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Old 02-14-2016, 06:24 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Selah View Post
Just out of curiosity, what work would you be doing on a gas unit that you would not , or could not, do on a diesel?
My decision was based on cost more then ability.

I still can do the diesel work but no longer have access to the cranes, jacks, and large tools to do it.

An example would be a radiator replacement.

My E450 radiator weighs about 30 lbs, maybe and cost $200. They are in stock everywhere.

A diesel radiator will weigh 75 to100 lbs, mounted to a charge air cooler, that may have to come out together, and cost in the area of $2000. Many of them are built to order.

Then there is the fan hub that should be serviced, since you can access it, along with the extra gallons of coolant to deal with.

Everything is repairable, you just need bigger tools a bigger place to work and it cost more to do it.
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Old 02-14-2016, 10:00 AM   #16
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Twinboat, my hat is off to you. I did that sort of stuff when I was younger....much younger. That's now past what this old fart is willing to tackle. Ill do routine maintenance and more that happy to do interior work but the "heavy lifting" is now left to other more capable hands.
Beside, it would probably cost me more in beer and Advil.
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Old 02-14-2016, 10:12 AM   #17
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Gas - no regrets.

Why you ask - I only drive it 3 to 4,000 miles a year so don't need an expensive engine capable of high mileage/heavy load hauling, fuel is cheaper, and I understand gas engines.
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Old 02-14-2016, 10:29 AM   #18
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Gas - no regrets.

Why you ask - I only drive it 3 to 4,000 miles a year so don't need an expensive engine capable of high mileage/heavy load hauling, fuel is cheaper, and I understand gas engines.
X2 that about sums up my choice also
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Old 02-14-2016, 10:48 AM   #19
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About 45 years ago I started tinkering with engines, and systems. Started with motorcycles (still doing it), and proceeded to cars, trucks, boats, and airplanes. We own five cars, one truck, three motorcycles, one class A, and one airplane. I work on all of them. Like many other posters in this thread, I don't like anyone working on my stuff, and I don't trust anyone.

I was never formally educated in mechanical work (retired military officer), but after 45 years, I am well capable in diagnostics, and repairs (and not just replacing parts).

I drove Class A with 460 Ford for 3000 miles total (two trips), and I sold it for diesel. Ford was extremely reliable, but GUTLESS. The rig was 34' long, and would do Cajon Pass in CA at barely 25mph. That's not acceptable to me. I sold the gasser, and purchased 40' DP, with 350HP Cat, and Alison World. This thing doesn't care whether it's on flat or on the grade (same speed). I chose the model that has side radiator, so I can access the big cat from behind (for belts, oil changes, and routine maintenance). For bigger repairs, I'll still have to go through the floor, but I'm not afraid of that.

No repair man will ever enter my living quarters. If I need tire changes, axle work, shocks, airbags, etc. I'll let the "grease monkeys" do that. Engine, and all "house systems" are mine to work with.

Diesel all the way for me.
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Old 02-14-2016, 11:38 AM   #20
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Old 02-14-2016, 01:16 PM   #21
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I'm thinking the biggest difference in working on these things is how they're configured and the access to different parts. I'm a little like Danielsand with 5 bikes, 4 cars, 1 TC, 1 class A MH, and a homebuilt aircraft still waiting to be finished. And there is the house, and.....silly me I decided to learn to play a sax at 73. I'm 76 now and very much under water with all the maintenance and learning to be done.

Back to the gas diesel thing, I know removing and replacing the radiator on any "normally configured" vehicle that we've had, diesel or gas, is much easier and less costly than doing the same thing to our class A gas Flair that I just finished. IMHO, I would place working on that thing alongside working on a boat, bike, or aircraft for accessibility to parts. Just getting to the Flair radiator required removing the AC condenser first, which then required discharging, replacing the receiver drier, evacuating, and then recharging the AC system. I honestly don't know, but find it difficult to understand why it would more difficult with a DP, except weight and carrying parts through the coach as mentioned.

