Black Tank issue

[JC2]

Originally Posted by Dougjpr

Thanks for advice on the bleach.

If I can get the tank to drain and then am able to close the valve I will flush tank a few times with water to clean it the best I can and then was planning on putting in a bleach solution on the last flush to remove as much bacteria as I can.

Then when I go to change the valves they will be as clean as I can get them.

When I change the valves (assuming my plan for draining works) I'm planning on dropping the air out and then using the jacks on the drivers side to tilt the tanks away from the drain point. I think this was mentioned in an earlier post.

Will probably drop the coach and lift the curbside to get best drain I can when I empty them

Thanks

Doug

Using water to flush several times is "all" you need. The addition of bleach is completely unnecessary and counterproductive to a black tank. Bacteria is what is needed in a black tank to help it do its job.

[Ted Lambert]

Originally Posted by Dougjpr

Thanks for the replies.

I have no way of knowing if there is a blockage.

When I pull the valve there is absolutely no sound of any water moving. Whenever I dump the tanks I always add a couple of bowl fulls of water and chemical into the tank. That amount of water would of been right at the valve and I would of heard that water, I heard nothing.
Usually there is a very noticeable sound of water moving, but I get nothing. If there was a blockage is would have to be a perfect fit into the drain of the tank.

I have come to the same conclusion as a few of the other posts, cut the body of the valve away so I can get to the blade and then get a hold of it anyway I can.

My thought was to cut away the flat part on either side leaving the perimeter of the valve in hopes of minimizing the anticipated mess, by stopping the gate from coming out completely.

Coach is new to us but 12 years old. Did a one night trip when we first picked it up and it drained fine, filled the tank to half and it drained fine.

Called the dealer we purchased from and they said they have never had that happen. So I am not inclined to be their guinea pig, or they just don't want to deal with it

My wife just found a Airstream website (airforums.com) where someone has documented a valve change in detail. They are doing what I and the other posters are suggesting.

Once I get the valve open, I will flush the tank using the black flush, then run a bunch of bleach/water through it to get it as clean as possible.

Really not looking forward to this, but got no choice.

Think I'll change the grey tank valve too since I'm already there. If one is broken, the other may not be far behind

Keep the poop jokes coming, they are funny (need some humor), was kind of expecting a few.

Doug

I checked out the link to airstream that you supplied and could not find the video. Could you please post a link. I would really like to see how this is done.
Good Luck!

[Dougjpr]

I will do my best to find the link

My wife found it on her ipad, so I'll see if I can get it from that

Doug

[Dougjpr]

OK, here is an update, for anyone that cares

Took coach from storage yard to park nearby that has a dump station. I figured at this time of year at 8:30 pm the odds of having the place to my self were pretty good, and I was right.

Thought I would try one more time with the black valve, before I did anything else. Connected up the sewer hose, pulled the black valve and still nothing. Tried spinning it to all different directions but still nothing. So at this point I figure the valve must be broken.

I drilled a 3/8" hole near the lower part of the valve body close to the handle and another at the top to allow any liquids that may have gotten in there to drain out, which it did.

I then got my dremel tool fitted with a cutting wheel for plastic. I cut out a as big an area as I could on one side of the valve body and opened it up.
When I pulled the valve handle the gate opened with it, as I could see it, still no liquids flowing.

So now I know I have a blockage, but how to dislodge it?

Well, when all else fails hit it with a hammer. I started to tap all the fittings that I could reach to see if I could create enough vibration to cause the blockage to move, and it worked. After a few minutes I started to hear some movement and then all of a sudden the sound I had been waiting for, the big woosh as the tank emptied. Got a bit of leakage from around the opened valve body onto the wet bay tray, but I flushed that out onto the concrete pad and I was able to hose it down the drain.

I then closed the drain, filled the tank by means of the black tank flush and drained it again, then did it one more time, the last time with the coach tilted towards the drains.

There was always a bit of liquid when I opened the drain cap, so one of the 2 valves is leaking. Since we are now empty, I will replace both valves on the weekend.

1 question.

When I was messing around with everything, I noticed that the 'y' fitting that you connect the sewer hose to moves. Should this move or should it be fixed in place with pipe glue?

Coach is a 2005 Newmar Dutch Star

[irishguy]

You might just have a vacuum lock or blockage. Make sure your gray tank is at least half full then open the gray tank valve. At the same time pull your black tank valve and see if it flows. If it does, close your gray tank valve.

Another thing you can try is if you have a black tank flush line, hook up a water hose and turn on the water and then open your black tank valve.

[Dougjpr]

Thanks Irish Guy

Seems to be draining fine now.

