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Old 02-10-2011, 02:10 PM   #1
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5th wheel towing?

Hey guys, my truck is a 2006 ford f 250 4 by 4 crew cab. it came with a B & W pop up ball hitch ( for gooseneck). I bought a 2011 palomino puma 356 QLB touy hauler( going to pick it up when its finished being built). I plan to buy the B & W 5th wheel companion hitch. What is the max turn ( in degrees) i will be able to do ? the truck is a short 6.5 foot bed. Does anyone ever need to do a 90 degree turn? I know they make a extension for the front 5th wheel pin box, should i buy that? anyone have one of those? comments?
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Old 02-10-2011, 03:19 PM   #2
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Recommend you get a sliding FW hitch, as your turn angle will be limited with a short bed and a regular FW hitch. This will allow you the tight turn angles w/o damaging your rear window or trailer (expensive mistake if it happens).
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Old 02-10-2011, 03:48 PM   #3
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1st you need to check your trailer glvw and then check your truck gvw. If your truck can legally tow the truck and if it is a short bed THEN you will need a slider. An 8ft bed and the new 5vr caps will allow a 90 turn.
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Old 02-10-2011, 04:18 PM   #4
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my truck is rated to tow 16,000lbs, trailer only weighs 10,000. I am going to buy the B & W companion 5th wheel hitch and a RV5 extension. has anyone on this forum done this? comments?
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1st you need to check your trailer glvw and then check your truck gvw. If your truck can legally tow the truck and if it is a short bed THEN you will need a slider. An 8ft bed and the new 5vr caps will allow a 90 turn.
Fred
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Old 02-10-2011, 05:41 PM   #5
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I have the super slide hitch as I turn the hitch extends and when I straighten it comes back. Some hitches require you get out and unlock them so they can extend, not to good in the rain or freezing rain. Check them out.
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Old 02-10-2011, 06:16 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aspeyrer View Post
Hey guys, my truck is a 2006 ford f 250 4 by 4 crew cab. it came with a B & W pop up ball hitch ( for gooseneck). I bought a 2011 palomino puma 356 QLB touy hauler( going to pick it up when its finished being built). I plan to buy the B & W 5th wheel companion hitch. What is the max turn ( in degrees) i will be able to do ? the truck is a short 6.5 foot bed. Does anyone ever need to do a 90 degree turn? I know they make a extension for the front 5th wheel pin box, should i buy that? anyone have one of those? comments?
Without a slider, about 60 degrees of turn. You can do a 90 degree turn only if you slide the hitch back. Don't ask me how I know.
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Old 02-10-2011, 10:45 PM   #7
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Check with your dealer, some new 5ers are now designed with short-bed trucks in mind. The most noticeable thing is concave front corners to allow tighter turns. It should be highlighted in sales literature if it has this design.
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Old 02-11-2011, 02:30 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by aspeyrer View Post
my truck is rated to tow 16,000lbs, trailer only weighs 10,000. I am going to buy the B & W companion 5th wheel hitch and a RV5 extension. has anyone on this forum done this? comments?
IMHO, you need to check your numbers...the GW of your trailer is 14,600...that 10k you see is empty weight. Also, I think you'll find that 16k tow rating is a bit misleading. Your real tow capacity is the GCWR minus the weight of the truck when ready to tow. I have a dually that would be maxed out with that trailer. Check the cargo capacity located on the Tire and Loading Information sticker on the frame on the driver's side. It will give you the actual cargo capacity for that truck. A typical Ford 4x4 F250 PSD will have less than 2500# of CC...that's less than the empty pin weight of that 5th wheel...before you add passengers, weight of the hitch, tools, etc.
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Old 02-12-2011, 08:47 AM   #9
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Okay Bill, tow capacity is GCWR ( 23,000lbs staed in the ford owners manual) minus the weight of the truck ( truck weighs between 7500 to 8000. 23,000 minus 8,000 =15,000lbs. the trailer dry weighs 9200lbs, i think i may load 2,000lbs of gear into the trailer, so total 11,200lbs. that still gives me 3,800 lbs to spare. and thats me doing it your way, your math. yes my truck will tow this trailer.


