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Old 10-22-2013, 01:19 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by J Birder View Post
This is not a valid argument. The manufacturer's rated length of a TT includes about 4 feet of tongue. Thus, a 30' TT has only about 26' if usable space inside.

As for maxing out a 1/2 ton truck, you are right. A 3/4 ton (or bigger) diesel makes a much better tow vehicle for most 5ers.

Joel
I guess that was my point. If you have a 25' box (living space) in both setups, the TT is actully longer because of the 3-4' tounge. But if you compare the interior of both 25' boxes, the TT is way more efficient.
The way the argument is usually presented is that you compare a 25' 5er to a 25' TT with a 21' box. Totally misleading and incorrect to do this.

That's why a TT is rated by box size, not length overall. My 2301 is 26' long bumper to hitch, so I would never compare to a 26' 5er.
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Old 10-22-2013, 05:32 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J Birder View Post
This is not a valid argument. The manufacturer's rated length of a TT includes about 4 feet of tongue. Thus, a 30' TT has only about 26' if usable space inside.

Joel
There is no "rated length" among the manufactures for measurement. Our TT is a 27 RSDS, listed as 27 feet, and the box actually measures 29 feet without the tongue, with the rear slide in. With the rear slide out it is 34 feet! The only way to be sure is to measure it.
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Old 10-22-2013, 05:48 PM   #17
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I keep hearing this argument and find it somewhat misleading. "More room per foot" is ONLY true in terms of distance behind the truck while towing because you don't count whats over the truck. At a given width and box size, unhitched a TT floorplan is much more efficient. Sure a 5er has a higher cieling, but at what price (higher center of gravity and massive wind resistance). As to storage, the "basement" in the 5ers I've looked at isn't that much bigger than my pass-through, so where's all this storage? And since most 5ers have hitch weights of 1,200 to 1,500lbs, you're already maxing out GVW on any 1/2 ton, so all the storage in the world won't help you. Unless you want to buy and drive a superduty for the 95% of the time you're not towing. And all those cold starts and short drives around the campground for trash and emptying the waste water caddy will put more wear on a diesel than thousands of miles of driving. Makes no sense.
As to a 5er being easier to set up, you'll need to explain that one to me. Especially when you want to remove/install your hitch from the bed when not in use, since most people asking these questions are not retired or fulltiming and would like their truck back in between camping trips.
Who said anything about a 1/2 ton? The OP has a 3/4 ton diesel. Plenty of truck for lighter 5th wheels. He obviously doesn't mind driving one. I still can't figure out this 1/2 ton to 3/4 ton daily driver debate. They're both big trucks. Apparently you haven't looked at 5th wheel cargo areas lately. Most are easily twice as big as a TT's front storage area. 5th wheels have two storage areas in the front. One running side to side and one across the very front. I guaranty you can't get everything I have in the front of my 5'er in your TT.
As far a room goes I don't think you get it. Pick any length. Now go look how much room is in a TT and 5'er of the same length. By the way the length is measured the same way on both.
On a TT it's from the tongue to rear bumper. On a 5'er it's from the pin to bumper. You have 3-4' of wasted space when towing a TT. Also when hitched up a 5'er is shorter over all since the pin sits right over the axle.
And yes a 5'er is taller which gives it a more spacious feeling inside.
Each to his own but Like I said there's a reason you see more 5th wheels being towed by full timers. It's cause you get more room inside for a shorter overall towing length. More storage underneath as well. Plus who wants to tow a 37+' TT around?
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Old 10-23-2013, 12:56 PM   #18
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I still can't figure out this 1/2 ton to 3/4 on daily driver debate. They're both big trucks.

You have 3-4' of wasted space when towing a TT. Also when hitched up a 5'er is shorter over all since the pin sits right over the axle.

And yes a 5'er is taller which gives it a more spacious feeling inside.
Each to his own but Like I said there's a reason you see more 5th wheels being towed by full timers. It's cause you get more room inside for a shorter overall towing length. More storage underneath as well. Plus who wants to tow a 37+' TT around?
What's not to get about 1/2 ton vs 3/4 ton? A half ton is sprung MUCH softer so it's more comfortable to drive empty. Many now have coils rather than leafsprings. And they weigh at least 1,000lbs less, so they are safer and more fuel efficient for a comparable setup (same engine/bed/cab).

