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Old 11-30-2015, 11:56 PM   #1
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Surge Protection

Read an article about surge protectors for the whole rig. Yes we are in an older park, 30amp breakers and we have been getting surges. We have one for the tv. But, we do have pcs and a wireless printer. When we have a surge the printer goes to another time and year. Would putting a surge protector at the pedestal be the best? And which kind. The little bit of shopping I have done, shows me there are several kinds. Would that pedestal surge protector diminish the amperes to the TT?
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Old 12-01-2015, 12:07 AM   #2
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I copied this from an earlier thread .... hope it helps....
I started a thread relating to a surge/spike that hit our rig at a CG. It took out our microwave, keurig and convertor. We had a TRC Surge Guard protecting our rig. I was stumped as to how a surge/spike could have gotten by our surge protector until I found an article on the net which explained a few things. I'm pasting some useful information I found while researching our event.
- A spike is similar to a surge except that it lasts for one or two nanoseconds, whereas a surge lasts longer. A good analogy is water pressure. If your water pressure is excessively high, you'll have blown lines in your plumbing system.
-A surge protector will prevent these spikes and surges from passing through the system. It does this by utilizing metal oxide varistors, commonly knows as MOVs. A MOV does nothing at normal voltage levels, but when the voltage rises to an unsafe level, it shorts that power to ground. Energy surges are rated in units of joule.
-Most products referred to as surge protectors also contain some sort of low- and high-voltage protection. This is important because many RV electrical problems stem from low-voltage power from a campground pedestal. When the voltage drops, the amperage increases and this creates extra heat, which causes items such as motors and electronics to fail. A good surge protector will disconnect power to the RV whenever the incoming voltage falls out of the acceptable operating parameters, typically 106 volts on the low side and 132 volts on the high side.
- Later in the afternoon when other campers switch on their AC, the load on the grid can be too much, so the voltage drops to an unsafe level. Those campers without surge protectors run the risk of causing serious damage to their AC compressor motors, capacitors, and other electric components.
the majority of the Surge Guard units do not indicate if the MOVs have blown and will continue to pass current even after the surge protection capability has failed.
That is likely what happened to our surge protector. It likely protected us at some point, but without a sign that the MOV's had deteriorated to the point where the unit was not functioning/protecting as it was intended, we were literally sitting ducks till the fatal next surge/spike. I hope this is helpful and gets people thinking about their TRC surge guards. Our particular SG was 4 years old.
https://www.rvupgradestore.com/Articles.asp?ID=279 This chart does a good job comparing surge protectors. We have ordered a Progressive Industries EMS PT 50C through amazon which delivered to the Camp Ground.
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Old 12-01-2015, 12:14 AM   #3
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It depends on the surge protector what happens. We had a Hughes' Autoformer on the Dutch Star. It would bring the voltage up when it went too low and would sacrifice itself if too high, which it did once. Had friend that was into electronics that rebuilt it for me.
On the Magna we have true surge protection and it totally cuts voltage off if it goes too low or high and very quickly. We were at a friends house where we've stayed before, tried to plug into the same outlet but the protection found a problem with the circuit so I plugged into another one. Turns out that one also served his shop and everytime he turned on his table saw our electricity changed over to the inverter. It was fast enough that the TV's didn't even blink.
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Old 12-01-2015, 07:36 AM   #4
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First there are SURGE PROTECTORS and there are "Surge Supressors" what you have on your TV is the latter, it is a Spike suppressor.

A Spike is a very short term peak in voltage, can easily be 1,000 volts RMS or more. but only lasts like 1/120th or 1/60th of a second usually or less. The MOV's (metal oxcide varisistors) in the Supressor clip it nicely..

SURGE PROTECTORS. are computerized devices with LCD or multi-segment LED displays that give error codes or statements, they measure Voltage and Frequency and generaly amps since they can and this is the difference:

IF the voltage drops to say 100 volts,, This is damaging to Air Conditioners and some other devices in the RV. The Surge Supressor, like your TV's, does nothing.. The SURGE PROTECTOR will shut off power because NOTHING is actually better than 100 volts.

You plug into a 240 volt Dryer outlet using your 30 amp adaper (Or welder or other machine) and the SURGE Supressor strip may go BANG on you (no damage the case will contain the explosion of the MOV) but other than sounding like July 4.. Does not do a thing for you save let you know you just blew up some stuff (Trust me, Been there when the power company kind of messed up the connections.. Cost me a motor and a power supply and every one of those supressor strips in the house.. I did a post mortem on one of 'em)

The SURGE PROTECTOR will tell you 240VOLT DO NOT bypass (Well the ones that can be bypassed include that line) and block power from your RV thus protecting you.

