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Old 05-29-2010, 09:44 PM   #1
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Fifth Wheel Toy Hauler

I have been looking at 18000 gross weight toy haulers, what tow vehicle should I be lookf at? I purchased a dodge diesel 2500 4x4 long bed and was told that it would pull what I wanted.
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Old 05-30-2010, 06:58 AM   #2
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A Dodge 2010 3500 dually is rated to pull 17,000 gvrw and the CC 5500 is 18300 when properly equipped. The 2500 is only rated at 13400 max check Dodge Towing/Payload Comparison | Dodge.com for ratings. Big trailers need BIG trucks, the 2500 will tow the trailer but your insurance will not cover any claims because of overloading.
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Old 05-30-2010, 07:56 AM   #3
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irs007, welcome to iRV2. I hope you find all of the information helpful.

I am afraid that you have run into the typical RV/truck sales problem. Mosr of these sales type do not have a clue about weights.

A 5er that weighs 18,000\# could have a pin weight close to 3600#. This will be well above what you can tow within your trucks rating. First two things to do are load the truck with normal camping gear and passengers and head to the truck scales and get axle weights and total weight. Add to this 200# for the 5er hitch. Next is to forget dry weights and tow ratings.

Tow ratings for trucks are based on a base model, no passengers other than a 150# driver, no accessories, no options and no hitch. The dry weight on the trailer means any item listed as ana option is not included in that weight.

Now find in the owners manual the GCWR for your specific engine, cab and axle ratio.

Now look on the drivers door jamb for the GVWR and the front and the rear GAWR.

GCWR - loaded truck = Maximum loaded trailer weight.

GVWR - loaded truck = Maximum laded trailer pin weight.

While looking at the numbers check your axle weights as well.

The problem with a 3/4 ton truck and a large 5er is you will reach your GVWR or the rear GAWR well before you reach the trucks GCWR.

Since a 5er runs about 20% of the trailers GVWR for the pin weight you can pull a larger bumper pull since the tongue weight typically runs about 10 to 14% of the trailer GVWR.

So you need to read the fine print on the so called Tow Ratings on the trucks...there is a note that you are not to exceed any of the trucks other ratings. A 18000# (loaded) 5er is pretty well into 1 ton dually territory.

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but it is better to find it now rather than later. For your truck you realistically need to look at 5ers closer to 32' in length.

Ken

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Old 05-30-2010, 09:58 PM   #4
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I think the only 1 ton truck rated to tow an 18K lb 5er is Ford Super Duty. IMO that is a barely adequate towing truck for your proposed trailer. When you read tow/hauling ratings keep in mind most only include a 150# driver, 1/4 tank fuel, no aftermarket stuff, hitches, or camping gear.
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Old 06-05-2010, 11:17 AM   #5
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welcome to irv2

and who ever sold u the truck did a good job of selling the truck but a bad job of selling the truck. meaning that he sold a truck ya for him and y bought a truck that dosent come close to "pulling anyting u want"

is there a toy hauler (TH) that u can pull w that truck sure. but its not the 40' triple axle THs that u r looking at.

like said a 1 ton dually would be hard pressed to tow that.

as with all single rear wheel trucks u run out of payload real fast.bc the tires are usually the limiting factor.

ck your tire and axle ratings and start there. also use the great info given in previous post.
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Old 06-10-2010, 06:12 PM   #6
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if your asking about toy hauler then check out the Cyclone:
2011 CYCLONE 3950 RV FIFTH WHEEL, NEW INTERIOR!: eBay Motors (item 370392053994 end time Jun-12-10 11:25:54 PDT)
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Old 06-16-2010, 03:02 PM   #7
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get a f450 for that 18k trailer
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Old 06-19-2010, 05:43 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shipwreck1 View Post
Kinda funny, check out option #17.
This is an excellent example of pin weight. The website lists a pin weight of 2995# at a dry weight of 13,934#, which calculates to 21.5% pin weight. Extrapolate that to GVW of 18,000# X 21.5% = 3.870# pin weight at GVW.
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Old 08-20-2010, 08:19 PM   #9
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"This is an excellent example of pin weight. The website lists a pin weight of 2995# at a dry weight of 13,934#, which calculates to 21.5% pin weight. Extrapolate that to GVW of 18,000# X 21.5% = 3.870# pin weight at GVW."

I like your theory, however if cyclone builds their trailers how keystone builds theirs.. Then what you are looking at is a *preloaded* pin weight from the factory. Meaning they intentionally build their trailers with weight forward so that when you add the weight of your toys (which is inherently heavier than typical camping gear) to the garage area which is positioned mostly aft of the aft axle it will balance itself out, and your pin weight will remain close to the same as it did empty from the factory.

Meaning they are expecting you to load heavier in the garage because of the type of equipment that is typically loaded into a toyhauler. as opposed to an even distribution of weight in a standard homestyle fifth wheel
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Old 08-20-2010, 09:37 PM   #10
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OK, so maybe the pin will get a bit lighter if you load a lot of heavy tows. So now you have an 18,000# trailer (at max weight) and a 7500# to 8000# truck. Add 18000 to 7500 and you need a truck rated to tow 25,500#. The Ford F350 DRW properly equipped is at its limits and you need to be looking at an F450/550. A maxed out Dodge 3500 DRW will max out around 24500#.

I'd be inclined to take the truck back and tell the sales man he is an idiot.

You seriously need to pull in your sights for a smaller trailer.

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Old 08-21-2010, 01:25 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by TXiceman View Post
OK, so maybe the pin will get a bit lighter if you load a lot of heavy tows. So now you have an 18,000# trailer (at max weight) and a 7500# to 8000# truck. Add 18000 to 7500 and you need a truck rated to tow 25,500#. The Ford F350 DRW properly equipped is at its limits and you need to be looking at an F450/550. A maxed out Dodge 3500 DRW will max out around 24500#.

I'd be inclined to take the truck back and tell the sales man he is an idiot.

You seriously need to pull in your sights for a smaller trailer.

Ken
Not to mention if youre GVWR is over 25k you need a CDL Which is another issue entireley..

However unless youre loading sand rails or double stacking four wheelers in the cargo area or carrying four or five harley's youre more reasonably looking at a trailer weight of around 16 or 16,5 and if you configure it properly to distribute the weight evenly you COULD get away with pulling it behind a 3/4 ton truck. that does NOT mean it is the best or even an ideal option. However if you tow it from your house to the dunes once or twice a year and you dont have a reasonable need for an F450 then I would say you would be fine.

I have a Fuzion 398 and I tow it with an F250 Super Duty. My trailer weight fully loaded is a little more than 16k and I have about a 2400lb pin weight (i've got weight tickets) I've upgraded the brakes on my truck, and installed overload springs and airbags over the rear axle as well as purchased 12ply E range tires. The trailer itself has brakes on all three axles, and I have a good trailer brake controller. Now this might not be the ideal setup for going on a six month long trip across the United States but for the occasional run to talladegga or daytona beach my truck pulls it just fine, and Im not overloading any of the tires, axles or hitch weight restrictions. It all depends on what you plan on doing with your new trailer and truck.

At any rate when you do get a new trailer its a good idea to load it how you want it, and take it down to a flying J or Pilot or Love's scale that will give you axle weights at each axle so you can verify your load plan, and shift items around to Ensure you are within your trailer/trucks specific loading requirements.
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Old 09-14-2010, 11:47 PM   #12
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I was wrong, the 2011 GM 1T dually, Duramax trucks are rated for a 21,500 5er.
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