Adding 2nd 30 amp panel

[Jobee]

Originally Posted by steve52

Before I did anything, I would want to find out why the panel gets hot enough to trip the main.

Agreed. I’m beginning to realize I’ve been remiss in not addressing that already. Thanks for the input.

[Jobee]

Hello all, This is a fairly old thread and I am just now getting a chance to try to solve my problem. Before doing anything, I’m first trying to determine the reason for the excess heat. Logic would say it could be 1 of 2 ac units drawing more current than it should. Both ac circuits on full load draw right around 10 amps, but I’m not sure if that is normal. Can anyone look at this tag and tell me if that seems right?

[twinboat]

More like 13 amps each and that not at higher temps or with dirty coils.

I had one climb up to 19 amps until I hosed out the rooftop condenser coils. After that it droped to about 13/14 amps.

[Jobee]

Another piece of information. I have a clamp-on ammeter, but because of space I can’t get it around the main. Therefore, I don’t know what the entire system is drawing. My best guess from adding the others (with the exception of one other that I am unable to measure - but believe it is minimal), I am drawing about 24-26 amps. Yet the terminal screw on the main is about 110 degrees. The terminal on the next breaker - which is in a double with the main - is at least 10 degrees cooler. The others are significantly cooler. Would the fact that my apparent total amperage draw is less than 30, and no other breaker is hot or overly taxed, maybe indicate a problem with the actual main breaker itself?

[Jobee]

Originally Posted by twinboat

More like 13 amps each and that not at higher temps or with dirty coils.

I had one climb up to 19 amps until I hosed out the rooftop condenser coils. After that it droped to about 13/14 amps.

So would that mean 10 amps each would indicate the ac units are not the problem?

[cavie]

Originally Posted by Jobee

So would that mean 10 amps each would indicate the ac units are not the problem?

If they are 10 amps each using a clamp on meter then they are not the problem. They are listed for 6.6 running load amps. Then you must add the fan motor amps. 2.9 which brings you to 8.8 amps, BUT one may be bad and drawing too much current on start up, You may need a new start capacitor. Are any of the caps puff up or leaking? Cleaning both coils may bring your 10 amps down to 8.8.

Are all you black wire #12 ga. I don't see any 15 amp breakers.

[Full.Monte]

Just converted my single 30A service panel to 50A double-sided service. It was a bit of a challenge, but it was the right thing to do. The main reason was that with the single 30A service, we couldn't run more than one electric heater at night. We sometimes camp in the cold, with snow, and two heaters would trip a breaker. We don't like to use propane for heat because it get used up so quickly. If you really want to increase your electrical capacity, 50A is the way to go...it gives you between 3 and 4 times the amount of available power. The main purchases are a new panel, a few more breakers, a new huge transfer switch, a new line from the electrical cabinet to the post and a new line from the electrical cabinet to the location of the new panel. #6 wire is expensive, fat, and heavy. Also, running the new wire to the new panel was difficult because I had to run it under the motorhome. Access under the floorspace was not really a viable option. It is complete now. I didn't wire to balance the load because I wanted to be able to run everything on one leg if a 50A post was not available. Now, I just use an adapter that plugs into the available 30A socket on the post and I can still power up as before. I don't prefer to do this, but some campgrounds don't have 50A.
I also figured out how to use my single pole generator on this, so I didn't have to buy a new one.

[Alan_Hepburn]

Originally Posted by Full.Monte

... I didn't wire to balance the load because I wanted to be able to run everything on one leg if a 50A post was not available. Now, I just use an adapter that plugs into the available 30A socket on the post and I can still power up as before

You do realize that the 50A to 30A adapter will power BOTH sides of your 50A box, right? If the adapter doesn't power both sides it's defective...

[twinboat]

Originally Posted by Full.Monte

Just converted my single 30A service panel to 50A double-sided service. It was a bit of a challenge, but it was the right thing to do. The main reason was that with the single 30A service, we couldn't run more than one electric heater at night. We sometimes camp in the cold, with snow, and two heaters would trip a breaker. We don't like to use propane for heat because it get used up so quickly. If you really want to increase your electrical capacity, 50A is the way to go...it gives you between 3 and 4 times the amount of available power. The main purchases are a new panel, a few more breakers, a new huge transfer switch, a new line from the electrical cabinet to the post and a new line from the electrical cabinet to the location of the new panel. #6 wire is expensive, fat, and heavy. Also, running the new wire to the new panel was difficult because I had to run it under the motorhome. Access under the floorspace was not really a viable option. It is complete now. I didn't wire to balance the load because I wanted to be able to run everything on one leg if a 50A post was not available. Now, I just use an adapter that plugs into the available 30A socket on the post and I can still power up as before. I don't prefer to do this, but some campgrounds don't have 50A.
I also figured out how to use my single pole generator on this, so I didn't have to buy a new one.

