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Old 12-07-2013, 07:11 PM   #225
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Here is the solution, if you want a campfire you got. Now those that don't can be happy as well. Camco 58031 "Little Red Campfire" Propane Camp Fire : Amazon.com : Automotive
Sorry to rain on your parade but someone posted on this thread about the evils of LP due to fracking. Those among us who want everyone to live by their rules will not be appeased. If you try you are doomed.
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Old 12-07-2013, 10:25 PM   #226
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Steve

I know this is a bit of a segway move from campfires, well sort of, and I know you are refering to another post, could not find it, but can anyone cite one instance where fracking has caused a problem. I am no expert on this subject, but based on my research, there are thousands if not hundreds of thousands of fracked gas and oil wells in North America alone and I could not find one case where there has been a documented problem with that extraction methodology based on science. The EPA reports I have read indicate they could not find one case either. Hmmmm. Just wondering how or why fracking came up re the use of propane?

BTW I have had or been around hundreds if not thousands of campfires (never counted) in my 50+ years of RVing and more than 70 years of sitting around campfires. The last few years I just prefer my little red propane fire device because it is quick, no mess, no dangerous sparks or fear of it speading, no transporting insects in wood and very little, if any, bothersome smoke and this suits us fine, but a well controlled and reasonable wood campfire has its appeal to many, even to me, if I don't have to haul the wood or be responsible for the mess or any other liability associated with the open campfire.

I really do object to sparks from campfires burning holes in my awning though. It has happened to me because of careless inconsiderate nearby campers. Grrrr.
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Old 12-07-2013, 11:27 PM   #227
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Steve I know this is a bit of a segway move from campfires, well sort of, and I know you are refering to another post, could not find it, but can anyone cite one instance where fracking has caused a problem. I am no expert on this subject, but based on my research, there are thousands if not hundreds of thousands of fracked gas and oil wells in North America alone and I could not find one case where there has been a documented problem with that extraction methodology based on science. The EPA reports I have read indicate they could not find one case either. Hmmmm. Just wondering how or why fracking came up re the use of propane? BTW I have had or been around hundreds if not thousands of campfires (never counted) in my 50+ years of RVing and more than 70 years of sitting around campfires. The last few years I just prefer my little red propane fire device because it is quick, no mess, no dangerous sparks or fear of it speading, no transporting insects in wood and very little, if any, bothersome smoke and this suits us fine, but a well controlled and reasonable wood campfire has its appeal to many, even to me, if I don't have to haul the wood or be responsible for the mess or any other liability associated with the open campfire. I really do object to sparks from campfires burning holes in my awning though. It has happened to me because of careless inconsiderate nearby campers. Grrrr.
This is a great post. It sounds so much like me and my feelings on the matter, I thought for a minute I had written it myself.
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Old 12-08-2013, 05:37 AM   #228
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Let's get back on topic please.
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Old 12-08-2013, 07:02 AM   #229
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Seriously, that's what you're taking away from this?

I asked 3 times WHAT YOU WOULD DO if your fire was smoking me out, your response was WHAT I SHOULD DO.

That alone makes it obvious you feel no real responsibility for how you might affect those around you, it's their problem to deal with it the best they can. And I'm sure you're a real approachable guy, you'd love to have me come over and make suggestions on how to build a fire.
Still not sure why some are just so outright angry towards the smoke creating campers. How is anyone supposed to know that you may offend someone so much, especially when it's such a tiny fraction that don't like smoke?? You go to a campground. There's a fire ring at every site. They sell firewood at their store. They provide no rules. There's no laws. It's an open invitation to have a fire. People should go blame the campground instead. Maybe you should discuss with them the possibility of having some sites fire-free. Maybe a person should be more careful about selecting campgrounds. Or stay away from areas like BC, Washington and Oregon where campfires are an ordinary and accepted part of the outdoor experience. Or do your camping during fire bans?

Every time campers want to have a fire, should they have to go knock on all their neighbor's doors to see if it's okay? (But then, knocking on RV doors can be as equally offensive, so be careful.)

I could be wrong, but it seems like it is predominantly class A MH-ers that are bothered by smoke? If we pull into a cg with our TT and it's mostly MHs there, should we not have a fire or maybe turn around and go to another cg?

If you want to talk about offensive smoke, why is it where tobacco smoking is prohibited in public buildings, they all congregate outside the main entry and you have to wade through it to get inside? Even at hospitals. That's what I call offensive. I hate cigarette smoke with a passion, but you will run into it in lots of places and all you can do is deal with it and let it go. Should be the same for campfire smoke.

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Old 12-08-2013, 07:45 AM   #230
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Here is the solution, if you want a campfire you got. Now those that don't can be happy as well.

Camco 58031 "Little Red Campfire" Propane Camp Fire : Amazon.com : Automotive
There you go - the PERFECT solution to the "camp fire" dilemma.

People can have their fire, it can be cooked upon, it heats and gives off glow, just like a wood fire.

