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Old 08-27-2013, 09:41 PM   #29
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And then there was the chinese st SPARE tire that blew up in its mount under the trailer. It was on either this forum or the other one. Real confidence builder.
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Old 08-29-2013, 07:49 PM   #30
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an even worse problem

fyi I love the firestones BUT, I have a rim that has a leak. im hoping my extended warranty will take care of the defective rim. a response on the keystone forum indicated that the aluminum rims have flaws that can lead to leakage or possible rim failure. he worked with cast aluminum and iron. if they start giving problems like the tires the raptor will have stamped steel wheels
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Old 10-01-2013, 08:22 AM   #31
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I am new to the 5th wheel/toy hauler world and just purchased a 2014 Cyclone 4100 with 3 axels. I wonder how many of these tire failures were due to under inflation and/or over speed conditions. It is not well know nor does the dealer tell you that ST tires are limited to 65 mph at max air pressure.

Last weekend we were camping and a rental class C rig next to our was being serviced by a mobile tire repair guy with not one but two flat tires. I ask him about his experience with 5th wheel ST tires and he stated that with 3 axles I was allot better off than some with large units and only 2 axles.

I don't know what I don't know (which is probably allot) but I am headed to Key Largo next week from east TN and I am not going to replace my OEM ST tires. I have already put about 1000 miles on them with no problems so far. The are all at 80 psi and I am well under my capacity for my toy hauler since I am not carrying anything in the garage. I also am careful to max out at about 63 mph to stay below the speed rating. My unit is a 2014 and a fast selling model so I doubt it sat around for long on the dealers lot.

Sooo fingers crossed and some might say head in sand but I am going to give it a shot. Prayer might be in order...... LoL
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Old 10-01-2013, 08:40 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by csdavis62 View Post
....I am headed to Key Largo next week from east TN and I am not going to replace my OEM ST tires. I have already put about 1000 miles on them with no problems so far. The are all at 80 psi and I am well under my capacity for my toy hauler since I am not carrying anything in the garage. I also am careful to max out at about 63 mph to stay below the speed rating.....
Funny how this tire thing works - I never had a problem either until I heard this BANG, then I had a BIG problem!!

In all seriousness, in our 20+ years of RVing, I've had 3 catastrophic tire failures with 5th wheels. In each case, the tire pressure had been checked the morning we pulled out and the speed cruising on the Interstate was around 63 MPH. One failure happened within 15 miles of departing the campground, the second within 50 miles and the third probably 150 miles from the RV storage lot. In each case, the tire manufacturer inspected the carcass of the failed tire and replaced 1 or more tires (all tires on the 5th wheel in 2 cases) as well as paying for the damage (up to $2500) caused by the tread separations. On two of our 5th wheels, I upgraded the tires substantially and never had another problem; we traded the third 5th wheel soon after the manufacturer had replaced all the tires.

My message - just because you haven't had problems, don't think you won't have problems. Been there, done that, got the t-shirt.

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Old 10-02-2013, 07:53 AM   #33
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csdavis62, congrats on your Cyclone 4100. I have the same in a 2013. I carry around 2K in the garage between a 4010 Kawasaki Mule and a full size Weber gas grill. I only drive 65 but I don't think you should drive the tire's max speed. I replaced my tires before heading out on the 1st trip. Most of my travels are to get to an event and getting stranded for hours is not an option. Spending $2000 on a new rig was a hard pill to swallow. Two reasons, all the reports of blowouts on the Heartland website, and comments by the tech during my PDI. He showed me a new rig that that was in for $5K in repairs. I went with Michelin XPS Ribs which have a 120 MPH rating. I have 8500 mi on them already and about to add another 3200 over the next 5 weeks.
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Old 10-02-2013, 02:18 PM   #34
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csdavis62, congrats on your Cyclone 4100. I have the same in a 2013. I carry around 2K in the garage between a 4010 Kawasaki Mule and a full size Weber gas grill. I only drive 65 but I don't think you should drive the tire's max speed. I replaced my tires before heading out on the 1st trip. Most of my travels are to get to an event and getting stranded for hours is not an option. Spending $2000 on a new rig was a hard pill to swallow. Two reasons, all the reports of blowouts on the Heartland website, and comments by the tech during my PDI. He showed me a new rig that that was in for $5K in repairs. I went with Michelin XPS Ribs which have a 120 MPH rating. I have 8500 mi on them already and about to add another 3200 over the next 5 weeks.
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I have a question... Did your 2013 4100 come with the Powermax STR ST235/80R16-E tires? Their web site indicates that they have a load rating of 3640 lbs which is quite a bit higher than the XPS rating of 3042 lbs. The reason I ask is I heard that the "newer" tires being used on these larger Toy Haulers were upgraded and better manufactured than some of the problem tires in the past. Maybe this is wishful thinking
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Old 10-02-2013, 04:55 PM   #35
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I have a question... Did your 2013 4100 come with the Powermax STR ST235/80R16-E tires? Their web site indicates that they have a load rating of 3640 lbs which is quite a bit higher than the XPS rating of 3042 lbs. The reason I ask is I heard that the "newer" tires being used on these larger Toy Haulers were upgraded and better manufactured than some of the problem tires in the past. Maybe this is wishful thinking
Yes those are the tires that came on my rig and are now laying on a pallet. Pick up a Michelin XPS and a Towmax, and tell me the Towmax is rated for more weight than the LT. The LT is a commercial tire, has a full steel encasement, and weighs 50% again more than the ST. Do a search and read about all the recent incidents on the Towmax. You can then make your own decision.
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Old 10-03-2013, 10:35 AM   #36
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Yes those are the tires that came on my rig and are now laying on a pallet. Pick up a Michelin XPS and a Towmax, and tell me the Towmax is rated for more weight than the LT. The LT is a commercial tire, has a full steel encasement, and weighs 50% again more than the ST. Do a search and read about all the recent incidents on the Towmax. You can then make your own decision.
I was afraid you were going to tell me that

I really don't want to drop $2K for tires for a new trailer........
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Old 10-03-2013, 10:57 AM   #37
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I did the same when brand new. It's worth the piece of mind. Scotty is right about the weight. My LT tires with no rims weighed more than my Towmax tires while still mounted! You can also go with heavier load range G tires if you are worried about the XPS's lower rating. Just check the stamp on the back of your rims to make sure they can handle the 110 psi that the load range G need to achieve their 3750 rating. Since your rig is new, I'm betting they will be.

