Go Back   iRV2 Forums > iRV2.com COMMUNITY FORUMS > iRV2.com General Discussion
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 01-07-2009, 08:56 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
Tom N's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Pond Piggies Club
Appalachian Campers
Mid Atlantic Campers
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA
Posts: 4,604
Yesterday I gassed up at Sam's Club in Ocala. I noticed a sign on the pump stating, "This fuel may contain up to 10% alcohol". First I've seen any mention of ethanol in gasoline in Florida.

-Tom
__________________

__________________
Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA FMCA 335149 W3TLN
2005 Suncruiser 38R W24, no chassis mods needed 2013 Honda Accord EX-L 2008 Honda Odyssey EX-L

Tom N is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 01-07-2009, 08:56 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
Tom N's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Pond Piggies Club
Appalachian Campers
Mid Atlantic Campers
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA
Posts: 4,604
Yesterday I gassed up at Sam's Club in Ocala. I noticed a sign on the pump stating, "This fuel may contain up to 10% alcohol". First I've seen any mention of ethanol in gasoline in Florida.

-Tom
__________________

__________________
Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA FMCA 335149 W3TLN
2005 Suncruiser 38R W24, no chassis mods needed 2013 Honda Accord EX-L 2008 Honda Odyssey EX-L

Tom N is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2009, 10:12 AM   #3
Senior Member
 
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: st.charles mo.
Posts: 1,194
We spend 6 months of the year in florida and every station I have used in the last two years has had those signs.
__________________
speed racer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2009, 10:31 AM   #4
Senior Member
 
Lindsay Richards's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Tavares, FL
Posts: 1,644
This is a state requirement (almost certain). It contains only about 75% as much energy per gallon and therefore gets less milage. You (as a taxpayer) are paying 51 cents a gallon subsidity for it also. This is an idea that just hasn't panned out and should be stopped. We have plenty of oil and natural gas waiting to be used.
__________________
http://www.linandnancy.com
Lindsay Richards is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2009, 12:43 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Tom N's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Pond Piggies Club
Appalachian Campers
Mid Atlantic Campers
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA
Posts: 4,604
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by speed racer:
We spend 6 months of the year in florida and every station I have used in the last two years has had those signs. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I must not have paid attention. First I've seen it and we've been here for 6 months the last 7 years.

-Tom
__________________
Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA FMCA 335149 W3TLN
2005 Suncruiser 38R W24, no chassis mods needed 2013 Honda Accord EX-L 2008 Honda Odyssey EX-L

Tom N is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2009, 01:58 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
RedneckExpress's Avatar
 
Vintage RV Owners Club
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Sauvie Island, OR
Posts: 2,353
Send a message via ICQ to RedneckExpress Send a message via AIM to RedneckExpress Send a message via MSN to RedneckExpress Send a message via Yahoo to RedneckExpress
Wonderful garbage, ethanol is. Been dealing with it here for a couple years now. Stuff's good at eating fuel filters.
__________________
'92 Dodge W250 "Dually" Power Wagon
'74
KIT 1106 Kamper Slide-in Truck Camper
'06 Heartland Bighorn 3400RL Fifth wheel
Follow along with me in the The Journey of
RedneckExpress is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2009, 04:33 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Aguanga, CA, USA
Posts: 238
Methanol is also an alcohol and I believe it can also be used up to 10% for unmodified cars, so it might not mean ethanol (but probably does).

As a replacement for oil, I agree that ethanol made from corn is highly questionable. However it should also be seen as an additive which increases octane rating and promotes cleaner burning of the fuel (less pollution). A few years back, at least here in CA, they used an additive called something like MTBE (I probably got those letters wrong, and I sure don't remember the full chemical name) to do much the same thing. Unfortunately it's highly toxic and got in the ground water from leaking filling station gas tanks. A real mess - so as an additive, ethanol may be preferable to the alternatives.
__________________
jspande is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-07-2009, 05:23 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
Tom N's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Pond Piggies Club
Appalachian Campers
Mid Atlantic Campers
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA
Posts: 4,604
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jspande:
As a replacement for oil, I agree that ethanol made from corn is highly questionable. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If there is another oil embargo or severe shortage I'll be glad we have the capability to utilize ethanol. Ethanol is not a viable replacement for oil when oil is less than $200 but it certainly is viable when oil is in short supply, IMHO.

-Tom
__________________
Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA FMCA 335149 W3TLN
2005 Suncruiser 38R W24, no chassis mods needed 2013 Honda Accord EX-L 2008 Honda Odyssey EX-L

Tom N is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 01:28 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,196
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tom N:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by jspande:
As a replacement for oil, I agree that ethanol made from corn is highly questionable. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If there is another oil embargo or severe shortage I'll be glad we have the capability to utilize ethanol. Ethanol is not a viable replacement for oil when oil is less than $200 but it certainly is viable when oil is in short supply, IMHO.

-Tom </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Tom,

What everyone seems to miss is that with a full 10% ethanol you can lose 20% fuel efficiecy so what took you 80 gallons of gas now can take 90 gallons of gas and an additional 10 gallons of ethanol.

They have wasted gasoline and tons of corn by putting 10% ethanol in. If you end up stuck where the station only has 15% ethanol you waste even more gasoline. It is insane that this thing ever got off the ground and put into practice.
__________________
Neil V
2001 Winnebago Adventurer WFG35U
NeilV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 06:45 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
Tom N's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Pond Piggies Club
Appalachian Campers
Mid Atlantic Campers
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA
Posts: 4,604
I'll more than gladly take the 10% ethanol when we're on odd/even days and/or 5 gallons max per visit. I remember the oil embargo chaos of the early 70's.

