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Old 04-27-2009, 12:19 PM   #1
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Converter problem

I have a 30 foot Sprinter pull behind. I am having coverter problems. It is a Magnetek Power Plus. On the upper cover it say series 7300 model 7345 and on the lower section it say series 6300A Model 6345. Its 45 amp 7.8 amps 120 vac 12 vdc. The converter is not charging the battery and when I unplug the shoreline I have no 12 volt power in the camper. Now is were it gets trickey. My water heater will not light without 12 volt. If I put a battery charger on the battery my water heater will light? If I put a test light on the 12 volt leads inside the camper the light lights up. If I put the test light on just the 12 volt leads coming out of the camper to the battery the test light does not light? I know I need to replace the battery as it will not take or hold a charge but why am I not getting a reading on the leads coming out of this camper to charge the new battery and why don't I have 12 lights when I am unhooked from the shoreline?

Do I need a new converter or is there a fix?
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Old 04-27-2009, 03:26 PM   #2
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First let me welcome you to iRV2.com. We hope you continue to visit with us and share your experiences.

Here is my take on this.

When the shore line is plugged in your 12V lights will works as the converter is providing the 12V to the interior circuits as well a trying to charge the battery. Your battery charger is doing the same thing. The converter will not provide a charge to the battery with only a battery charger connected; the converter must have 120V input to it.

Admittedly your battery is bad, probably shorted, and will not take a charge. Thus it will not light anything on its own.

Replace the battery and see where you are at. At this point I think your dead battery is causing your problems.
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Old 04-27-2009, 08:25 PM   #3
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Well, a few answers to your "Do I need a new converter"

That model converter should have what is called a "Reverse Polarity" Fuse, this is either one or two 30 amp fuses more than likely, if there are two replace BOTH OF THEM. (Check them first) these fuses may have blown or may just may not be properly seated. If they are blown you can get new ones at any auto store, if they show good on a multi-meter set to OHMS (Should show zero across the leads) then just re-seat them

Second, i have a tendency to say "Magna-Junk' the 7300 serries under that name is, as I recall, a single stage converter/charger/battery boiler

The unit has two independent parts. one charges the battery the other provides power to the 12 volt systems when you have shore power

A Progressive Dynamics 9200 series can be used to replace it or a Xantrex TrueCharge XADC Both of these are 3-stage converter/chargers. they have one section that both provides power to the RV's 12 volt system and charges the battery, They charge faster, (Bulk stage) then slow down to finish charging (Absorption stage) then switch to "Float" mode so as to not over charge My Interstate U-2200's are now 4 years old and I've added water once a year, just once.

you can get information on the upgrade (not to mention the parts) from randy at Best Converter In fact for the instructions just scroll down to the "Extra Info" frame on the left
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Old 04-28-2009, 07:14 AM   #4
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Thank you for taking the time to help me. I have had the cover off of the converter and I do not see any fuses? If you can point me in the direction of where they are that would be a big help.

Thanks
Jerry
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Old 04-28-2009, 08:25 AM   #5
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I checked all the visible fuses on the circuit board and all the fuses are good
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Old 04-28-2009, 04:11 PM   #6
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The first thing to do is check with the trailer plugged into shore power whether or not you have 110 Volts AC at the converter plug. You can check this by plugging any 110 volt appliance into that plug or use a volt meter. Once satisfied you have 110 volts there, remove the converter plug from the socket and disconnect the red ( or maybe black wire) that goes to the + side of your converter.Be careful, don't short it to ground! Plug the converter back in and check for +12 volts at the output of the converter with the leads between the negative side (white wire) and + side of the converter. You should have about 13.5 volts or so. Now reconnect the + lead back onto the converter and check power between the battery posts. You again should read about 13.5 volts. If you have no 110 volts AC power at the plug, check the 110 side of things... the breaker or even the shore power and related wiring. If no output with 110 and the converter plugged in and all fuses are good... you have a bad converter. If you have a good 13.5 volts output but no battery voltage, check wiring between converter and battery. Now take your battery out of the trailer and charge it with a battery charger for 24 hours. Does it hold a charge? If yes, go have the battery load tested. Depending on load test... replace your battery or not. My guess is you have a bad converter. That, over time, allowed the battery to go flat. After a battery is at less then 50% charge for a month, you can forget the battery. It probably died too.

Try starting up the water heater with the battery out and disconnected from shore power. if not, install a good battery and try again. I know that the newer water heaters are spark assisted to ignite LP by +12 volts.
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Old 04-28-2009, 05:31 PM   #7
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Thanks Paul, I was at the camper today and I put a new fully charged battery in. Unhooked the shoreline and no 12 volt power inside the camper. I hooked the shoreline back up and I have 12volt power to the lights and all the 120 volt appliances work ie, TV, Outlets, and so fourth. With the fully charged battery hooked up I get a 12 volt back feed reading from the battery, this tells me there is nothing wrong between the converter and battery. Seems like when I unhook the shoreline the converter will not switch over to 12 volt. I always remembered hearing a click when I unplugged the shoreline in the past (That was the converter switching over to 12 volt). I do not hear that now either. I to am leaning towards a bad converter. If anyone else has any suggestions before I spend $250.00 it would be a big help. Like I said everything else is working fine its just that the converter will not switch over to 12 volt when the shoreline is unplugged.

