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Old 01-04-2013, 06:56 AM   #57
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[QUOTE=palehorse89;1418442]
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Originally Posted by Tony Lee View Post
Interesting isn't it. Here we have a product that has been on the market for years and yet, despite some amazing claims made for the benefits of fitting them, here we are relying on a single opinion of their effectiveness.[/QUOTE]
Well Tony we now have a couple more folks telling thier personal story of how this product works. Myself, claims are not real life descriptions of a true story, and now you can see by the additional posts that I don't have to rely on a " single opinion " As far as them "being on the market for years" , as I posted in the begining of this post I saw them for the first time this spring on that Essex and did not know what they were or even what they were suppose to do, so I find the comments from people that have used them and are using them to be factual and the opinion's seem to all be the same. So now the thread is not based as you claim on a single opinion. I also was wondering if you have ever used these air-tabs or known anyone personally that has due to they have "been on the market for years" ? And after all of those years that you have known about them you personally must not have a opinion on how effective they are?
Three opinions eh? THREE! - but still opinions, which as such are pretty much useless as a basis for making a rational decision as to the benefits expected for the spending of a certain amount of money. Guess airtabs will be able to add them to their "not endorsed by NASA, but we are determined to get "NASA" into the blurb somehow - because some people might actually believe that NASA DOES endorse them" claims.

These things have been around for as long as I have owned a heavy vehicle and possibly somewhat longer. So I looked into fitting them on my MC8 about 7 years ago. Then the web site was pretty sparing with any decent data and since then the web site seems to have grown a lot more than their sales because even now the best they can come up with is "Thousands of Airtabs™ have now been in service for several years in Australia, South Africa, Europe and in North America from Mexico to Alaska "
At at least 100 tabs per truck, you don't need a degree in applied math to figure out that isn't many customers spread out over all of the civilised world - which of course is the most logical explanation as to why I have yet to see a single vehicle fitted with airtabs in 6 years of pretty extensive travels all over Australia and from California to Mexico. So, no, I don't know anyone personally who has used airtabs and I'm finding it hard to understand why a remarkable invention is so unsung by where it really counts - the market place.

""Total fuel saving for the duration of 4 month trial : $1800 USD"...."Overall vehicle handling was improved"...." Improvement in fuel economy of 6.06%"...." We are pleased with these results..." Mr. Bill Dinino Fleet Man[…] "

Now you might ask, given the claimed fuel savings and the claimed peace of mind of drivers and the claimed huge savings in washing the back end of vehicles, why is it that every second truck - or even every truck in the world isn't wearing these amazing bits of plastic? What possible reason could there be for operators NOT to spend a paltry hundred bucks to achieve an annual saving of many thousands of dollars in fuel costs. Are they blind, or stupid? Why hasn't the government mandated their use on all new trucks. Oh yes, the conspiracy theory. Forgot about that.

Could it be that they don't save enough fuel for them to be bothered, or could it be that once the confirmation bias has worn off, the placebo effect becomes ineffective, or perhaps it is because the average truck owner knows in his heart that what might work on an aircraft where the airflow over certain small areas of the structure is moving at close to Mach 1, isn't really too relevant in a rig moving at Mach 0.1. Don't they believe Mr Bill Dinino, one of their very own?

I wonder whether those few thinking of spending the dollars to fit them would change their mind if they were to find out that one of the glowing reports was written by one of the owners of the company making the units.

Anyone wanting more information on these remarkable devices could spend a few hours in the company of the many forums brought up by a google search for "fuel saving forum - vortex generators"
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Old 01-04-2013, 09:17 AM   #58
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Old 01-04-2013, 12:08 PM   #59
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Um.. google is your friend.. Plenty of real science to back up vortex generators.. Going waaayyyy back for many decades.

And yes, NASA does like them and use them. As do many other agencies, companies, teams, airlines, etc..
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:26 PM   #60
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[QUOTE=Tony Lee;1419545]
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Originally Posted by palehorse89 View Post

Three opinions eh? THREE! - but still opinions, which as such are pretty much useless as a basis for making a rational decision as to the benefits expected for the spending of a certain amount of money. Guess airtabs will be able to add them to their "not endorsed by NASA, but we are determined to get "NASA" into the blurb somehow - because some people might actually believe that NASA DOES endorse them" claims.

These things have been around for as long as I have owned a heavy vehicle and possibly somewhat longer. So I looked into fitting them on my MC8 about 7 years ago. Then the web site was pretty sparing with any decent data and since then the web site seems to have grown a lot more than their sales because even now the best they can come up with is "Thousands of Airtabs™ have now been in service for several years in Australia, South Africa, Europe and in North America from Mexico to Alaska "
At at least 100 tabs per truck, you don't need a degree in applied math to figure out that isn't many customers spread out over all of the civilised world - which of course is the most logical explanation as to why I have yet to see a single vehicle fitted with airtabs in 6 years of pretty extensive travels all over Australia and from California to Mexico. So, no, I don't know anyone personally who has used airtabs and I'm finding it hard to understand why a remarkable invention is so unsung by where it really counts - the market place.