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Originally Posted by hooverbill View Post
IMHO, you need to check your numbers...the GW of your trailer is 14,600...that 10k you see is empty weight. Also, I think you'll find that 16k tow rating is a bit misleading. Your real tow capacity is the GCWR minus the weight of the truck when ready to tow. I have a dually that would be maxed out with that trailer. Check the cargo capacity located on the Tire and Loading Information sticker on the frame on the driver's side. It will give you the actual cargo capacity for that truck. A typical Ford 4x4 F250 PSD will have less than 2500# of CC...that's less than the empty pin weight of that 5th wheel...before you add passengers, weight of the hitch, tools, etc.
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Old 02-12-2011, 09:07 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by aspeyrer View Post
my truck is rated to tow 16,000lbs, trailer only weighs 10,000.
There is a big fallacy in the ratings here. The 16,000# tow rating is a MAXIMUM and read the foot note....You are not to exceed, GVWR, GCWR or GAWR. The rating is based on a base mode truck...no option, no passenger, no cargo and no hitch.

Next issue is a 3/4 ton truck will be limited by the GVWR of the truck. If in fact you could to a 16,000# 5er, the pin weight will be around 3200# which will be way more than a 3/4 ton truck can carry. With a 10,000# trailer, your pin weight will be around 2,000#, which may be doable with a 3/4 ton truck...depending on how it is loaded.

On edit, your trailer is not estimated at 11,200# so your pin weight would be around 2250#. What is thw GVWR of the truck? Base don a weight of 8000# plus the 2250 pin weight, your GVWR needs to be at least 10,250#. If the truck is 7500# plus 2250, you need a GVWR higher than 9750#. These are rough numbers and you really need to get the truck weighed to know how close you are to over loading the truck.

You need to weigh the truck in travel load with passenger, cargo and such and add 200# for a hitch.

GVWR -loaded truck = max loaded trailer pin weight.
GCWR - loaded truck = max loaded trailer weight.

On the question of the hitch, you need to see if the trailer was designed with the corners cut back to accommodate the trailer and the short bed. Lots of folks tow with the short bed trucks, and get by. Others wind up with a goonie on the corner of the cab, or the trailer or a broken out rear window.

To be safe, a slider hitch could be used. Pullrite makes an automatic slider. A manual slider is a pain.

As for how far you can turn with out hitting the cab, you will need to hitch up and make the turn and see how far with out hitting the cab.

As for getting the cab at a 90 degree angle to the trailer, I think I have only had to do that a couple of times getting into a tight spot.

Ken
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Old 02-12-2011, 10:02 AM   #11
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thanks Ken, the GVWR on the door sticker is 10,000lbs. my truck dry weight stated by ford is 6800lbs. so i think the pin weight will be okay. hindsight: i should have bought a F 350 crew cab 4 by 4 dually or F 450 crew cab 4 by 4 dually, always better to have more than you need. my truck will tow this 5th wheel fine and it will not be overloaded.

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Originally Posted by TXiceman View Post
There is a big fallacy in the ratings here. The 16,000# tow rating is a MAXIMUM and read the foot note....You are not to exceed, GVWR, GCWR or GAWR. The rating is based on a base mode truck...no option, no passenger, no cargo and no hitch.

Next issue is a 3/4 ton truck will be limited by the GVWR of the truck. If in fact you could to a 16,000# 5er, the pin weight will be around 3200# which will be way more than a 3/4 ton truck can carry. With a 10,000# trailer, your pin weight will be around 2,000#, which may be doable with a 3/4 ton truck...depending on how it is loaded.

On edit, your trailer is not estimated at 11,200# so your pin weight would be around 2250#. What is thw GVWR of the truck? Base don a weight of 8000# plus the 2250 pin weight, your GVWR needs to be at least 10,250#. If the truck is 7500# plus 2250, you need a GVWR higher than 9750#. These are rough numbers and you really need to get the truck weighed to know how close you are to over loading the truck.

You need to weigh the truck in travel load with passenger, cargo and such and add 200# for a hitch.

GVWR -loaded truck = max loaded trailer pin weight.
GCWR - loaded truck = max loaded trailer weight.