Thanks Everyone who has offered assistance so far

Jerry
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Old 04-28-2009, 06:15 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K-Star View Post
First let me welcome you to iRV2.com. We hope you continue to visit with us and share your experiences.

Here is my take on this.

When the shore line is plugged in your 12V lights will works as the converter is providing the 12V to the interior circuits as well a trying to charge the battery. Your battery charger is doing the same thing. The converter will not provide a charge to the battery with only a battery charger connected; the converter must have 120V input to it.

Admittedly your battery is bad, probably shorted, and will not take a charge. Thus it will not light anything on its own.

Replace the battery and see where you are at. At this point I think your dead battery is causing your problems.
K-Star, I put a new battery in today and still no 12 volt lights inside the camper. When I plug the shore line back in I have 12 volt lights, and all 120 appliances work (tv, air conditioning) So I am back to square one. The converter is not putting out a 12 volt supply of power when the shoreline is unhooked. I am getting a back feed reading from the new battery into the converter so that tells me there is no problem between the converter and the battery. It tells me the converter is not putting out 12 volt to the battery or any lights when the shoreline is unplugged

Jerry
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Old 04-28-2009, 07:29 PM   #9
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The converter should only work when hooked up to shore power. Not when unplugged and there is no relay in the converter. It's either on or off depending on whether you are plugged into shore power. It is wired in parallel to the battery. When plugged into shore power the converter is on. Period. There is no switching on or off.
The other thing that confuses me is that you say there is 12 volts when the trailer is on shore power. A fully charged and new battery is 12.65 volts or very close to that. The converter on will be at least 13.6 volts but probably more like 14 volts. Have you actually measured your voltage with a volt meter? Your converter to charge the battery has to be somewhat higher then the nominal battery voltage. So, it should read when plugged in and the converter on near 14 volts. Because the battery and the converter are wired in parallel when reading battery voltage it will read the higher of either the battery or the converter. All 12 volt systems that run from the battery to the fuse block either have a fuse in that line or a small circuit breaker to prevent fire if that battery cable going to the fuse block gets shorted. The + lead from the converter either goes directly to the positive side of the battery or to the + fuse block. If it goes to the fuse block then the power generated by the converter would power up all your 12 volt systems when plugged in. If the fuse were blown then battery has no function at all and will not even charge plugged in or not. If that wire from your converter goes directly to the battery and the fuse is blown or the breaker is bad then, you would get nothing whether plugged in or not.

You need to measure voltage like I told you in the first post with a meter. Battery is always 12.65 volts charged WITH NO CONVERTER AND NO POWER DRAW. No higher then 12.65. Converter on = ALWAYS 13.6 VOLTS OR HIGHER.
So start by checking the 120 volts AC at the plug of the converter. If yes, then measure voltage at the output of the converter plugged into shore power with the + lead disconnected. It will read about 13.6 volts or higher if functioning, plugged into a working 120 volt outlet and all fuses good. Now, go measure your battery with the trailer unplugged at the battery terminals it will read 12.65 volts. No higher. Then go read+fuse block terminal. It should also read 12.65 volts but no higher. There might be a slight voltage drop from the battery to the fuse panel say 12.38 volts. If no voltage at fuse panel with trailer not plugged in there is a disconnect between the battery and the fuse panel. Probably either a fuse or a circuit breaker. My cell is 925-708-4671 and you can call until 9 pacific time if you are still having trouble.
-Paul R. Haller-
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Old 04-28-2009, 11:48 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Paul R. Haller View Post
The converter should only work when hooked up to shore power. Not when unplugged and there is no relay in the converter. It's either on or off depending on whether you are plugged into shore power. It is wired in parallel to the battery. When plugged into shore power the converter is on. Period. There is no switching on or off.
The other thing that confuses me is that you say there is 12 volts when the trailer is on shore power. A fully charged and new battery is 12.65 volts or very close to that. The converter on will be at least 13.6 volts but probably more like 14 volts. Have you actually measured your voltage with a volt meter? Your converter to charge the battery has to be somewhat higher then the nominal battery voltage. So, it should read when plugged in and the converter on near 14 volts. Because the battery and the converter are wired in parallel when reading battery voltage it will read the higher of either the battery or the converter. All 12 volt systems that run from the battery to the fuse block either have a fuse in that line or a small circuit breaker to prevent fire if that battery cable going to the fuse block gets shorted. The + lead from the converter either goes directly to the positive side of the battery or to the + fuse block. If it goes to the fuse block then the power generated by the converter would power up all your 12 volt systems when plugged in. If the fuse were blown then battery has no function at all and will not even charge plugged in or not. If that wire from your converter goes directly to the battery and the fuse is blown or the breaker is bad then, you would get nothing whether plugged in or not.