Pro's: No wood (hence no mess, no insects)
No smoke, little CO2 released
No possibility of starting wildfires

And the best part of all - no possibilities of floating burning embers messing up my awning!

I think this whole wood fire vs. "canned fire" is similar to a past issue of:

Artificial Christmas Tree vs. Natural Wood Christmas Tree. The biggest difference is that no one's Christmas tree ever burned holes in their neighbors awning.
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Old 12-08-2013, 07:57 AM   #231
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Still not sure why some are just so outright angry towards the smoke creating campers. How is anyone supposed to know that you may offend someone so much, especially when it's such a tiny fraction that don't like smoke?? You go to a campground. There's a fire ring at every site. They sell firewood at their store. They provide no rules. There's no laws. It's an open invitation to have a fire. People should go blame the campground instead. Maybe you should discuss with them the possibility of having some sites fire-free. Maybe a person should be more careful about selecting campgrounds. Or stay away from areas like BC, Washington and Oregon where campfires are an ordinary and accepted part of the outdoor experience. Or do your camping during fire bans? Every time campers want to have a fire, should they have to go knock on all their neighbor's doors to see if it's okay? (But then, knocking on RV doors can be as equally offensive, so be careful.) I could be wrong, but it seems like it is predominantly class A MH-ers that are bothered by smoke? If we pull into a cg with our TT and it's mostly MHs there, should we not have a fire or maybe turn around and go to another cg? If you want to talk about offensive smoke, why is it where tobacco smoking is prohibited in public buildings, they all congregate outside the main entry and you have to wade through it to get inside? Even at hospitals. That's what I call offensive. I hate cigarette smoke with a passion, but you will run into it in lots of places and all you can do is deal with it and let it go. Should be the same for campfire smoke.
Good points myredracer. I think the driver behind this anger in not the type of vehicle but whether the occupants have come to the lifestyle/activity later in life and have never been campers. Let's face it, what most of us do is not camping, but many if not most of us have camped for years or perhaps our lifetime. To most of us, a campfire is as much a part of the experience as the ever present picnic table. Most campgrounds with family appeal have a fireplace/ ring/pit at every site. You may have a point in that class A motorhomes are owned by a higher % of non campers than other types of RV. My wife and I have lived full time in our class A motorhome for 7 years now but I have camped all my life in tents, pop up, as a backpacker so I have an appreciation for what camping means to people. If you are smoke adverse, I suggest that you do a little more fact finding when you are picking destinations. If the campground has a provision for fires, no fire prohibition or as red racer points out, sells firewood, then you should look elsewhere or be prepared to "suck it up" when the inevitable smoke blows your way. I carry an LP fireplace with me (which will upset a different sort of "camper") and I rarely have a real fire anymore, but if you confront some one over his fire in a place where it's not prohibited, you can expect me and most other campers will be standing against you.
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Old 12-08-2013, 09:53 AM   #232
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I think most of you dont really camp, otherwise the fire would be a non issue. There is a big diffence between camping and rv parks/so called campgrounds.
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Old 12-08-2013, 10:57 AM   #233
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There you go - the PERFECT solution to the "camp fire" dilemma.

People can have their fire, it can be cooked upon, it heats and gives off glow, just like a wood fire.

Pro's: No wood (hence no mess, no insects)
No smoke, little CO2 released
No possibility of starting wildfires

And the best part of all - no possibilities of floating burning embers messing up my awning!

I think this whole wood fire vs. "canned fire" is similar to a past issue of:

Artificial Christmas Tree vs. Natural Wood Christmas Tree. The biggest difference is that no one's Christmas tree ever burned holes in their neighbors awning.
Fake Christmas trees and propane fires both lack the best element of the experience, the smell! I and most others like the smell of a campfire. With the price they charge for wood at campgrounds Propane would almost certainly be the cheaper option I would think but it greatly detracts from the whole experience.
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Old 12-09-2013, 07:17 PM   #234
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Going to a campground and complaining about smoke is like moving in next to a bombing range and complaining about noise.
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Old 12-09-2013, 08:33 PM   #235
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camp fires

Perhaps ignorance is not a bliss!
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Old 12-09-2013, 09:21 PM   #236
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Going to a campground and complaining about smoke is like moving in next to a bombing range and complaining about noise.
Or the ones I like best . The folks that move into a dwelling in the flight path of an Airport and start complaining about the noise and demand that be fixed. WHAT !
Or like the people that go to a Campground and ...........Oh never mind !
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Old 12-10-2013, 02:20 PM   #237
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Going to a campground and complaining about smoke is like moving in next to a bombing range and complaining about noise.
I can see a whole series of "Going to a campground and complaining about smoke..." sayings.

Here another.

Going to a campground and complaining about smoke is like moving next to the dump and complaining about the smell!
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Old 12-10-2013, 02:21 PM   #238
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Or...

Going to a campground and complaining about smoke is like going to a pro football game and complaining about the noise!
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