Building an RV wifi network

[Wanabee FTer]

I have been to a few parks that have free wifi, but the signal is weak or the only spot's open are the one's with no wifi reception. I am planning on building a wireless system to bridge the gaps at the hot spots. I know a little about computers, but have never set up anything more complex then a home wireless router. I have no idea if what I am thinking is going to work, but I am going to try it anyway.
My idea is to mount a directional antenna on my batwing TV mast, use a 10 foot extension cable to a wireless G access point (single antenna) tuned to the parks SSID and channel number, then it will be connected to a Linksys wireless N router via ethernet cable so my wife and I can use it wirelessly with our laptops inside the MH.
I went to Fry's electronics yesterday to purchase all the items I need. A Netgear WG102 access point, a Hawking HA12W 12 dBi directional antenna with 3 foot SMA cable, a 7 foot Hawkings SMA antenna extension cable, and I will be using an extra router I already have, A Linksys WRT160N wireless N router.
Now the hard part, I need to learn how to build a wireless network. I have started to research what I want to do, and found many different configurations, but nothing quite like what I am attempting to build.
What I do know so far is I want to use the access point in bridge mode if possible in order to keep from reducing bandwidth by using repeater mode. I also don't want to add to radio wave collision in the park by using repeater mode. I know I might need to upgrade my Linksys router to DD-WRT.
I also know wireless radio waves are transmitted from the parks AP in a mushroom pattern. The directional antenna on my AP will extend those waves out in a pattern similar to a baseball bat in order to reach the parks AP.
That's about all I know so far. If anyone can give me some advice before I get started, please do. I would love to hear comments from someone that is more familiar with building wifi networks then I am

[alvinc]

Not to spoil your fun, but I use the Hawking HW2R1 to do what you are building. This repeater has two radios, one is connected to an outside antenna, and the other two antennas are for the second radio. Got it on Ebay for $180. More than you probably spent on the two AP's, but a lot less hassle.

I don't believe that a directional external antenna is required (and could be harmful), because just having an external antenna is a big plus. If you were to use an 24" omni-directional external antenna (like Hawking HAO9SIP or TRENDnet TEW-AO080) you would go from an inside no-gain rubber ducky on the router to a 9 dBi external antenna. The other advantage of the omni-directional external antenna is that you don't have to aim it, making setup easier. Hawking claims 1.5 mile range, even half of that is enormous.

Yes, I believe you will need DD-WRT to get bridge mode. Hopefully your Linksys will allow updating to DD-WRT.

Look at it as a learning process.

[Lorna]

I posted this on another forum. Its a DIY USB wifi antenna

Skoolie.net • View topic - DIY WiFi antenna from Satellite dish

[Wanabee FTer]

Originally Posted by alvinc

Not to spoil your fun, but I use the Hawking HW2R1 to do what you are building. This repeater has two radios, one is connected to an outside antenna, and the other two antennas are for the second radio. Got it on Ebay for $180. More than you probably spent on the two AP's, but a lot less hassle.

Good to know. Fry's return policy is pretty good. If things don't work out I have 90 days to return for full refund.

Originally Posted by alvinc

I don't believe that a directional external antenna is required (and could be harmful), because just having an external antenna is a big plus. If you were to use an 24" omni-directional external antenna (like Hawking HAO9SIP or TRENDnet TEW-AO080) you would go from an inside no-gain rubber ducky on the router to a 9 dBi external antenna. The other advantage of the omni-directional external antenna is that you don't have to aim it, making setup easier. Hawking claims 1.5 mile range, even half of that is enormous.

I read something on another forum that I thought was a great idea. The directional antenna is mounted on the front edge near the top of the RV's TV antenna mast. When using the external antenna in a good wifi reception area, you leave the antenna retracted so the directional antenna is aimed straight up (projecting above the roofline of other RV's)
Likewise when you are in a poor reception area, raise the antenna and aim it to any access point within a mile or so to gain access.
At this point it's just a theory though

and yes, my Linksys WRT160N V.3 router is upgradable to DD-WRT

[94-Newmar]

Are you setting it up so that others nearer to you can gain access to the park's network too or are you building it strictly for your usage? We use all Cisco stuff here for our network.. specifically the Aironet 1200's and I have plenty of ideas for you once I know better what you're planning to do.

[Arch Hoagland]

I've been using this system for two years. Has worked fine in 50 or more rv parks around the country.

JEFA Tech: Long Range WiFi Repeater Kit for RVs

I attached the antenna that comes with it to my batwing TV antenna and crank it up if necessary.

[Wanabee FTer]

Originally Posted by 94-Newmar

Are you setting it up so that others nearer to you can gain access to the park's network too or are you building it strictly for your usage? We use all Cisco stuff here for our network.. specifically the Aironet 1200's and I have plenty of ideas for you once I know better what you're planning to do.

We usually don't stay in one place very long, but it would be nice to keep the network open so others could use it. Maybe others won't want use to leave if I use it this way

[John Hilley]

The WiFi Ranger, will accomplish the same thing and a lot more for a lot less money.