You need to measure voltage like I told you in the first post with a meter. Battery is always 12.65 volts charged WITH NO CONVERTER AND NO POWER DRAW. No higher then 12.65. Converter on = ALWAYS 13.6 VOLTS OR HIGHER.
So start by checking the 120 volts AC at the plug of the converter. If yes, then measure voltage at the output of the converter plugged into shore power with the + lead disconnected. It will read about 13.6 volts or higher if functioning, plugged into a working 120 volt outlet and all fuses good. Now, go measure your battery with the trailer unplugged at the battery terminals it will read 12.65 volts. No higher. Then go read+fuse block terminal. It should also read 12.65 volts but no higher. There might be a slight voltage drop from the battery to the fuse panel say 12.38 volts. If no voltage at fuse panel with trailer not plugged in there is a disconnect between the battery and the fuse panel. Probably either a fuse or a circuit breaker. My cell is 925-708-4671 and you can call until 9 pacific time if you are still having trouble.
-Paul R. Haller-
Paul, I understand how the converter works. When I am unplugged in the middle of the woods with no power source I should have power supplied to the camper by the 12 volt battery. The lights should work, the water heater should light, the water pump should run, the refrigerator should switch to gas and so on. I don't have that at this point. When I unplug the camper from a 30 amp power supply nothing works inside the camper. I am not good with electrical work but I do have enough sense and have owned enough campers that when ever I unplug from a power supply or the power goes out in the campground the battery takes over until the shoreline power is restored. Obviously something is not allowing the battery to kick in when there is no shoreline power. I have checked every fuse and every breaker in the camper with exception to looking underneath the camper for a breaker on the positive 12 volt line coming into the camper from the battery. I am on the East Coast in Northern Pa. We have the camper placed on a seasonal site in a local campground that is not far from my home. We keep it there for family visiting us and so we are sure everything is working before we go on trips. I will be there around 10:30 am Eastern time if you want to give me a call. I am off work and do not want to bother you with a phone call as I would not know if you would be at work or not, so please feel free to give me a call if you like. Other than that I think I will replace the converter. 570-470-7642 cell. I do appreciate your help.

Thanks
Jerry
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Old 04-29-2009, 10:34 AM   #11
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K-Star, I put a new battery in today and still no 12 volt lights inside the camper. When I plug the shore line back in I have 12 volt lights, and all 120 appliances work (tv, air conditioning) So I am back to square one. The converter is not putting out a 12 volt supply of power when the shoreline is unhooked. I am getting a back feed reading from the new battery into the converter so that tells me there is no problem between the converter and the battery. It tells me the converter is not putting out 12 volt to the battery or any lights when the shoreline is unplugged

Jerry
Jerry

First, the converter is there to convert 120V A/C to 12V D/C. If there is no 120V A/C input (shoreline unplugged) to the converter there will be NO 12V D/C output from the converter. When the shoreline is unplugged you are running solely off the battery.

Fro what you are explaining you have 12V when the shoreline is plugged in but not when unplugged. That tells me there is something preventing the 12V from the battery to the 12V appliances/lights. This may sound simplistic, but is there a battery disconnect switch anywhere that may be opened? Sounds simple but simple is sometimes overlooked.

To repeat what someone else already stated, check the output of the converter when plugged in. It should be > 13.5 volts. This test is to simply insure that the battery will be charged when plugged in.

As all the other obvious ideas seem to pan out, so now you need to get down to basic troubleshooting. With the shoreline unplugged take a measurement at the battery. If good, take measurements at various points working your way from the battery towards the appliances. Somewhere you are going to loose 12V and your problem will be between the last good test point and the one where voltage is lost. There is probably a fusible link or main fuse that is in line with the hot side on the 12V off of the battery. The trick is finding it.
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Old 04-29-2009, 01:57 PM   #12
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Paul and K-Star, I wanted to let you know we found the problem. It's kinda hard to explain but there was a jumper wire in the fuse panel that has been there since we bought the camper so I thought well it's there for a reason so I never took it out. I was at the camper today and found that when I take the jumper wire out the fuse holder that the other side was hooked to did not have 12 volts to it. It turned out to be a dead fuse socket when the jumper wire was removed. I then took a piece of wire and jumped from the + side to the other side of the fuse panel and bingo all the lights came on in the camper without having the shoreline hooked up. Come to find out the fuse circuit board has a bad fuse terminal on it and it will need to be replaced. I made a quick phone call to a RV dealer in our area and he has one. Cost $20.00 compared to $250 had I replaced the converter. All is good now. I want to thank everyone who tried to help me with this problem and for offering assistance and cell phone numbers to call if I needed help. Your a great bunch of people and I am glad to be part of iRV2, thanks again everyone! Happy Camping!!!

Jerry & Robin Korb
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Old 04-29-2009, 03:25 PM   #13
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GREAT NEWS, glad you found it and thanks for letting us know.
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Old 04-30-2009, 02:13 PM   #14
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Paul or anyone I have one more question. I have the circuit board on my converter replaced and it is working again. My question is, my battery is shot so I am going to buy a new one. I have a older Magnetex 7345 [IMG]file:///C:/Users/Jerry/AppData/Local/Temp/moz-screenshot-9.jpg[/IMG]converter, does the converter charge the battery all the time or does it shut down once the battery reaches full charge? If it does not shut down should I put a cut off switch on the battery so it is not charging all the time.


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