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Old 09-17-2012, 08:32 PM   #1
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Looking for some advice on a new TT purchase

We are new to the TT scene and in the market for a new TT. We have narrowed our search down to a few possible units. We are considering between the Keystone Sprinter, Keystone Laredo, Forrest River Flagstaff, and the Jayco Eagle. Any advice on these manufacturers and models would be greatly appreciated. We will be towing with a Toyota Tundra Dbl. Cab with a tow rating of 8300 lbs.

Thank you,
Steve & Lisa Markowitz
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Old 09-17-2012, 09:50 PM   #2
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JMHO. Read the manual on your truck very carefully, as to how the max trailer weight is calculated. If Toyota is the same as the Big Three then , every pound of weight in the truck , passengers and cargo has to be deducted from the trailer weight, as well as every pound over 145 that the driver weighs. That could limit you to a trailer GVW of about 7000lbs.
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Old 09-19-2012, 07:23 AM   #3
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8300 lbs. Is my tow capability. Vehicle weight ratings are separated. I verified this with my manual and with Toyota. Thanks for the heads up.

Steve & Lisa
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Old 09-19-2012, 07:48 AM   #4
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Typically, the 8300# tow rating is based on a base model truck, no cargo, no hitch, and only a 150# driver on board. So for every pound you add over this therotical base model vehicel, you reduce the towing capacity.

Practically, you can reduce the towing capacity to about 7300# as a max for a wet and loaded trailer. For the trailers you are looking at, add about 1000# to the dry weight for a weight estimate loaded for camping.

Also, with the Tundra, or most any 1/2 ton truck, I'd keep my max trailer length down to 26' (maybe 28'). You do not want the tail wagging the dog. Weight is only part of the towing equation. The trialer is a big sail that will push the truck around.

You need to carefully read the manual and towing guide for the Tundra and fince the model for the way you are equipped. Read the small print which places the limits on the tow rating.

Of the trailers, you are looking at, I'd go with the Jayco as a better built unit.

Vehicle weight ratings are not separate from tow ratings. The to are inter-related and you need to look at both.

Number one rule of RV/Truck shopping...

#1. Never believe the truck/RV sakles person.

#2. Truck/RV sales people lie.

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Old 09-19-2012, 09:26 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by slotdoc973 View Post
8300 lbs. Is my tow capability. Vehicle weight ratings are separated. I verified this with my manual and with Toyota. Thanks for the heads up.

Steve & Lisa
You say that, your manual says that you can load up the truck, and still tow 8300lbs. Sorry that doesn't sound right.
No Toyota dealer here, can you scan that page and post it.
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Old 09-19-2012, 10:00 AM   #6
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We will be towing with a Toyota Tundra Dbl. Cab with a tow rating of 8300 lbs.
Tow rating indicates the max weight the truck can pull. It ignores the weight of stuff in the truck and the hitch weight of the TT. So no, you cannot tow anywhere near an 8,300 pound TT without being overloaded. Probably closer to 7,000 pounds, and maybe a lot less if you haul more than a skinny wife in your truck when towing.

My tow vehicle has a tow rating of 8,400 pounds. When on the road with my wet and loaded TT that weighed 4,870 pounds (4420 trailer axle weight plus 650 pounds hitch weight), I was overloaded over the GVWR of my truck by 100 pounds.

Way back when, I had a truck with tow rating over 13,000 pounds, but was overloaded with my 5er that had a GVWR of only 7,900 pounds.

So ignore that 8,300 pounds tow rating for your Tundra and compute your own numbers, so you don't wind up overloaded on your third towing trip.

So your first job in sizing trailer to tow vehicle is to weigh the wet and loaded tow vehicle. "Wet" means full of gas, and "loaded" means everything in the truck that will be in it when towing, including passengers, pets, tools, bedliner, shank and ball mount for the weight-distributing hitch, and anything else that might be in the truck when towing. For example, I never tow more than a few miles without a floor jack in case I have to change a trailer tire in a wet and muddy barrow ditch on the side of the highway. If you don't have the WD hitch yet, then figure 50 pounds for the weight of the shank and ball mount.