FWIW, I buy gas in VA and VA uses 10% ethanol. I have never seen more than a 10% loss, and mostly much less, in gas mileage in either my motorhome or my cars.

I thought VA was the only state between PA and FL that sold 10% ethanol until I saw the pumps at Sams Club the other day. I thought this was new for FL but someone corrected me and said ethanol has been added in FL for a couple years.

I never buy gas for my motorhome in FL because I always filled up in Brunswick, GA in the fall and that fill up was enough to get me to my FL destination and back to Brunswick in the spring.

I know there is a controversy concerning the amount of oil/gas needed to produce ethanol but I have never seen any substantiated proof that it takes more than a gallon of oil/gas to produce a gallon of ethanol. Maybe I'll asked one of the Iowa farmers parked here for the winter.

-Tom
__________________
Sarver, PA/Crystal River, FL/Shelocta, PA FMCA 335149 W3TLN
2005 Suncruiser 38R W24, no chassis mods needed 2013 Honda Accord EX-L 2008 Honda Odyssey EX-L

Tom N is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 07:04 AM   #11
Moderator Emeritus
 
Gary RVRoamer's Avatar


 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Silver Springs, FL. USA
Posts: 18,101
Florida's mandatory 10% ethanol law has some exceptions, the most notable one being that it is not required if ethanol blend costs more than pure, unblended gas, which it currently does.

Some info here: http://www.e0pc.com/FL.php
__________________
Gary Brinck
Former owner of 2004 American Tradition
Home is in the Ocala Nat'l Forest near Ocala, FL
Summers in Black Mountain, NC
Gary RVRoamer is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2009, 07:30 AM   #12
Senior Member
 
Lindsay Richards's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Tavares, FL
Posts: 1,644
The sticker on the pump says May contain 10% ethanol. Ethanol does contain less energy than gasoline. At 10%, it is hard for anybody to see a difference in milage with all of the other factors, but it does not have the energy of gasoline and as taxpayers, we are subdizing it at 51 cents per gallon. As far as avoiding the shortages of the 70's, we have huge reserves offshore and in Alaska and shortages are political, not through lack of crude. As a country, we have chosen to buy our energy from overseas and suffer whatever problems this will cause in the present or the future.
__________________
http://www.linandnancy.com
Lindsay Richards is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2009, 03:08 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,196
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Lindsay Richards:
The sticker on the pump says May contain 10% ethanol. Ethanol does contain less energy than gasoline. At 10%, it is hard for anybody to see a difference in milage with all of the other factors, but it does not have the energy of gasoline... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

On my 2001 F53 20,000lb chassis on my 3,600 mile fall trip I averaged over the 3,600 miles 10 on straight gas, 8 on up to 10% ethanol and 6 on up to 15% (it was that or nothing) ethanol.

On my 4 cylinder standard Saturn Vue it is 25 mpg straight gas and 20 mpg on up to 10%. I record every fillup and it is a very noticable difference.
__________________
Neil V
2001 Winnebago Adventurer WFG35U
NeilV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2009, 03:24 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Ray,IN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: North America somewhere
Posts: 13,713
Ethanol Production

The cost of producing ethanol varies with the cost of the feedstock used and the scale of production. Approximately 85 percent of ethanol production capacity in the United States relies on corn feedstock. The cost of producing ethanol from corn is estimated to be about $1.10 per gallon. Although there is currently no commercial production of ethanol from cellulosic feedstocks such as agricultural wastes, grasses and wood, the estimated production cost using these feedstocks is $1.15 to $1.43 per gallon.

Because a gallon of ethanol contains less energy than a gallon of gasoline, the production cost of ethanol must be multiplied by a factor of 1.5 to make an energy-cost comparison with gasoline. This means that if ethanol costs $1.10 per gallon to produce, then the effective cost per gallon to equal the energy contained in a gallon of gasoline is $1.65. In contrast, the current wholesale price of gasoline is about 90 cents per gallon.

The federal motor fuel excise tax on gasohol, a blended fuel of 10-percent ethanol and 90-percent gasoline, is 5.4 cents less per gallon than the tax on straight gasoline. In other words, the federal subsidy is 54 cents per gallon of ethanol when the ethanol is blended with gasoline. The subsidy makes ethanol-blended fuel competitive in the marketplace and stimulates the growth of an ethanol production and distribution infrastructure.

Source: oregon.gov
__________________

__________________
2000 Winnebago Ultimate Freedom USQ40JD, ISC 8.3 Cummins 350, Spartan MM Chassis. USA 1SG, retired;PPA,Good Sam Life member,FMCA."We the people are the rightful masters of both the Congress and the Courts - not to overthrow the Constitution but to overthrow men who pervert the Constitution. "Abraham Lincoln"
Ray,IN is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
10% Ethanol JnGOnTheGo Workhorse and Chevrolet Chassis Motorhome Forum 15 05-18-2008 03:05 PM
Ethanol Thudman Workhorse and Chevrolet Chassis Motorhome Forum 7 07-31-2007 09:49 AM
Mixing Premium and Ethanol? Old Snipe Workhorse and Chevrolet Chassis Motorhome Forum 16 05-13-2006 06:21 PM
E85 Ethanol G Christopherson Workhorse and Chevrolet Chassis Motorhome Forum 9 09-12-2005 09:13 PM
E85 Ethanol MH-General Discussions & Problems 9 12-31-1969 07:00 PM

» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:51 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.