""Total fuel saving for the duration of 4 month trial : $1800 USD"...."Overall vehicle handling was improved"...." Improvement in fuel economy of 6.06%"...." We are pleased with these results..." Mr. Bill Dinino Fleet Man[…] "

Now you might ask, given the claimed fuel savings and the claimed peace of mind of drivers and the claimed huge savings in washing the back end of vehicles, why is it that every second truck - or even every truck in the world isn't wearing these amazing bits of plastic? What possible reason could there be for operators NOT to spend a paltry hundred bucks to achieve an annual saving of many thousands of dollars in fuel costs. Are they blind, or stupid? Why hasn't the government mandated their use on all new trucks. Oh yes, the conspiracy theory. Forgot about that.

Could it be that they don't save enough fuel for them to be bothered, or could it be that once the confirmation bias has worn off, the placebo effect becomes ineffective, or perhaps it is because the average truck owner knows in his heart that what might work on an aircraft where the airflow over certain small areas of the structure is moving at close to Mach 1, isn't really too relevant in a rig moving at Mach 0.1. Don't they believe Mr Bill Dinino, one of their very own?

I wonder whether those few thinking of spending the dollars to fit them would change their mind if they were to find out that one of the glowing reports was written by one of the owners of the company making the units.

Anyone wanting more information on these remarkable devices could spend a few hours in the company of the many forums brought up by a google search for "fuel saving forum - vortex generators"
Wheeewwwwwww............. OK, Thanks for the Rundown, I was going to buy some of these air tabs, but knot now
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Old 01-04-2013, 04:45 PM   #61
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GOOD, Finally a tested road trip result for the air-tab product! I sure would like to hear more from people that used these and hear about the handling differances. Did the rear of the Coach stay cleaner?
You must have missed my earlier post where I stated that Brett Wolfe had tested them.
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Old 01-04-2013, 05:05 PM   #62
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You must have missed my earlier post where I stated that Brett Wolfe had tested them.
No I did not miss your post as I asked you who he was but I was waiting to see if you were going to post some info. on his testing of this product and his findings.
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Old 01-04-2013, 06:14 PM   #63
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I am a trucker had air tabs on one truck noticed the back of my cab stayed cleaner in bad weather so i new they were doing something. Also alittle more stable in winding condition.
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Old 01-05-2013, 08:24 PM   #64
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It always amazes me in forums like this one, when a person poses a question about a product, and asks for responses from people that have used them, the few individuals who somehow think the rest of us that want to learn something are not interested in your opinion, if you haven't used the product. After reviewing 5 pages of responses, those that have used them like them and stated why, very clearly. Those that have not used them seem to be on some sort of crusade to make sure that everyone knows their opinion on a product they have never used. Everyone can have their opinion, but common sense should tell you that no one wants to hear yours if you have nothing to contibute, except your opinion, based solely on your non-experience. Answer the man's question or be quiet...
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Old 01-05-2013, 09:26 PM   #65
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Mike,

You forgot this is the internet. Never going to happen (-:

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Old 01-06-2013, 12:07 AM   #66
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It always amazes me in forums like this one, when a person poses a question about a product, and asks for responses from people that have used them, the few individuals who somehow think the rest of us that want to learn something are not interested in your opinion, if you haven't used the product. After reviewing 5 pages of responses, those that have used them like them and stated why, very clearly. Those that have not used them seem to be on some sort of crusade to make sure that everyone knows their opinion on a product they have never used. Everyone can have their opinion, but common sense should tell you that no one wants to hear yours if you have nothing to contibute, except your opinion, based solely on your non-experience. Answer the man's question or be quiet...
Your are totally right

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Old 01-06-2013, 12:40 AM   #67
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[QUOTE="DaleM;1421562"]

Your are totally right :
The people that have Actually used these have epositive comments on if they work or not, the people with Zero experience have the negative comments. It's always the same. If you don't drive what I drive and drink what I drink then you are doing something seriously wrong.
Maybe need to ask questions different,
Those of you who have ACTUALLY used this product I'd like like to hear what you have to say about them and those who have Zero hands on experience I'd like NOT to hear yours

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Old 01-06-2013, 09:42 AM   #68
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Originally Posted by Mike Thomas View Post
It always amazes me in forums like this one, when a person poses a question about a product, and asks for responses from people that have used them, the few individuals who somehow think the rest of us that want to learn something are not interested in your opinion, if you haven't used the product. After reviewing 5 pages of responses, those that have used them like them and stated why, very clearly. Those that have not used them seem to be on some sort of crusade to make sure that everyone knows their opinion on a product they have never used. Everyone can have their opinion, but common sense should tell you that no one wants to hear yours if you have nothing to contibute, except your opinion, based solely on your non-experience. Answer the man's question or be quiet...
Wait.....did you just give us your opinion without adding anything, zero, zip, nada about Air Tabs ? Thats quite interesting ! Answer his question , but don't give us your opinion about how you think we should give our opinion. Its quite alright for everyone to discuss all sides here.
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Old 01-06-2013, 09:45 AM   #69
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interesting at the least
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Old 01-06-2013, 10:21 AM   #70
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If you have not used Air Tabs (I have) your opinion is worthless. Read the OP's question in post #1.

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