I think I'll go play my sax :-))

Steve
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Old 02-15-2016, 07:40 AM   #22
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I'm thinking the biggest difference in working on these things is how they're configured and the access to different parts. I'm a little like Danielsand with 5 bikes, 4 cars, 1 TC, 1 class A MH, and a homebuilt aircraft still waiting to be finished. And there is the house, and.....silly me I decided to learn to play a sax at 73. I'm 76 now and very much under water with all the maintenance and learning to be done.

Back to the gas diesel thing, I know removing and replacing the radiator on any "normally configured" vehicle that we've had, diesel or gas, is much easier and less costly than doing the same thing to our class A gas Flair that I just finished. IMHO, I would place working on that thing alongside working on a boat, bike, or aircraft for accessibility to parts. Just getting to the Flair radiator required removing the AC condenser first, which then required discharging, replacing the receiver drier, evacuating, and then recharging the AC system. I honestly don't know, but find it difficult to understand why it would more difficult with a DP, except weight and carrying parts through the coach as mentioned.

I think I'll go play my sax :-))

Steve
I sold my 42' boat five years ago. I miss the ocean, but not working on that thing (twin engines). Kneeling in the bilge, squatting, bent over......no fun. With the airplane is the opposite,......up and down the ladder, lifting heavy parts above your shoulders.....but you know it all too. AFA, "removing A/C" on the motorhome......how about 12 cyl Jaguar (I love the thing!)? You HAVE TO remove a/c compressor (and the belts!) in order to change two spark plugs!

When I was about to buy this DP, I was looking ONLY at ones that have the side rad, and the engine wide open. When I need to get to the top of the Cat, I'll put some drop cloth all the way through the galley, and the bath, and take the mattress out. It'll be kneeling, and bending over just like on the boat again.

I just spent three days buffing/polishing, and waxing my 40' DP. It reminded me on the time when I pulled my boat out of the water in Newport Beach first time, for the same purpose. I looked at that thing and said: "F*** ME!"

This time wife said "why don't you just pay someone to do it"......($2000 for a complete detail in and out). First.....I owned carwash/detail businesses for 8 years, I polished and waxed vehicles before my wife was born. Second,.....there are so many hacks in this business, and I don't want to risk having swirls in my paint, and/or burned trim. And did I mention that I don't trust anyone?

After three days inside, and three days outside, she looks better than she ever did, except the day she rolled off of the assembly line.

An old man told me long time ago: "If you want something done the right way first time, you have to do it yourself." Been doing it ever since.
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Old 02-15-2016, 08:06 AM   #23
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The gas-diesel debate rages on

I've pulled our 5er with a Ford V10 and now their 6.7 diesel.

I really prefer the diesel as it comes over the top of a hill at the speed limit in 4th or 5th gear, not breathing/screaming hard in 2nd or 3rd trying to get back to near the speed limit (55-65mph, not the 80 of the West).

What I don't prefer are the $100 oil changes and $75 fuel filter changes along with the $150 coolant changes with a $75 mid term additive vs the $30 oil change, $12 fuel filter and $60 coolant change. I also need $25 of DEF fluid every 5K miles, a couple spare $40 EGTs and a spare $25 fuel filter cap just in case. Oh and those costs are DIY dollars. Now, if my 2011 Job 1 truck has an engine failure or fuel system problem, it's $12-18K or so. The V10 would have been $5-7000.

We have a couple long trips planned for this summer. After that, I may just go back to that gas engined truck as this one is getting a bit long of tooth and $$$ might be needed soon.
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Old 02-15-2016, 09:31 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Danielsand View Post
About 45 years ago I started tinkering with engines, and systems. Started with motorcycles (still doing it), and proceeded to cars, trucks, boats, and airplanes. We own five cars, one truck, three motorcycles, one class A, and one airplane. I work on all of them. Like many other posters in this thread, I don't like anyone working on my stuff, and I don't trust anyone.

I was never formally educated in mechanical work (retired military officer), but after 45 years, I am well capable in diagnostics, and repairs (and not just replacing parts).