As far as wasted space, my house battery and propane tanks live there, which makes them super easy to get at and maintain or remove. Compared to the cavernous waste of space under your hitch pin when disconnected from the truck. I guess you can keep all the stuff there that won't fit under your awning. And what about the entire length of the stairs leading up to the bedroom. Sure you have bathroom on the other side with storage underneath, but the stairwell itself is an inefficient use of space IMO.
Speaking of awning and wasted space, I have a 23' TT with a 19' awning. How's that work out on the 5er?

No doubt about the 5er being shorter overall when towing. I've always listed that as an attribute and it goes in-hand with their inherently more stable design.

Many TTs now have 7' radius ceilings that feel plenty roomy. No doubt a 9' ceiling feels even more so, but why do you need that in a camper? You want space... go outside. With all the overhead branches you'll hit and difficulty cleaning your roof and aerodynamic disadvantage, I guess it's a tradeoff. To each their own, as you said.

As to length, I don't want to tow anything that long around.
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Old 10-23-2013, 01:12 PM   #19
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I vote for the TT. I prefer not going up and down stairs in the unit. When the slides are out I don't feel cramped even with a lower ceiling. We have a huge front pass thru storage area as well. And we prefer the large rear bath with a window versus a small bath in a 5er having two entrance doors to take up space.
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Old 10-23-2013, 06:17 PM   #20
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This is not a valid argument. The manufacturer's rated length of a TT includes about 4 feet of tongue. Thus, a 30' TT has only about 26' if usable space inside.
Joel,
Not sure about your claim here. Maybe it varies from one make to another, but my 23'TT has a LOA of over 26'. Another unit we looked at was the Forrest River Surveyor Sport 296. It has a LOA of over 34' with the OEM rear cargo rack. I think it's the opposite of what you wrote above for TTs. That may be why there's so much confusion on this topic.
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Old 10-30-2013, 10:42 PM   #21
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I currently have a 31 ft. TT which my wife and I enjoy a lot. It pulls well and I have no issues with it.
What's your MPG towing with the Duramax? I'm pulling about the same rig and getting just over 11 in hilly country.
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Old 10-30-2013, 11:30 PM   #22
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Never even considered a TT for the past 21 years. I travel to many long miles and TT are not made for it. The twist and sway to much for my likes. Observe the transports, how many are TTs. All are 5th wheel for driver safety and comfort. Besides our needs don't fit in a TT.

My first was a 24ft 5th wheel towed by a 88 Ranger 4x4 2.9 gas. My mileage was almost 50% better then my friends pulling similar TTs with 1/2 tons. No way I was going to tow a 27ft TT 2k miles one way to Florida. It was done easily with the Ranger and 5th. 3 times in 3 years.
Our 39 ft 5th wheel that has every thing a house has plus Solar power for self sufficiency is not available in a TT version because its to much to tow for thousands of miles. We are now 1400 miles from home on the road one week and at our 1st CG stop. Our tanks are big enough for 2 weeks on the road with 75imp gallons of water. Try that with a TT.
Fuel mileage with the F250 towing our house is equal to the Ranger towing the previous 24ft RV. Unloaded the F250 can be much better then the Ranger on long trips.
I don't get the idea that TTs are easier to pull then 5th. 5th are to close to the cab to create excessive wind drag. Side wind create more drag. I know because I use my load gauge all the time. And a 7k TT of a friend at 40 MPH has same drag as my 14k 5th.
At 60mph my fuel rate towing the TT is much higher.

I drove a 1/2 ton GM and a 3/4 GM same models towing and newer saw much change except when loaded the 3/4 ton drove like a caddy and the 1/2 ton chucked due to weaker spring and hit bottom often.
3/4 tons are nice to drive. I do not get it going down from 3/4 ton to 1/2 ton argument. Other then being made stronger they are designed for fairly soft ride.
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Old 10-31-2013, 11:57 PM   #23
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I currently have a 31 ft. TT which my wife and I enjoy a lot. It pulls well and I have no issues with it. When I retire, we will travel abit more and were thinking of moving up to a fifth wheel with a slide out in the bedroom area,(for extra room & storage) which we do not have now. I hear all kinds of things about one type of RV being better than the other and we just don't know what to do. I have a 2011 Silverado 2500HD, Durimax Turbo diesel, extended cab, so I feel my truck is sufficient to tow a fifth wheel. Is it worth the extra cost to move up or should we keep our TT? Any suggestions would be appreciated.
To get back to the OP question. I am a weekend camper. I have a 20 foot TT and love it. (I would like to move up to about 23 feet though.) You say that you are pulling a 31 foot TT now with no problems. I've often felt that sort of length is already getting close into 5th wheel territory. I love my TT and I love the lay out of it. But, if you are going to tow long range with a long trailer a 5th wheel has it beat for towing and safety. But, It all depends on how far you are going to go, how often you use it, what sort of camping you want to do, ANd, what is most important to you. That is the most important question and only you an answer that.
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Old 11-01-2013, 12:59 AM   #24
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Everyone has their own reasons for owning a TT or a 5er.....we own a 5er because its got a ton of room and I like the seperatation I feel I get with the front bedroom. Stairs don't bother us yet.....The rig feels rock solids without any sway rolling down the road pulled by my 1 ton beast.......but in the end to each his or her own......
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Old 11-01-2013, 02:37 AM   #25
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Really enjoying the discussion going on here, I did a lot of checking out of both and I did have a small TT for about 5 years, I liked it fine but was always a bit more nervous of it in the wind.. I am now looking for another unit and am convinced a 5er is the way (for me) to go. I hated having to fit those chains and hitch things together, and it always seemed to go worse in the bad weather and no one was around to help (they were staying dry like smart folks !