Subtract the weight of the wet and loaded truck from the GVWR of the truck. That tells you the max hitch weight you can haul without being overloaded. Divide that hitch weight by 0.15 and the answer is the maximum GVWR of any TT you should consider so you won't be overloaded over the GVWR of the tow vehicle.

Subtract the weight of the wet and loaded truck from the GCWR of the truck. That gives you your actual tow rating, and tells you the max GVWR of any TT you should consider if GCWR and not GVWR is your limiter.

Then you will have two numbers for max GVWR of the TT. One of those numbers is limited by hitch weight, and the other is limited by max trailer weight. Use the smaller of those two numbers to decide the max GVWR of any TT you will consider.

When considering TTs, ignore the dry weights. Assume the wet and loaded weight of the trailer will be the GVWR of the trailer, and the wet and loaded hitch weight will be 15% of the GVWR of the TT. If the trailer specs don't include GVWR, then add unloaded weight and cargo capacity to get GVWR.
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Old 09-19-2012, 10:06 AM   #7
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Steve and Lisa, welcome to the forum and as others posters have said, be careful with your tow rating.
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Old 09-19-2012, 10:33 AM   #8
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What Smokey says,
OK , I downloader a Toyota owners manual, so I could read it myself. It is obvious that ; for whatever reason; they don't go to the lengths to explain trailer tow capacity, the way the North American manufactures do.
The TWR ( Trailer Weight Rating ) in the manual, says ; Trailer Weight +Cargo. That has to mean,trailer dry weight+ Cargo Everywhere ; in the truck included.
Does the GVWR plate on the truck list a GCVWR, ( Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating) If so , subtract the GVWR from the GCVWR, this sould be an indication of the max trailer weight that a loaded truck could move; and I say move , because moving it and handling it are two different things. I doubt that this # will be 8300lbs.
NOTE; We're not trying to discourage you we want to make sure your safe on the road.
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Old 09-19-2012, 12:02 PM   #9
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I appreciate all the great advice. The GCVWR is 14,000 lbs. Total Weight of Truck Loaded is around 6,700 lbs. This is alot more confusing than I ever Imagined. And you are very correct about the RV Dealers. They look up the truck on a computer and say you can tow 8,300 lbs. we should stay about 800 to 1,000 lbs. below that and have me looking at dry weights on the TT. Thanks for all the help.

Steve & Lisa Markowitz
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Old 09-20-2012, 08:11 PM   #10
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Steve, thanks for taking the time to learn about all this, before you made a purchase that could put you and your family at risk.
Everything you decide to take has to go into your weight calculation, just because you have room for it , doesn't mean you can safely carry it.
Myself, because I leave home for up to 4 1/2 months at a time I carry a lot. With 3345lbs Cargo Carrying Capacity on my coach the DW and I can use it all. Just something to keep in mind as you continue your search, and later as you trade up and continue to RV.
Safe Travels
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:42 PM   #11
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As to your original question, I know the Jayco's have a two year warranty as opposed to one on the other manufactures and that was a factor in our purchase decision. On our next one it will still be a factor but if I find the right floor plan I would consider another brand.
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Old 09-26-2012, 02:56 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slotdoc973 View Post
I appreciate all the great advice. The GCVWR is 14,000 lbs. Total Weight of Truck Loaded is around 6,700 lbs. This is alot more confusing than I ever Imagined. And you are very correct about the RV Dealers. They look up the truck on a computer and say you can tow 8,300 lbs. we should stay about 800 to 1,000 lbs. below that and have me looking at dry weights on the TT. Thanks for all the help.

Steve & Lisa Markowitz

According to your numbers, 14,000 - 6700 = 7300# for a max and loaded trailer. No way should you go to an 8300# trailer. The problem is RV dealers do not even know enough to realize that they are dangerous.

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Old 09-26-2012, 05:50 PM   #13
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My thought exactly.
Thanks
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Old 10-11-2012, 07:53 AM   #14
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Palomino offers a 2nd year warranty for a very reasonable price- I think it was $150 when we bought our Puma 30DBSS last October. We have been very happy with it. Overall I have liked the Jayco units I've seen, but I looked at a brand new one on a lot the day I ordered the Puma that had an entire corner of the slide seal peeling back. It didn't appear to be a good design. Other than that we really liked it.
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