You can always sell your take offs on craigslist to recoup a couple $$. Mine went to a contractor who wanted them for his dump trailer that was always loosing tires at the dump.
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Old 10-04-2013, 06:47 AM   #38
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You can always sell your take offs on craigslist to recoup a couple $$. Mine went to a contractor who wanted them for his dump trailer that was always loosing tires at the dump.
Yep, I just traded mine for some concrete labor. I needed some help pouring some piers for my RV carport and they needed some new tires for their equipment trailer.
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Old 10-08-2013, 09:52 AM   #39
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After much research I decided to not take the risk with the OEM Towmax tires as we are leaving for Key Largo this Friday. Numerous pictures of extensive damage to OP's 5th wheels motivated me to bite the bullet and order six (yes 6 - ouch) Bridgestone Duravis LT235/85-R16 R500's for my Cyclone 4100 King....

From what I found doing online research they are a commercial grade rib tire which is a viable yet less expensive option to the Michelin XPS Rib's. However, before I start a religious war over XPS Rib VS anything that is not a XPS Rib... I am NOT saying, implying, or otherwise indicating, they are equal or close to as good of a tire. My research indicated they were a decent option that will meet my needs in a much safer/better way than what I have today. I simply did not have the appetite to spend almost 2X's what the Bridgestones cost to move up to the Michelin's. If money was no object XPS it would have been... According to the specs I found the weight on the Duravis is 60 lbs per tire so by that measure they at least have about the same amount of material in them as the Michelins...

It is a disappointment to me that most of the manufacturers choose profit over safety when selecting something as critical as tires for high end 5th wheels/toy haulers. I mean really I paid $177.91 RETAIL per tire at Costco for a much more substantial tire than the infamous ExplodeMax they choose to install.

Just for fun let's assume the difference wholesale was even $100 cost per tire. Is it worth the reputation hit and risk to life and limb to save $600 on a $96K list price camper??? That is .00625% of the suggested manufacturer list price. Instead I end up with 6 rope swings I don't need and in the end will end up $1100.00 lighter in the wallet.
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Old 10-08-2013, 08:25 PM   #40
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OK I am not a tire engineer nor do I play one on TV but I do know the difference between something that is well made and junk. I pulled the 6 sets of wheels and tires off my Cyclone and the first thing I found was super cheap lug nuts that were no where near evenly torqued. SO I downloaded the manual and they state on pg 30 that you needed to "stop every 50 miles for the first 200 miles and re-torque the lug nuts. What?? have you ever heard something so nonsensical? Could it be that they used the absolute cheapest lug nuts money could buy and half of them were cracked and split? Un friggin believable I says to myself.

Then I turn my attention to the tires. I have put maybe 700 miles on the unit and several of the tires already showed significant wear. Edges of the tread pattern were missing chunks and ground down visabily.... Now I know it was towed from Indiana to east TN but common man.... The replacement Bridgestone Duravis tires easily outweighed the Blowmaxes while still on the rim. None of them had a single weight so had not been balanced at the factory. Wheel nuts again torqued by.... Oh yea not torqued at all. BTW I bought 48 STEEL LUG NUTS from Costco for (stand by Thor cheap ass....) .97 cents a piece RETAIL in addition to almost $1200 in tires and labor for a unit with less than 2K miles for sure.

Once off the rims you get the full affect of how cheap these tires really are. The side walls are not economy car tire thick let alone thick enough to carry over 3400 pounds each. Next to the Duravis commercial rib tires the Towmaxes looked and felt like bicycle tires. I was going to try and sell them on Craigslist and told Costco to keep the crap I would not sell them to a terrorist I have more integrity than that.

If you buy one of these units INSIST THAT THEY REPLACE THE CRAP TIRES THEY ARE SHIPPED WITH. If I had know then what I know now this would have been a deal killer. Thor ought to be sued for endangering the general public because they are putting lives in danger with the crap they are passing off as tires on their products.

Can you tell I am pissed?? I have a wife and 3 kids I have been towing this disaster waiting to happen around with and I am not happy that they could care less......

Never again will I trust one of these bastard companies to do the right thing just because they should.......

Disgraceful.........
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Old 10-09-2013, 06:12 AM   #41
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I downloaded the manual and they state on pg 30 that you needed to "stop every 50 miles for the first 200 miles and re-torque the lug nuts. What?? have you ever heard something so nonsensical?
Well......
Ford manual: On vehicles equipped with dual rear wheels, retighten the wheel lug nuts to the specified torque at 100 miles (160 km), and again at 500 miles (800 km) of new vehicle operation and after any wheel disturbance (tire rotation, change flat tire, wheel removal,etc.)

So I can see a trailer at 50-200 miles.
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Old 10-09-2013, 06:29 AM   #42
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My goodness that was a healthy discussion that went far left. I appreciate the information regarding the issue of tire failure. I can only imagine the damage when a tire explodes. I recently bought a MH and look forward to what I hope are many safe miles. Thanks for the insight all. Have a good day and drive safe!
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