IN fact somewhere aroud 130-135 they will shut your off.

HOWEVER. they do not shut you off for spikes. They contain MOV's just like the spike strips you have now.. (Which by the way I recommend you keep since it is very hard to have too much spike protection)


Another feature of a SURGE PROTECTOR.. This varies slightly depending on the model.

Progressive Industries HW-50/30 C out of the box
If you loose power even for a second, it will keep power off for at least 15 seconds after it comes back

Same device with the timer jumper clipped it's like 135 seconds (over 2 minutes)

TRC Surge Protectors.. 172 Seconds (nearly 3 minutes)

If the air conditioner is cooling (Compressor running) this two mnutes and change give it a chance to return to "Resting state" before the compressor re-starts.. This means it is a NORMAL restart for the compressor.. Same as if you turned it on for the first time.

But trying to restart after 1 second of power loss... That means you have nearly a full head of pressure. this usually "Stalls" the motor since the start coils are not powerful enough to deal with a full pressure head. this overheats and damages the compressor.. Enough of this and .. Well new rooftop units.... installed,,, about $1,000 and up.
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Old 12-01-2015, 03:34 PM   #5
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Most people recommend the Progressive Industries units. They come in 30A and 50A versions for either post or permanent mounting. The post models are pretty basic, while the permanently mounted ones will give you a readout of all sorts of interesting things. They aren't the cheapest units available, but they are American-made and 100% warrantied. I've heard that if one of them dies the company will repair it at no charge, but I haven't verified that myself.
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Old 12-01-2015, 04:47 PM   #6
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I have read many articles and talked with many fellow RVers and decided I need protection. So after many hours for research I decided to go with Progressive Industries 30 AMP EMS. Yes a little pricey but I rather be safe than sorry. It only takes 1 incident to pay for itself.
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Old 12-02-2015, 11:00 PM   #7
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I've between pretty happy with our 30 amp progressive industries pedestal mount. First or second day here at the KOA it tripped due to a high voltage hit on a windy day. Guessing a line went down somewhere nearby. I've had it go off for low voltage when the a/c came on too.
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Old 12-04-2015, 11:01 PM   #8
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Voltage has exceeded 132v 3 or 4 times tonight. Unit has tripped and kept power to trailer off until voltage is back down to safe levels each time.
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Old 12-07-2015, 10:02 PM   #9
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In general surge/spike/whatever protectors are only going to respond to extremes in voltage. They should not respond to sags and rises in voltage due to poor wiring at campgrounds or they would trip a lot and wear out quickly, plus would drive the user insane.

Instead, if you're worried about sags/rises you need to use an autotransformer. They are FAR more expensive than a surge protector (which is for lightning strikes and similar occurrences). One should consider the value of what they're protecting before investing in an autotransformer as I'm willing to bet that for many RVs it would be cheaper to burn out the occasional microwave than buy one.
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Old 12-29-2015, 02:53 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dgwpassport View Post
I have read many articles and talked with many fellow RVers and decided I need protection. So after many hours for research I decided to go with Progressive Industries 30 AMP EMS. Yes a little pricey but I rather be safe than sorry. It only takes 1 incident to pay for itself.
Why did you choose the Progressive Industries over the TRC? Just asking, I haven't bought one yet.

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Old 12-29-2015, 06:58 PM   #11
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When we bought our little mpg TT as a learner rig I knew I needed a surge protector. I did a fair amount of research and decided to go with the PI post-mounted 30A one. I ordered it from Tweety's, as they were the cheapest at that time. When we sold the mpg I thought I had let it go with the trailer, but found it a month or so later, so I still have it. Since we prefer State parks or COE parks, we have 30A service more than 50A, so I'm glad I kept it.

The reasons I chose the PI over the other was that PI is American-made and they have a great warranty.
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Old 12-30-2015, 12:22 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fdhealy4 View Post
Why did you choose the Progressive Industries over the TRC? Just asking, I haven't bought one yet.

Dale

I will tell you why I want to replace my TRC with a PDI and why I have a TRC

First: Why do I I have a TRC portable.. Got it for fifteen bucks (About) It was damaged but I had the needed parts to fix on hand...

Now why do I want the PDI.. Reputation, Warranty and the fact that it is a bit more verbose on the display. Also the TRC I have is a portable and I want hard wired. But that covers the basics.

PDI says once you buy and install our product you don't have to replace it till you sell your RV and forget to take it out.

(That's Lifetime Warranty in case you want a translation)
TRC says 1 year If I'm not mistaken or in the case of mine (Since I purchased it damaged)

15 minutes or the end of the driveway will help push.
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