On the question of the hitch, you need to see if the trailer was designed with the corners cut back to accommodate the trailer and the short bed. Lots of folks tow with the short bed trucks, and get by. Others wind up with a goonie on the corner of the cab, or the trailer or a broken out rear window.

To be safe, a slider hitch could be used. Pullrite makes an automatic slider. A manual slider is a pain.

As for how far you can turn with out hitting the cab, you will need to hitch up and make the turn and see how far with out hitting the cab.

As for getting the cab at a 90 degree angle to the trailer, I think I have only had to do that a couple of times getting into a tight spot.

Ken
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Old 02-12-2011, 03:00 PM   #12
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Okay Bill, tow capacity is GCWR ( 23,000lbs staed in the ford owners manual) minus the weight of the truck ( truck weighs between 7500 to 8000. 23,000 minus 8,000 =15,000lbs. the trailer dry weighs 9200lbs, i think i may load 2,000lbs of gear into the trailer, so total 11,200lbs. that still gives me 3,800 lbs to spare. and thats me doing it your way, your math. yes my truck will tow this trailer.
I get it that you are going to tow this trailer, however, you should at least look at realistic numbers. The formula is GCWR minus the weight of the truck WHEN READY TO TOW. That means a loaded truck with pin weight, etc. The GW of your trailer (according to the web site) is 14,600, average pin weight is 20%...BTW, most of us are at GW...20% equals 2920#, which, alone, exceeds the cargo capacity of your truck. Did you check out that sticker Tire/Loading Info sticker...you won't like what it says.

This is my last post on this thread.
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Old 02-12-2011, 04:13 PM   #13
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Bill, 14,600lbs is fully loaded to the max for this trailer, dry trailer weight is 9200lbs, i might put another 2,000lbs in the toy area, so thats 11,200, 20% of 11,200lbs is 2240lbs, that pin weight is a little heavy for my truck, my truck weighs 6800lbs dry, so loaded truck about 7500lbs plus pin weight = 9740lbs, that is still almost 250lbs less than the GVWR of 10,000.
GCWR 23,000lbs with the trailer at 11,200 plus GVWR of 9740. comes to a total of 20,940lbs thats still 2060lbs less than the max. Yes my truck will pull this load and not be over loaded, once again by your math.
Would a F 350 dually of F 450 dually pull this trailer better, safer, with more muscle to spare, yes, but for now my F 250 will do the job.

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Originally Posted by hooverbill View Post
I get it that you are going to tow this trailer, however, you should at least look at realistic numbers. The formula is GCWR minus the weight of the truck WHEN READY TO TOW. That means a loaded truck with pin weight, etc. The GW of your trailer (according to the web site) is 14,600, average pin weight is 20%...BTW, most of us are at GW...20% equals 2920#, which, alone, exceeds the cargo capacity of your truck. Did you check out that sticker Tire/Loading Info sticker...you won't like what it says.

This is my last post on this thread.
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Old 06-08-2011, 12:01 AM   #14
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Bill, 14,600lbs is fully loaded to the max for this trailer, dry trailer weight is 9200lbs, i might put another 2,000lbs in the toy area, so thats 11,200, 20% of 11,200lbs is 2240lbs, that pin weight is a little heavy for my truck, my truck weighs 6800lbs dry, so loaded truck about 7500lbs plus pin weight = 9740lbs, that is still almost 250lbs less than the GVWR of 10,000.
GCWR 23,000lbs with the trailer at 11,200 plus GVWR of 9740. comes to a total of 20,940lbs thats still 2060lbs less than the max. Yes my truck will pull this load and not be over loaded, once again by your math.
Would a F 350 dually of F 450 dually pull this trailer better, safer, with more muscle to spare, yes, but for now my F 250 will do the job.
I had the same thoughts, after checking with dot, here in ca, i have an 05 dodge 2500 which has a towing capacity of 13500 or so, the only thing that is for is the manufacturer, the only thing i have to worry about is if you go over 10k on a bumper pull or 15k on a fifth wheel you have to get a non commercial class a license, other than that i can pull a 15k trailer if i want legally
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