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Old 05-16-2010, 04:14 PM   #99
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I'll bet if it starts pushing the lid open you'd be glad pay $20 to dump.
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Old 05-16-2010, 06:41 PM   #100
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Here's the sign that was on the Flying J dump station in Winchester, VA this morning.


That's about 4 hours from home so no way I could 'hold it in' that long. I dumped at Cabelas which is only about 55 minutes from home. Cabelas did not charge me but I have paid for that dump station in camping, fishing and hunting gear many times over.
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Old 05-16-2010, 08:00 PM   #101
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ALL this - and the enthusiastic support of some here for a business to start charging for services that previously were provided as a courtesy, free item, sorta make me wonder if those same folks would support pay toilets and showers in various restaurants and motels along their travel routes - after all - a business has a "right" to recover expenses, and to cope with rising costs...

Better start saving up our quarters, I suppose...

The inevitable question, now that it's started, is where will it end?
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Old 05-16-2010, 08:19 PM   #102
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after all - a business has a "right" to recover expenses, and to cope with rising costs...
This is actually exactly correct and nothing more really needs to be said. A business DOES have the right. The customer then makes a choice whether he choose to pay it or not. You also have the right to stop drinking milk when the price went up to $4/gallon and yet no one suggested that we do this. What makes Flying J any different. Face it folks, prices are going up. I would prefer to see FJ charge only the folks that use the dump $5 than see them raise the price of their fuel 1 or 2 cents and force those who don't use the dump to cover its cost. Free simply ain't free folks. Someone is going to pay. Should that be everyone or only the ones who use the particular service?
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Old 05-17-2010, 08:46 AM   #103
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Free simply ain't free folks. Someone is going to pay. Should that be everyone or only the ones who use the particular service?
Now, THAT, is a nugget O' wisdom and truth

Now if we could only apply that logic to TAXES, then all would be grand!
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Old 05-17-2010, 12:36 PM   #104
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Free simply ain't free folks. Someone is going to pay.
Which, in the case this thread addresses, dodges the central sticking point - it's TRUE that "nothing is free" - and in FACT, the FJ expense for operating the "free" RV dump was ALREADY factored into, and an established part of their business operation, for which ALL customers paid a small amount.

Then, suddenly, that expense was either not covered by previous estimates, or - more likely - FJ/Pilot saw a new revenue producing feature that could be exploited in their favor - so that RV dump still is underwritten as part of bottom-line operation, PLUS, the newly added ADDITIONAL charge that brings in still more revenue - I seriously doubt any OTHER costs of FJ operation have been REDUCED, now that the RV dump has a separate charge attached!

This is all pretty much an academic discussion item - relatively few RVers are actually affected - but the central issue of ANY existing business to set up and establish separate charges for "services" previously recognized and included as the basic cost of operation, and all prices set accordingly, might get to be sorta intrusive to customers who now have to pay for overnight parking at the motel or restaurant - or pay toilets, or...

All that stuff WAS figured in, and paid as PART of the original cost of operation, and prices set accordingly - so how far WILL customers go in enthusiastically supporting the new price structures that demand they pay even more for what they were ALREADY being charged for - whether they actually realized it or not?
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Old 05-18-2010, 01:14 AM   #105
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... it's TRUE that "nothing is free" - and in FACT, the FJ expense for operating the "free" RV dump was ALREADY factored into, and an established part of their business operation, for which ALL customers paid a small amount.

Then, suddenly, that expense was either not covered by previous estimates, or - more likely - FJ/Pilot saw a new revenue producing feature that could be exploited in their favor ...
The email I received from Flying J, when I inquired (so as to be able to update the Flying J listings in my website database) said that the change is to keep the Dump Stations from being a huge money-losing part of their business.

That may or may not be the entire story, and it doesn't really matter one way or the other. Those who believe it will say, "OK," and then make their own decisions -- to pay to dump at Flying J or to spend additional time and fuel to locate drive to another dump station. Those who think Flying J is just gouging RVers will simply do the latter.

