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Old 10-04-2013, 08:30 PM   #15
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That 5.8 is a real pig on fuel and underpowered you may as well find one with the 460 as it will be way more power and towing fuel economy will be the same you didn't mention if your truck was 4x4 or not but the most cost effective thing might be to swap out that axle in your existing truck. Easily and cheaply done with a second hand unit
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Old 10-04-2013, 08:47 PM   #16
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I still haven't bought a new tow vehicle. I'd still prefer to buy something that will seat the 6 of us and tow the TT. I'd prefer to stay with a gas vehicle because of the maintinence and fuel costs.

I've looked at 2500 Suburbans from the mid 90's to mid 2000's. 454,6.0, and 8.1 I'm sure is where it's at with those SUVs. Thought about a Expedition EL from the mid 2000's but I don't think the 5.4 is up to the job.
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Old 10-04-2013, 10:46 PM   #17
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How would you put 6 people in standard cab F250? My understanding is that standard cab is only for two or three. Nobody should ride in the trailer. Your only option is a right full size van. There are many of them around, they are cheaper and easier to find than the Excursion. 3300lb of trailer is not a lot, even if they will become 5000 after loading it, but aerodynamic resistance is not your best friend.
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Old 10-04-2013, 11:03 PM   #18
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How would you put 6 people in standard cab F250? My understanding is that standard cab is only for two or three. Nobody should ride in the trailer. Your only option is a right full size van. There are many of them around, they are cheaper and easier to find than the Excursion. 3300lb of trailer is not a lot, even if they will become 5000 after loading it, but aerodynamic resistance is not your best friend.
I wouldn't put 6 people in a standard cab F250. The F250 was $2000, so could afford to buy it as an extra vehicle for tow use only. Me and 1 kid in the truck and the other 4 in my wife's Nissan Versa.

$2500-$3000 is my EXTRA Truck budget. Other wise if I spend any more than that I'll have to get an SUV that can carry all of us and I can use as a daily driver. I'd sell my bmw and replace it with the SUV.
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Old 10-05-2013, 04:11 AM   #19
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I have toyed with the idea of a full-size van instead of a truck when we move back. More room inside to "play with" and keep stuff, especially in bear/critter country.
Post pics when you decide!
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Old 10-05-2013, 06:13 AM   #20
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The 5.8L with the 3.55 axle will not be a good performer. You may want to look at an axle swap to a 3.73.

Ken
If you're going to spend the big bucks to have the ring gear and pinion replaced, I wouldn't settle for 3.73 ratio. Go on up to at least 4.10, which is about the ideal compromise for towing with a half-ton pickup. If you don't need to compromise the axle ratio to also use the pickup as a commuter car, then go to 4.30 ratio.


Quote:
Originally Posted by DougL3NC
99 F150 4.6L extended cab with 3.08 gear. It's a non-factory tow package truck.

My TT is a 2001 R-Vision Trail-Lite 7253 25' that weighs about 3300lbs dry.

Am I going to be ok or am I going kill this truck towing it?
But waitaminute! Since you're on a tight budget, don't trade tow vehicles. If your SuperCab is big enough to haul your crew while towing, then make some changes to the current pickup:

I had a 2003 F-150 with the 4.6L 2V engine and 3.55 axle. It was a dog towing a cargo trailer that grossed about 5,000 pounds. Without spending some money on the truck to have the equivalent of the HD towing pkg, you'll probably kill the truck, or a least kill the tranny. But spend a few bucks on that 4.6L and it would do okay with a wet and loaded trailer that grossed about 5,000 pounds.

1] Add a big oil-to-air tranny cooler (heat exchanger). That's a relatively simple job you can DIY.

2] Add a tranny temp gauge with the bottom peg at 100 and top end at 280. With the more common tranny temp gauge with the bottom peg at 140, you won't know if it's working right in the wintertime when tranny temp rarely reaches 140.