I drove Class A with 460 Ford for 3000 miles total (two trips), and I sold it for diesel. Ford was extremely reliable, but GUTLESS. The rig was 34' long, and would do Cajon Pass in CA at barely 25mph. That's not acceptable to me. I sold the gasser, and purchased 40' DP, with 350HP Cat, and Alison World. This thing doesn't care whether it's on flat or on the grade (same speed). I chose the model that has side radiator, so I can access the big cat from behind (for belts, oil changes, and routine maintenance). For bigger repairs, I'll still have to go through the floor, but I'm not afraid of that.

No repair man will ever enter my living quarters. If I need tire changes, axle work, shocks, airbags, etc. I'll let the "grease monkeys" do that. Engine, and all "house systems" are mine to work with.

Diesel all the way for me.
Your list of vehicles including the aircraft is what I went through also. Now I just want a much simpler life.
If I had spent my time at a desk I might not feel this way but busting wrenches has taken the spunk out of this old body. And I don't even miss the aircraft.Now it's just stuff!
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Old 02-15-2016, 09:36 AM   #25
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I'm thinking the biggest difference in working on these things is how they're configured and the access to different parts. I'm a little like Danielsand with 5 bikes, 4 cars, 1 TC, 1 class A MH, and a homebuilt aircraft still waiting to be finished. And there is the house, and.....silly me I decided to learn to play a sax at 73. I'm 76 now and very much under water with all the maintenance and learning to be done.

Back to the gas diesel thing, I know removing and replacing the radiator on any "normally configured" vehicle that we've had, diesel or gas, is much easier and less costly than doing the same thing to our class A gas Flair that I just finished. IMHO, I would place working on that thing alongside working on a boat, bike, or aircraft for accessibility to parts. Just getting to the Flair radiator required removing the AC condenser first, which then required discharging, replacing the receiver drier, evacuating, and then recharging the AC system. I honestly don't know, but find it difficult to understand why it would more difficult with a DP, except weight and carrying parts through the coach as mentioned.

I think I'll go play my sax :-))

Steve
My hat goes off to you. I hope I'm still walking at 76.
But don't you feel overwhelmed ?
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Old 02-15-2016, 09:48 AM   #26
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Why did you choose either?
In many cases, it is a simple question of weight. Might help the topic if the parameters for the discussion were better defined. One person will be talking about a 45', 60,000 lb coach and the next person a 30', 16,000 coach. They are two entirely different things.
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Old 02-15-2016, 10:07 AM   #27
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JFNM,

A good response. Many people think they are comparing similar motorhomes, but except for gas vs. Diesel coaches in the lengths where they overlap, most comparisons are flawed because they are talking about two different products.


Quote:
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In many cases, it is a simple question of weight. Might help the topic if the parameters for the discussion were better defined. One person will be talking about a 45', 60,000 lb coach and the next person a 30', 16,000 coach. They are two entirely different things.
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Old 02-15-2016, 10:09 AM   #28
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Your list of vehicles including the aircraft is what I went through also. Now I just want a much simpler life.
If I had spent my time at a desk I might not feel this way but busting wrenches has taken the spunk out of this old body. And I don't even miss the aircraft.Now it's just stuff!
I lived the "life of danger/action", and I miss it. I get bored easily (I don't watch TV, news depress me, politics disgust me, and I'm not religious). I NEED to have "something to do" at all times, and the ONLY time I sit still, is early in the morning, when I'm on the web. According to my wife (who is professional), I am hopelessly OCD, but to ME, that's "normal".

I'll be 61 later this year, and my body looks like I'm 40, but it doesn't feel that way in the evening. As long as I'm on the move, there are no pains (brain blocks them in the heat of "action"), but at night.......it's painfully obvious that all that action in the uniform (and out of it) took it's toll. When I was in my 30s (and in the midst of some well known conflicts), I never thought I will live to be 40 (and I was OK with that). Faith tricked me, and there is a distinct possibility I might even hit 80! And THAT frightens me.

I don't take ANY medication, and the adrenaline produced by my body is what I "self medicate" with. I am afraid of "simple life", and boredom. Working with machinery relaxes me. Diagnosing/solving problems keeps me sharp, and the brain working.

I am not attached to any of my possessions, and I agree it's "just stuff". But this "stuff" keeps me occupied, and somewhat "sane" (wife would disagree with "sane" ).
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