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littlesonny · 12-14-2017, 10:56 AM

Removed fuse/breaker panel and determined that wiring from the solar panel is hard wired into the fuse panel. The wiring comes into the back of the panel and pretty sure comes through to the two connections marked "battery pos" and "battery neg" as shown on the wiring diagram. https://www.dropbox.com/s/noozu262qv...agram.jpg?dl=0 10 AWG was printed on the outside insulation. This would say to me that the solar was wired direct to the OEM converter with no solar controller and be the reason for the overcharging.

Would have to go back to Handy Bob's blog to check if the correct gauge wire was used. About to get back to the service manager with a cruise missile but want to get my ducks in a row when I start demanding a correct installation.

RasMouSein · 12-14-2017, 11:30 AM

No charge controller eh!! What size solar panel is up on the roof?

PJStough · 12-14-2017, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RasMouSein

No charge controller eh!! What size solar panel is up on the roof?

The OP says 150 watt.

cruzbill · 12-14-2017, 11:48 AM

One 10w or 15w panel is about as big as I would go without using a solar controller. Yes, I would be upset about the install. 10ga from the panels to the controller is not the end of the world, but it depends how far away the batteries are from the solar panel. For DC, you need to measure the one-way wire distance from the panels to where the controller 'should' be located. Then use a voltage drop calculator to figure voltage drop. Less the better (<2% is good).

Voltage Drop Calculator

The controller should be located near the batteries (within 5' or so, measured by one-way wire length). Correct (bigger) wire size is used between the solar controller and the batteries. Again, to limit v-drop.

$4k for one, 150w panel is pretty high. I would be pissed.

littlesonny · 12-14-2017, 01:30 PM

Thinking the controller should go under the Xantrex remote panel which is mounted just under the closet next to the bed which is on the forward end of the TT. Might be something like a 4'-5' depending on how it was routed. That's as close to the batteries as possible and still be inside the trailer. The only closer alternative would be the bulk head inside the forward storage bin.

After reading Handy Bob's blog I'm going to want a Trimetric to monitor what's input and output. I thought perhapes to put that on the same panel as the Xantrex remote and the solar controller.

The solar panel itself is just past mid-way, roughly over the back side of the kitchen area on a 27' Jayco Whitehawk. I don't think it's being shaded by anything but I'll have to get up there and take a look again.

"Pissed off" is putting it mildly. I was charged nearly $1800 in labor, $135hr, for what I'm seeing as completely incompetent and downright stupid work. Despite being the largest RV dealer in this area, I have a strong feeling they never installed a RV solar system and used my unit as a guinea pig. I'm sure there was a "We don't need no stinkin' install manual," moment.

twinboat · 12-14-2017, 01:41 PM

You don't need to " see " the controller for a 150 watt panel and it doesn't matter where it's installed. The power going in, is only a bit more then the power coming out of it.
Location becomes important with multiple panels and/or MPPT controllers.

You do want a switch to turn off the panels, for working on the batteries, and a fuse or breaker near the battery, on the wire from the controller.

A battery monitor is a great tool for seeing what's going on.
Of course that will need to be installed properly, something that your guy can't seem to handle.

cruzbill · 12-14-2017, 01:42 PM

Closet OK, storage comp might be better, just depends on access. The Trimetric is an excellent monitor, you could use their 30a controller, too, it just plugs into the monitor with a phone cable. The Trimetric requires that you install a 'shunt' in line with your negative battery cable at your battery. Generally this means using a short, pigtail cable from the neg battery post to one side of the shunt, then, after shortening your existing battery cable, hook it up to the other side of the shunt. All loads must be downstream of the shunt to be measured.

https://pantherrvproducts.com/trimet...oaAoirEALw_wcB

littlesonny · 12-15-2017, 04:32 PM

Informed the service manager of the situation. He was very apologetic. He's offered to give me new batteries and a solar controller free of charge. All well and good but not enough in my view for the hassle and time spent.

They used #10 wire from the panel to the back of the breaker, maybe 8'. The run to the controller, if installed in the forward storage bin will be in the neighborhood of 30'. I think perhaps a bigger cable is in order, especially if in the future I should want to add a 2nd panel.

I think they sell Zamp controllers but from what I've read a Morningstar is a better unit.

Currently, the cable from battery to inverter/charger is I think #2 and is 5'-6'. Labeling isn't really clear. Has 32mm squared in brackets. Might be 33. Have to see if that is large enough.