[Alan_Hepburn]

Originally Posted by Arch Hoagland

I've been using this system for two years. Has worked fine in 50 or more rv parks around the country.

JEFA Tech: Long Range WiFi Repeater Kit for RVs

I attached the antenna that comes with it to my batwing TV antenna and crank it up if necessary.

I concur - I've got this unit installed in my motorhome and it works great. I bought the hi-gain antenna and it seems to pull in signals from Mars (okay - that may be a slight exaggeration!)

[Arch Hoagland]

Originally Posted by Wanabee FTer

We usually don't stay in one place very long, but it would be nice to keep the network open so others could use it. Maybe others won't want use to leave if I use it this way

My JEFA tech router can be left open so others in the campground can log on to it, which I used to do thinking that would be nice for them.
I soon discovered, however, that it slowed me down quite a bit as others were logging onto mine because they couldn't connect to the campground WiFI any other way.
Also there are some security issues with others using your network so I now keep mine secure with a password.

[Wanabee FTer]

Originally Posted by Alan_Hepburn

I concur - I've got this unit installed in my motorhome and it works great. I bought the hi-gain antenna and it seems to pull in signals from Mars (okay - that may be a slight exaggeration!)

The only concern I have with a repeater is that it will congest the airwaves in a small RV park. The more repeaters that are being used, the worse it gets. Repeaters reduce bandwidth by 50% which is tolerable on a decent network, but if there are too many people using repeaters it ruins reception for everyone on that network.
Repeaters duplicate and repeat the access signal which can confuse networks. Kind of like if 10 people where shouting out directions to you all at the same time vs. one or 2 people shouting out directions. Less people yelling at you would be easier to understand.

[alvinc]

Originally Posted by Arch Hoagland

My JEFA tech router can be left open so others in the campground can log on to it, which I used to do thinking that would be nice for them.
I soon discovered, however, that it slowed me down quite a bit as others were logging onto mine because they couldn't connect to the campground WiFI any other way.
Also there are some security issues with others using your network so I now keep mine secure with a password.

A few explanations for the behavior you have noticed.

There are two types of repeaters: one type repeats the message on the same band as the input message, the other repeats the message on a different band. The first type is cheaper that the second. The JEFA repeats the signal on the same band.

What is the difference? Because the JEFA repeats the message on the same band as the input message, the available bandwidth of the band is reduced by half. This means that the throughput of the band has dropped form a maximum of 54Mbit (5.4MB) to 27Mbit (2.7MB). If the signal marginal the rate could be much lower, but still 1/2 what is possible.

It only takes one person using a same band repeater and the Wifi network throughput has been cut in half. Imagine what happens if 2 people are using a same band repeater.... the throughput is now 1/4, 4 people using same band repeaters drags the throughput to 1/16. If there is only one same band repeater being used by multiple people the effect is not quite as bad.

The summary: same band repeaters are useful if there is only one in the vicinity, or there is little usage of it. Same band repeaters are a nightmare in congested situations.

Consider this: Put 4 people in a room. Give them the following instructions:

A. Designate one person as the Access Point.

B. The other 3 people are to repeat everything the AP says.

B. Do not talk while anyone else is talking.

C. Have the AP say a sentence pausing between each word: "The", "Quick", "Brown" "Fox".

Note: this is not an exact analogy, but does illustrate how much extra air traffic that same band repeaters create.

Personally I think they are great thing in a home environment, but bad for the RV park or any other public access point.

[rcsoarer]

Flash the Linksys with DD-WRT and configure it as a client. With a cable connect it your Netgear AP.

[Wanabee FTer]

I spent a couple hours today trying to configure my wireless system with Windows 7 and gave up. A network engineer I'm not.
I looked at all the specs on the Hawking HW2R1 and it looks awesome!
I really like that it is compatible with mac and windose, since almost every thing I do is on a mac unless I'm trying to fix something on my wife's laptop.

Originally Posted by alvinc

I don't believe that a directional external antenna is required (and could be harmful), because just having an external antenna is a big plus. If you were to use an 24" omni-directional external antenna (like Hawking HAO9SIP or TRENDnet TEW-AO080) you would go from an inside no-gain rubber ducky on the router to a 9 dBi external antenna. The other advantage of the omni-directional external antenna is that you don't have to aim it, making setup easier. Hawking claims 1.5 mile range, even half of that is enormous.

Look at it as a learning process.

Scroll down the above provided link. In the external antenna example for RV application that Hawking illustrates, they are using the antenna that I already purchased from Fry's electronics. It's the Hawking HA12W 12dBi window mount directional antenna.
That's what I will be mounting to the TV roof mount antenna mast.
The radio even has a built in led signal strength meter so I can tune in the antenna without looking at the computer.

Alvin, your were right about the wireless network learning process.
I will be returning the AP to Fry's and I am going to order this radio ASAP!