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Old 09-10-2013, 11:13 AM   #29
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The gopro will come with all different mounts, just make sure it is mounted on a Window on the interior for best results, and on the frame under it. ....it will show what's going on and you can edit it to slow motion to see detail and hopefully flex underneath
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Old 09-19-2013, 08:08 PM   #30
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Omg. We just got a rear kitchen model. Hope we don't experience this!
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Old 09-24-2013, 09:26 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myredracer View Post
<snip> This frame is only used on one other brand that I know of so far.

<snip>
What brand is that, please?
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Old 09-24-2013, 11:30 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by wrvond View Post
What brand is that, please?
In addition to the KZ Spree, I have now seen it in person on a Flagstaff V-lite and Keystone Bullet. It may be on others but have no way of confirming because the manufacturers say nothing about it. Interestingly, KZ has been calling it a heavy duty frame in their literature and on their website.

There's a real problem with frames in the RV trailer industry. There's no industry (RVIA for ex.), UL, SAE, CSA, etc. or government mandated requirements. Frame manufacturers like Lippert, who have upwards of 90% of the market, can build them however they want. They do not have a max. GVWR assigned to them. There's no specs. you can look up. There's no governing body or government agency you can file a complaint with.

While I believe it's primarily the fault of the frame manufacturer, it's partly the fault of the trailer manufacturers as well.

If you want to see what can happen to these ultra-flexible frames, take a look at the following thread from the Open Roads Forum and look for posts by tedrowan. I've included a direct link to the photos he posted. He had a 2008 KZ Spree where the frame folded and collapsed in the rear.

http://http://forums.goodsamclub.com...543/page/2.cfm

http://https://plus.google.com/photo...38295172165723

We had our Spree into a government designated inspection facility in May and they said it was the worst frame they've ever seen on a travel trailer. They ended up saying it's not a case of *if* it will fail, it's a case of *when*. Besides the high degree of sag in our frame, I noticed recently that when you sight down the I-beams, there is a horizontal "wow" like a banana. Didn't see that before but our last camping trip was 500+ miles. Now the entry door barely closes and we have a failed weld in the aluminum framing that I found shortly after we bought it. Freaks me out thinking about what's happening to the 6-sided aluminum frame/structure sitting on top of the flexible frame.

We camped next to someone with a KZ Spree 289KS not too long ago. It had a front toyhauler door between the axles and tongue on the right side (it's an option). He puts his 800 lb Harley in it. I Know for certain that he will be over his GVWR by something like 600 lbs. They have the identical frame we do and we're 200 lbs under the GVWR with ordinary camping and trailer stuff and food and clothes. You have to know that at some point they are going to have serious problems with the frame. Why on earth would a trailer manufacturer put a toyhauler door in a model that will overload it and on top of that, use an ultra-flexible frame?

Don't know about other manufacturers but KZ has all their new 2014 units on their website. All their models have full specs listed except for the Spree lineup, there's nothing and all it says is "TBD." Maybe this means they are redesigning the frames? Time will tell....
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Old 09-24-2013, 12:38 PM   #33
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Omg. We just got a rear kitchen model. Hope we don't experience this!
The degree of bounce is going to depend on a number of things - axle rating (spring stiffness), length of trailer, position of axles on frame (from tongue to bumper), trailer weight, stiffness of suspension of truck and of course, any flex in the frame. Not easy to predict in advance so all you can do is wait and see.

Some have reported no issues with bounce in rear kitchens. Some say it is a given simply because of the tail end getting more vertical movement. Besides things falling out of cabinets, I also think that 6-sided aluminum frame superstructures are not going to fair well with excessive bounce.

In our case, we have a 3/4 ton truck with HD shocks. The rear of the truck does not bounce much from bumps and holes in the road. When we hit a bump, the truck stays pretty much level so that the hitch location on the truck is the point where the leverage action of the TT occurs. It's basic physics. To make it easy, if the axles were at the midpoint of the frame (front to rear) and if the trailer suspension bounce up 2" and then down 2", then the tail end of the trailer is going to see a movement of 4" up and 4" down. I'd have to go measure, but I think our axles are maybe 2/3 of the way back from the tongue so for a 4" of travel at the axles, so that would equate to 2/3 x 4" of travel.

It seems a pretty straightforward conclusion that anything that reduces the degree of vertical trailer suspension movement will reduce the effect of bounce in a rear kitchen. Installing shock absorbers will do this. Not many manufacturers install them or provide them as an option so you can be faced with doing it yourself. I'm planning to do it but our enclosed underbelly and position of the slideout shaft and gas line makes it harder.
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Old 09-25-2013, 05:40 AM   #34
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It is a kz. We looked at sprees but went with the 241rks sportsman, it will just be hubby and me so overloading won't be an issue will pray for the best


Quote:
Originally Posted by myredracer View Post
In addition to the KZ Spree, I have now seen it in person on a Flagstaff V-lite and Keystone Bullet. It may be on others but have no way of confirming because the manufacturers say nothing about it. Interestingly, KZ has been calling it a heavy duty frame in their literature and on their website.

There's a real problem with frames in the RV trailer industry. There's no industry (RVIA for ex.), UL, SAE, CSA, etc. or government mandated requirements. Frame manufacturers like Lippert, who have upwards of 90% of the market, can build them however they want. They do not have a max. GVWR assigned to them. There's no specs. you can look up. There's no governing body or government agency you can file a complaint with.

While I believe it's primarily the fault of the frame manufacturer, it's partly the fault of the trailer manufacturers as well.

If you want to see what can happen to these ultra-flexible frames, take a look at the following thread from the Open Roads Forum and look for posts by tedrowan. I've included a direct link to the photos he posted. He had a 2008 KZ Spree where the frame folded and collapsed in the rear.

http://http://forums.goodsamclub.com...543/page/2.cfm

http://https://plus.google.com/photo...38295172165723

We had our Spree into a government designated inspection facility in May and they said it was the worst frame they've ever seen on a travel trailer. They ended up saying it's not a case of *if* it will fail, it's a case of *when*. Besides the high degree of sag in our frame, I noticed recently that when you sight down the I-beams, there is a horizontal "wow" like a banana. Didn't see that before but our last camping trip was 500+ miles. Now the entry door barely closes and we have a failed weld in the aluminum framing that I found shortly after we bought it. Freaks me out thinking about what's happening to the 6-sided aluminum frame/structure sitting on top of the flexible frame.

We camped next to someone with a KZ Spree 289KS not too long ago. It had a front toyhauler door between the axles and tongue on the right side (it's an option). He puts his 800 lb Harley in it. I Know for certain that he will be over his GVWR by something like 600 lbs. They have the identical frame we do and we're 200 lbs under the GVWR with ordinary camping and trailer stuff and food and clothes. You have to know that at some point they are going to have serious problems with the frame. Why on earth would a trailer manufacturer put a toyhauler door in a model that will overload it and on top of that, use an ultra-flexible frame?

Don't know about other manufacturers but KZ has all their new 2014 units on their website. All their models have full specs listed except for the Spree lineup, there's nothing and all it says is "TBD." Maybe this means they are redesigning the frames? Time will tell....
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Old 09-26-2013, 06:52 AM   #35
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Your shock design is fantastic! It's a shame your system isn't available to the public. :(
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