For those who plan to look elsewhere to find a dump station, I hope you'll think twice about the amount of time you spend in your search, and the number of miles you'll drive to reach the dump station of choice. You don't have to drive very far in an RV to burn up $5 worth of gas, and unless you consider your time worthless, $5 worth of your time isn't very long.
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Old 05-18-2010, 09:07 AM   #106
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I think we all should write and or call, Wal Mart and DEMAND that they put in dump stations. How did K-Mart get left out of this discussion, shouldn't they be part of this new world order ?
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Old 05-18-2010, 09:10 AM   #107
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For those who plan to look elsewhere to find a dump station, I hope you'll think twice about the amount of time you spend in your search, and the number of miles you'll drive to reach the dump station of choice. You don't have to drive very far in an RV to burn up $5 worth of gas, and unless you consider your time worthless, $5 worth of your time isn't very long.

Get a macerator pump and every toilet on your route is a dump station, (ask permission first)
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Old 05-18-2010, 09:33 AM   #108
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Why don't we see these kinds of threads when they raise the price (or reduce the size) of your favorite candy bar? I just don't get why some people feel that they are somehow entitled to get something for nothing. Just because something was free or inexpensive doesn't mean that it always will be. Vote with your feet folks but my feet will be hitting the ground at Flying J next week just as they did yesterday.
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Old 05-18-2010, 09:54 AM   #109
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You have to pay for the FREE health care we are all going to get.

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Old 05-18-2010, 10:17 AM   #110
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It's FJ's or Pilots business to run as a for profit corp. Not too many places where you can get fuel, propane, dump and many times get fresh water, eat, and sleep for a few hours, at the same place on the road at reasonable prices. Note, I did not say cheapest prices. My time and fuel costs to ride around to find free dump stations or cheaper propane are more useful being part of my travel plans as we are not retired yet. I appreciate a stop like FJ as they offer all the amenities in one driving break. If $5 for dumping is needed to maintain the availability of the service then so be it. The alternative could be no dump stations at FJs. Anyone not willing to pay for the service can surely expend the time and energy to hold it till they find a free dump station. The overnight RV park is also an alternative, of course it is included as part of the price there.
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Old 05-18-2010, 11:53 AM   #111
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I think we all should write and or call, Wal Mart and DEMAND that they put in dump stations. How did K-Mart get left out of this discussion, shouldn't they be part of this new world order ?
I've carefully avoided comment in that direction - but since you bring it up...

A short spot-check of the FJ RV dump price increase supporters posting in this thread, shows that MANY so willing and eager to pay MORE at FJ, are the SAME vocal ones in the Walmart threads proudly carefully taking advantage of that "Walmart courtesy" - and other similar "freebee RV camping" - to SAVE a few bucks...

Sort of a double standard in regards to actual, real-life "liberality" and generosity?

RV dumping has NEVER been an issue for us - because the dump service is provided to us as part of the price of our stay in the CG or RV parks we prefer to use - we don't NEED or use the services at FJ or any other similar facility. And yes, we pay for the dump service at the CG's too, as part of the cost of our stay - it's all part of the RVing lifestyle we recognized and accepted in the beginning - and when we can no longer see fit to pay for overnight stays along our travel route, it will be time to get out of RVing.

YUP - off topic - and probably quickly deleted - but worth pointing out!

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I just don't get why some people feel that they are somehow entitled to get something for nothing
I haven't seen anyone claiming that at all - only a reference to changing operating practices at the "new FJ/Pilot" - plus the recognition that all FJ customers have ALREADY been paying for the RV dump facility, as a built-in cost and pricing of FJ goods and services - this latest separate charge is simply added to what was already a long standing charge being included in all the costs of goods and services at FJ - it never WAS "free", and is now even less so...

This topic has now been pretty well beat to death, and now starting to run in circles - so I'm done here...

Best regards to all!
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Old 05-18-2010, 12:41 PM   #112
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Once upon a time a semi pulled up to the dumper at Carlyle Pa. Pa. is rcognized as a puppy-mill state, but that's for another time. Anyway, as you guessed, the box trailer was fitted out as a rolling kennel with slop troughs installed all along the cage floors. This guy spent about two hours moving dogs around and hosing everything down. Yep, you guessed it. It even was fitted out with everything needed to hook up to the dumper. This guy was found guilty in my court of private opinion of usurping your privileges at the FJ dumper. And no, he did not buy fuel on the way in or on the way out. Good luck!!
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