Be sure the sender for the gauge is located where it gives you "sump temp" (not in a cooler line), by either adding a threaded bung to the tranny pan or installing the sender in a port on the tranny where close to sump temp is available. When climbing grades, watch that gauge like a hawk, and don't allow more than 225 F. That's also a DIY job if you're not all thumbs and provided you don't have to add a welded-in bung in the pan.
http://www.autometer.com/cat_gaugede...id=4302&sid=89

3] Replace the ring gear and pinion with a 4.30 ratio. Pay a pro to do it. I suspect this is the parts you will need:
High performance Yukon Ring & Pinion gear set for Ford 8.8" in a 4.30 ratio - YG F8.8-430

But check with your pro differential shop to be sure they will install a ring gear and pinion you bought somewhere else. Most insist you buy the parts from them, and they usually charge a lot more for the ring gear and pinion than Randy charges.

4] Pay attention to your coolant temp gauge when towing. If the engine gets "hot", then replace the radiator with the biggest radiator that will fit. Probably the radiator from an F-150 that has the heavy duty towing pkg.

5] With the big radiator, if your engine still gets too "hot" when struggling up steep grades with the trailer, then add an engine oil cooler. That's a fairly simple DIY job if you use a "sandwich adapter" that goes between the oil filter and the engine.
Amazon.com: Trans-Dapt 1313 Oil Cooler Sandwich Adapter: Automotive
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Old 10-05-2013, 09:17 AM   #21
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So what is your truck rated to tow?????
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Old 10-05-2013, 09:34 AM   #22
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So what is your truck rated to tow?????
There's a lot of speculation surrounding that statement! With the 4.6 and 3.08 gear I haven't found a difinitive answer yet.
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Old 10-05-2013, 09:42 AM   #23
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Smokey,

I'm not really on that tight a budget, just trying to shop smart.

Modifying the current truck really isn't an option for me since it's my fathers and he commutes with it. If I need his truck I just give him my BMW to drive.

I'm wholly not opposed to selling the BMW and getting something more suited to towing as my commute is only about 2 miles round trip to work. But if I sell the BMW I have to have something that seats 6 in decent comfort. I've got enough play cash to buy a truck for a few thousand dollars, but if I go over that budget I'll just sell the car and add my cash to it.

Just trying to find a good TV!
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Old 10-06-2013, 08:11 AM   #24
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Smokey,

I'm not really on that tight a budget, just trying to shop smart.

Modifying the current truck really isn't an option for me since it's my fathers and he commutes with it. If I need his truck I just give him my BMW to drive.

I'm wholly not opposed to selling the BMW and getting something more suited to towing as my commute is only about 2 miles round trip to work. But if I sell the BMW I have to have something that seats 6 in decent comfort. I've got enough play cash to buy a truck for a few thousand dollars, but if I go over that budget I'll just sell the car and add my cash to it.

Just trying to find a good TV!
Smokey - I'm gonna ask you when I need some help! Dang! Great advice.

Doug - why not get a Supercrew with the tow package? A 1/2 ton is more than enough for that TT. I can't wait to find out what you decide.
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Old 10-06-2013, 08:22 AM   #25
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Smokey - I'm gonna ask you when I need some help! Dang! Great advice. Doug - why not get a Supercrew with the tow package? A 1/2 ton is more than enough for that TT. I can't wait to find out what you decide.
But is that super crew 150/1500 enough for the trailer and 6 people?
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Old 10-06-2013, 08:38 AM   #26
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I've got to put a hitch on it anyway, as it was taken off to use on another truck.

For $2000 I can live with a standard cab! Still can't believe I'm getting this truck for less than what my golf cart cost me.
I'd do a Crewcab swap on it and cut down the length of the bed. Cab can be found with rear doors for $1000 or less. take you time looking and you might find a good one at scrap price.
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Old 10-06-2013, 02:00 PM   #27
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So what is your truck rated to tow?????
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Originally Posted by DougL3NC View Post
There's a lot of speculation surrounding that statement! With the 4.6 and 3.08 gear I haven't found a difinitive answer yet.
Per '99 Ford RV and Trailer Towing Guide for F-150 SuperCab 4x2, 4.6L engine, 3.08 ratio:

GCWR 10,000
GVWR 6,000

So the total weight of the wet and loaded pickup and trailer combined cannot exceed 10,000 pounds, and the total weight on the 4 pickup tires cannot exceed 6,000 pounds.