I have seen it mentioned a couple of times that the stairs are a problem, I assume you mean the 3 inside to the front bedroom?
Has anyone thought of making a ramp, covered with a heavy rubber mat to fit over the stairs with a handle?
I did this on one side of my outdoor steps (5) for my clients who had difficulty with knee joints ... it was very easy for them to come for treatments and they were so glad to see the ramp as they were 'dreading those darn stairs' many made the same type of entry at their own home's, as a result they have been able to remain there many extra years after being 'told' what they 'must' do or not...

Does this sound like a solution that would overcome the concern of having a
5er ?

JMHO
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Old 11-01-2013, 08:09 AM   #26
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Originally Posted by Enokie View Post
Really enjoying the discussion going on here, I did a lot of checking out of both and I did have a small TT for about 5 years, I liked it fine but was always a bit more nervous of it in the wind.. I am now looking for another unit and am convinced a 5er is the way (for me) to go. I hated having to fit those chains and hitch things together, and it always seemed to go worse in the bad weather and no one was around to help (they were staying dry like smart folks !

I have seen it mentioned a couple of times that the stairs are a problem, I assume you mean the 3 inside to the front bedroom?
Has anyone thought of making a ramp, covered with a heavy rubber mat to fit over the stairs with a handle?
I did this on one side of my outdoor steps (5) for my clients who had difficulty with knee joints ... it was very easy for them to come for treatments and they were so glad to see the ramp as they were 'dreading those darn stairs' many made the same type of entry at their own home's, as a result they have been able to remain there many extra years after being 'told' what they 'must' do or not...

Does this sound like a solution that would overcome the concern of having a
5er ?

JMHO
I have never been able to understand why the stairs in a 5er can be an issue. How can it be that somebody who has the ability to climb up into the cab of their truck has trouble with a few 6" high stairs?

I am 72 years old, and have bad hip joints. Getting into the truck is tougher than it used to be, but I don't even notice the stairs inside my 5er.

Joel

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Old 11-01-2013, 10:52 AM   #27
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I have never been able to understand why the stairs in a 5er can be an issue. How can it be that somebody who has the ability to climb up into the cab of their truck has trouble with a few 6" high stairs?

I am 72 years old, and have bad hip joints. Getting into the truck is tougher than it used to be, but I don't even notice the stairs inside my 5er.

Joel

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I totally agree. If someone has trouble with 3 steps going into the bedroom in a 5'er, then what about the steps getting into the 5'er? Or the steps getting into and out of their house?
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Old 11-01-2013, 03:18 PM   #28
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I totally agree. If someone has trouble with 3 steps going into the bedroom in a 5'er, then what about the steps getting into the 5'er? Or the steps getting into and out of their house?
I too agree here, sometimes we 'assume' a little twinge and ache here and there will become a problem... it ain't necessarily so!

I have no idea what people mean when they say they are getting old.. a newborn from it's first breath is getting old....older is a better phrase as it implies that we still have a long way to go.

I have a friend who attributes every physical mishap to 'old age' I have to constantly tell the to change those thoughts because she is buying into the social concept that one must be filled with 'owies' as one ages...

"As you believe it, so it shall be, "

that was written thousands of years ago and it is still very true today.
So c'mon gang lets keep on keeping on... it's good for your health and remember to keep the negative self chatter out of you head and in a couple of weeks (and coconut oil) you CAN think yourself well
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