I have one of those fitting that you hook the hose to, but I cant get it on as there is not enough space to spin the fitting on to the drain fitting without hitting the bottom of the wet bay

BTW- we call our coach the 'Irish Star' as we are not Dutch

[irishguy]

Originally Posted by Dougjpr

Thanks Irish Guy

Seems to be draining fine now.

I have one of those fitting that you hook the hose to, but I cant get it on as there is not enough space to spin the fitting on to the drain fitting without hitting the bottom of the wet bay

BTW- we call our coach the 'Irish Star' as we are not Dutch

Hmmm do you have a specific built in connection for a black tank flush that is above your drain connections?

BTW our wye fitting moves freely up and down. Sometimes the bottom of the coach is too close to the ground to hook the slinky hose through the bottom access port so I rotate the wye up and run the slinky into the compartment.

Great name!

[Dtwallace]

Originally Posted by JC2

Using water to flush several times is "all" you need. The addition of bleach is completely unnecessary and counterproductive to a black tank. Bacteria is what is needed in a black tank to help it do its job.

I think you're confusing the holding tank with a septic system.
Holding the waste until it's emptied is all the tank does, and all it's meant to do.

Using bleach to do a final cleaning is a good idea as long as we don't over do it and leave too strong of a solution sit behind the blade valves.

Some use liquid dish washing detergent in the black water tank as a helper to keep sediments from sticking, and it also helps to lubricate the blade valve.

TP will not stick to the inside in a soapy solution, and it smells better without using a lot of chemicals.

DTW

[Dougjpr]

Originally Posted by irishguy

Hmmm do you have a specific built in connection for a black tank flush that is above your drain connections?

BTW our wye fitting moves freely up and down. Sometimes the bottom of the coach is too close to the ground to hook the slinky hose through the bottom access port so I rotate the wye up and run the slinky into the compartment.

Great name!

Yes we have a black flush, that's how I was filing the tank to flush it out.

The fitting I was referring to is the 90 deg fitting with the hose fitting that would allow water to flush up from below a blockage.

I checked with Newmar, and the 'Y' is supposed to move, so no problem there.

Going to change both valves tomorrow and then I will put some laundry detergent in the tanks and drive it around.

Coach was on dealer lot for a while before we came along so I suspect that some of the residual waste may of dried up in there and is now breaking up.

I used to put laundry detergent in my TT tanks and flushed them regularly, never had an issue.

That's the problem with used equipment, it can't tell you how it was treated.

Coach was very clean inside and appeared well taken care of so we thought that may of continued throughout. Hopefully this has been a one off occurrence.

Enjoy your long weekend.

I live in Canada so ours was last weekend.

Doug

[Dougjpr]

Success!!

Got both black and grey valves replaced with very little mess, so I was pleased about that.

Coach sat for a while before we bought it so I'm sure that whatever was left in the bottom of the tanks has dries up. This was evident by the amount of dried build up on the inside of the black tank pipe which I could see with the valve out. I suspect that something similar is what caused my blockage.

Any suggestions on what to put into tank to break up dried and harden tank residuals?

Thanks

Doug

[cruzbill]

water, agitation and time. Seriously, keeping some water in the black tank all the time (like 1/4 full) will over time, get rid of the solids in the tank. I'm not a fan of the claims of water softeners, dish soap, or the funniest one of all-Ice!. Just keep some water in the tank, drive the rig, and empty when needed. Oh, and welcome to the Dump Valve Brotherhood-We've all been there!

[tom chelbana]

As mentioned need to start using black tank with at least 4 to gallons of water. Also suggest get a clear sew hose attachment so you can see when you rinse tank that there are no more solids coming out. On our Newmar Essex with the toilet on the passengers side of coach there is just as much solids coming out on the 1 rinse as there is when pulling the first time. Need to rinse at least 3 times to get a clean tank. RV Flush talks about pyramiding which is when you don't have enough water in the tank in the beginning and the solids built up under toilet inlet and harden.

[Ray,IN]

Use a manual tank rinser to blast stuff off the walls and floor of the black tank. It works much better than a built-in tank rinser.
I had to make mine because the length of store bought was too short for my MH. I used 4' of 3/4" pvc pipe + pipe cap(drill 1/8" hole in opposite sides of cap) and an adapter from pvc to garden hose, and a shut-off valve. Total cost was about the same as in the above link.

[partskenn]

Originally Posted by Ray,IN

Use a manual tank rinser to blast stuff off the walls and floor of the black tank. It works much better than a built-in tank rinser.
I had to make mine because the length of store bought was too short for my MH. I used 4' of 3/4" pvc pipe + pipe cap(drill 1/8" hole in opposite sides of cap) and an adapter from pvc to garden hose, and a shut-off valve. Total cost was about the same as in the above link.

How do you use this? Do you go down from the toilet?