Ford's mythical "tow rating" for your drivetrain is 5,400 pounds, but that assumes your wet and loaded pickup before you tie onto the trailer weighs less than 4,600 pounds. Your Dad's F-150 is going to weigh a lot more than 4,600 pounds with your family inside, so ignore Fords myth and compute your own actual tow rating per the following:

To determine how much trailer you can tow without being overloaded, put all the people and stuff in the pickup that will be in it when towing. Include the shank and head (ball mount) from your weight-distributing hitch. (If you don't have the WD hitch yet, add 50# to the pickup weight.) Go to a truckstop that has a certified automated truck (CAT) scale, fill up with gas, and weigh the wet and loaded truck.

Subtract the weight of the wet and loaded truck from 10,000 and the answer is the max weight of any trailer you can tow without exceeding the GCWR. The GCWR tells you the max weight you can gross without burning up something in the drivetrain of a well-maintained tow vehicle, and without being the slowpoke holding up traffic when climbing hills and mountain passes.

Subtract the weight of the wet and loaded truck from the GVWR of the truck and the answer is the max hitch weight you can haul without exceeding the GVWR. The GVWR tells you how much weight your truck's suspension can carry without overloading any of the components, such as springs, tires, wheels, and frame.

Convert max hitch weight to max tandem-axle trailer weight by dividing hitch weight by 0.15 (15%). For example, if your max hitch weight is 600 pounds, your max trailer weight is 4,000 pounds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DougL3NC
I'm wholly not opposed to selling the BMW and getting something more suited to towing as my commute is only about 2 miles round trip to work. But if I sell the BMW I have to have something that seats 6 in decent comfort.
Summarizing what others have already written:

First choice is a full-size van, E-350 with 7.3L diesel engine, or GM 3500 with the Isusu diesel engine design (newer than about 2003?). Ford offered the diesel engine in the Econoline vans for several years, but not recently. GM still offers the diesel engine in the current full-size 3500 vans. So if you're looking for an older vehicle, try to find a 2000 to 2003 E-350 with the 7.3L diesel engine. (I would not buy a van with the 2003-up 6.0L diesel engine).

Ignore the Ford and GM half-ton and 3/4-ton vans. They don't have enough payload capacity to haul your crew plus the hitch weight of a decent-size travel trailer. So Ford E-350 or GM 3500 only. I'm a diesel fan, so I would want a diesel.

If a van turns you off, then my second choice would be a 2000 thru 2003 Excursion with the 7.3L diesel engine. But those wonderful towing machines are very much in demand, so you won't find a nice one for less than $10,000, and most of them go for over $15,000, even though the newest ones are over 10 years old and with over 150,000 miles on the clock.

Excursion with the gas-hog 6.8L V-10 engines were available through about the 2006 model year. Wonderful rig if you don't mind buying lots of gas. Don't consider an Excursion with the 5.4L V8 gas engine. The 5.4L was a good engine for a half ton pickup, but not enough oomph for an Excursion or SuperDuty pickup.

Third choice would be GM Suburban/Yukon XL 2500. Don't even look at a normal 1500 model - you'll be overloaded. The shorter Tahoe/Yukon doesn't come in a 2500 model, so ignore those. Even with the 2500, you'll have to watch weights because of the lament about large SUVs: You can either haul a wagon full of people or a small travel trailer, but not both at the same time without being overloaded.
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Old 10-06-2013, 08:09 PM   #28
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Just of curiosity I checked 07 Mercedes GL. Looks like around $15000. It sits 7. Payload is rated very conservatively, you are likely to be ok of your kids are small. You can sell your bmw, have your cake and eat it too. R class is even better.
ML sits only five. Mine pulls 5800 lb 26 footer like a dream. We have 1 child and have plenty of payload capacity to spare.
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