You can use both sides.

30 to 50 amp adaptor connects them. Will work with your generator too.

[Jobee]

Originally Posted by cavie

If they are 10 amps each using a clamp on meter then they are not the problem. They are listed for 6.6 running load amps. Then you must add the fan motor amps. 2.9 which brings you to 8.8 amps, BUT one may be bad and drawing too much current on start up, You may need a new start capacitor. Are any of the caps puff up or leaking? Cleaning both coils may bring your 10 amps down to 8.8.

Are all you black wire #12 ga. I don't see any 15 amp breakers.

There are no markings on any of the wires to indicate wire gauge. I am going to have to find samples I can compare. I’m about 70% sure I have #12 with #10 on the main. Otherwise I have #14 & #12 which is clearly not right. All breakers except the main are 20 amp, which I thought unusual from the beginning.

I have not looked recently, but the last time I did, no evidence of problems with caps. This problem was already happening at the time, so I don’t think that’s the problem.

[Jobee]

Originally Posted by Full.Monte

Just converted my single 30A service panel to 50A double-sided service. It was a bit of a challenge, but it was the right thing to do. The main reason was that with the single 30A service, we couldn't run more than one electric heater at night. We sometimes camp in the cold, with snow, and two heaters would trip a breaker. We don't like to use propane for heat because it get used up so quickly. If you really want to increase your electrical capacity, 50A is the way to go...it gives you between 3 and 4 times the amount of available power. The main purchases are a new panel, a few more breakers, a new huge transfer switch, a new line from the electrical cabinet to the post and a new line from the electrical cabinet to the location of the new panel. #6 wire is expensive, fat, and heavy. Also, running the new wire to the new panel was difficult because I had to run it under the motorhome. Access under the floorspace was not really a viable option. It is complete now. I didn't wire to balance the load because I wanted to be able to run everything on one leg if a 50A post was not available. Now, I just use an adapter that plugs into the available 30A socket on the post and I can still power up as before. I don't prefer to do this, but some campgrounds don't have 50A.
I also figured out how to use my single pole generator on this, so I didn't have to buy a new one.

I think this would ultimately be the best idea, but access to wires and room for another panel are an issue. Might be slightly above my pay grade, but I’ve spent a good portion of my life tackling projects that are a bit over my head.

[Jobee]

Originally Posted by Waiter21

I made a small modification to the rear Air Conditioner circuit that comes from the generator. I added a receptacle and a plug.

When on 30 amp shore power, if I need to run the rear A/C a lot and don't want it shedding, I unplug the A/C feed that normally comes from the generator and use a #12 extension cord and plug it into the 20 amp service on the shore power pedestal.

This tricks the ECC automatic changeover into thinking that the rear A/C unit is getting its power from the generator instead of the normal 30 amp service, and it switches over to what it thinks is generator power for the rear A/C unit.

I have a diagram, photos, and discussion on my web site how I made this simple modification.


Rear A/C unit can be run on separate 20 amp shore power circuit – 1999 Southwind 35S

Open up the panel and check all the connections on the circuit breakers, Also, check the connections on the AOC changeover solenoid. This AOC may be located behind the 12 volt distribution fuses, so you may need to do a little disassembly to get to it. Disconnect all the batteries and shore power befor doing any disassembly.
..

I am going to try this today. It looks like my gen compartment is different that yours. I can’t find an actual junction box anywhere, so may have to cut into the wires coming out of the back of the compartment. Great idea though, and it seems it should solve my problem.

[Jobee]

Originally Posted by cavie

If they are 10 amps each using a clamp on meter then they are not the problem. They are listed for 6.6 running load amps. Then you must add the fan motor amps. 2.9 which brings you to 8.8 amps, BUT one may be bad and drawing too much current on start up, You may need a new start capacitor. Are any of the caps puff up or leaking? Cleaning both coils may bring your 10 amps down to 8.8.

Are all you black wire #12 ga. I don't see any 15 amp breakers.

With the shelf over the panel out I can see the romex casing and the are #10 & #12.

[Jobee]

Can anyone identify the hollow plastic ring that the main goes through. It is attached loosely to the back wall of the panel, maybe with automotive style trim clip, although I can’t see it. I want to get the main out of it so I can get my ammeter on the wire, but don’t know if it’s important. Maybe this is dumb, but I’m wondering if it’s somehow measuring current which would then kick in the ECC and shed one ac. Or it could just be something to isolate that wire from the rest? I don’t know why, but the picture keeps appearing upside down. It is the black plastic thing under the wire that appears to be at the top.