing out the payloads I saw were not right.
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Old 03-16-2018, 09:08 AM   #10
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The GVWR is not accurately representing its actual abilities.
And which state certified you as a Professional Engineer (PE) in chassis design?
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Old 03-16-2018, 09:11 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by bwinger73 View Post
I found the payload capacities just googling them. By looking at the brochure you post it is a lot less then want I found. The price difference was only a couple thousand. Now that I see the F450 is a lot lower payload I am going to lean towards the 350/3500. I am not a brand guy so I just buy which I like the look of the best and price. I currently have a Ram 2500 gas. I assume payload and towing will be about the same between brands. Thanks for all the responses and pointing out the payloads I saw were not right.
2018 RAM 3500 DRW payload is 5690lbs.
Towing with the 4x4 crew cab:
3.42 20,520lbs
3.73 25,020lbs
4.10 30,660lbs
These are with the HO cummins and aisin transmission.
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Old 03-16-2018, 09:47 AM   #12
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Now if I could just find some quality A/T load range E tires in like a 265 85r17 my dually would be perfect.
Nobody makes that size. The closest is 265/70R17E. Goodyear also makes a 235/85R17E, but they say it is for a spare only.
Available 17" tire sizes

LT265/70R17E is almost the standard size for late-model dually pickups, so almost all tire manufacturers make that size. My favorite (and best per Consumer Reports) is Michelin Defender LTX, so here's the one I'd choose:
Michelin Defender LTX LT265/70R17E
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Old 03-16-2018, 05:32 PM   #13
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TV Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by SmokeyWren View Post
Nobody makes that size. The closest is 265/70R17E. Goodyear also makes a 235/85R17E, but they say it is for a spare only.

Available 17" tire sizes



LT265/70R17E is almost the standard size for late-model dually pickups, so almost all tire manufacturers make that size. My favorite (and best per Consumer Reports) is Michelin Defender LTX, so here's the one I'd choose:

Michelin Defender LTX LT265/70R17E


I know...I'd really like something in the 34-35" range that I could run without too much spacer. And I'm not particularly interested in dropping an astronomical sum on a set of 20x8 rims to run the super common 285 65r20 which wouldn't stick out of the hips too much.

245 75r17 on 6.5" rim on my 2017.

And I concur on the Defenders...this is my third truck to run them.
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Old 03-18-2018, 10:45 PM   #14
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A friend has 2017 F450 Platinum with most options and the door sticker says 4980 payload. I have to admit it a nice truck.
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