And then of course the Trimetric. Though I hesitate that they can install one correctly. I'll look up the install myself and relay that info and check that is what gets done.

Anything else y'all might suggest? We're basically doing a rewire and installing a controller and a Trimetric. I'm going to assume they'll do all this free of charge. If not, I'll be asking , why not?

okcnewbie · 12-16-2017, 09:34 AM

Sounds like you're making progress. That's great news!

cruzbill · 12-16-2017, 09:48 AM

At least you got the dealer to fess up. Good for you. Now for the wire size, use the info you have and the vdrop calculator I sent you and do the calcs for the wire size from the panels to the controller and from the controller to the battery. You might want to ask them to put in a 'junction box' or 'solar combiner box' near the breaker panel, easier to add another panel with a combiner box. It doesn't have to be very big for a two panel system. Voltage drop is to be avoided at (almost) all costs, for its the voltage that charges your battery. Try to keep it around 2%. I think I would still go with the Trimetric solar controller as its designed to work with their monitor. Plug and play. Don't forget the shunt, it has to be the first connection to the neg cable at the battery . Good luck!

littlesonny · 12-18-2017, 04:41 PM

Taking the trailer to the dealer to rectify the solar problems on Wednesday. They've already said they would install a controller and a new set of batteries. Since I feel they seriously owe me beyond just putting in whatever controller and batteries they see fit, I've put together a list of what I think would be the best components from what I've learned in this process. I'm going to take this with me but without the commenting notes. Could y'all comment on anything I missed or might add or whatever. Please excuse the large font. I copied and pasted from Word.

They already installed the Xantrex Freedom HFS 1000 watt and the Xantrex Xi remote panel and wired up an outlet for the TV/Roku and one outlet for cell phone or whatever. I believe from what I read from Handy Bob that we could possibly run the coffee maker. We currently just boil water. The toaster would be nice. We could shut off one before using the other. Either can be simply set on the table and will reach the currently installed outlet. We can do without the microwave, though that would be nice if possible. As I understand it, the A/C is out of the question with this small a system. That's fine.

Lifeline GPL-4CT 6v Batteries (They previously installed Deka AGM Intimidators (192Ah) but I figured I might as well go for the greater capacity - 220Ah.) I want to keep the AGMs for less maintenance and they appear to be a bit more robust for someone who prefers not to have to mess with the batteries.

Bogart Engineering Timetric TM-2030-RV Battery Monitor
Bogart Engineering SC-2030 Controller (Comes as a kit with connecting cable and shunt.)

Controller needs to be no further than 5’ from batteries. Forward storage bin a good location.

The Trimetric needs to be located where it is easily visible but not annoying and fairly close to controller. Suggest under Xantrex remote panel, which is next to the bed.

#2 Welding Cable batteries to controller is already there.
#10 Panel to Controller is what they already used but will have to increase the run to reach the controller in the forward storage locker,30-35 feet.

Sbrownstein · 12-18-2017, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by littlesonny

Bogart Engineering Timetric TM-2030-RV Battery Monitor
Bogart Engineering SC-2030 Controller (Comes as a kit with connecting cable and shunt.)

Controller needs to be no further than 5’ from batteries. Forward storage bin a good location.

The Trimetric needs to be located where it is easily visible but not annoying and fairly close to controller. Suggest under Xantrex remote panel, which is next to the bed.

Not really. The Trimetric can be located wherever you want it, mine is on the bulkhead by the door. The distance between the Trimetric and the shunt really doesn't matter (well, its and RV so how far could it be.)

The SC-2030 can be anywhere you want it but generally as close to the termination of the infeed from the panels. The wiring between the controller and the batteries should be heave gauge but remember, it maxes out at 30 amps anyway. The voltage drop in those cables will automatically be offset since the battery voltage for the controller comes from the Trimetric itself (remote sense.) The RJ phone cable between the Trimetric and the controller can be as long as you want it as can the battery temperature probe.

Great system, powerful and easy to understand.

okcnewbie · 12-18-2017, 05:24 PM

Keep the trimetric close. You'll love it. For once you'll know what's going on with the batteries!

RasMouSein · 12-18-2017, 06:53 PM

Might need to reroute the wire ...
Try to get the shortest route between panels and batteries.
The charge controller does not "need" to be super close to the battery because the amps going in and out of it are the same...
Just keep the total run as shirt as possible.
#10awg seems a bit small. Especially if you wanna upgrade latter...