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Old 04-22-2014, 12:44 PM   #15
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Well not true as the dealer sold the vehicle not you, therefore you will only be responseable for the difference for sales tax.

Not really because the dealer would be returning the cash to the original owner so it would be treated as if the dealer had sold it on consignment and then sold the new rig to the original owner. It becomes two separate sales with the cash going to the owner of the older rig that was sold. I've dealt with enough sales tax auditors to know that they deal with the letter of the law, not the intent of the transaction.
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Old 04-22-2014, 12:46 PM   #16
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Sounds like the escrow account to hold the money is the best way to go. (Or call an attorney and see what the options are.) Good luck.
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Old 04-22-2014, 01:28 PM   #17
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I'd tell the dealer you want the funds placed in a Escrow account with both your names on it. Once the new unit is delivered and you accept delivery you can sign off on your end. This should give both him and you a warm fuzzy feeling as it protects both of you as long as he delivers what you ordered and all is O K at time of pick up.
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Old 04-22-2014, 05:14 PM   #18
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If by "possession" you meant title that complicates matters a bit. But can't you just hold the title you have until the dealer completes his part of the agreement to deliver your new MH to you. That makes it so he cannot deliver your old one to the new purchaser and the pressure is on him. He owes his part of the transaction to make it complete and I would believe legal. It seems to me you do not have a problem he does so let him sweat the details, but do not surrender the title otherwise he is off the hook.

Without the title for the new buyer he does not have a sale, without your MH he does not have a sale. He may lose both if he messes around any longer.
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Old 04-22-2014, 06:24 PM   #19
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If by "possession" you meant title that complicates matters a bit. But can't you just hold the title you have until the dealer completes his part of the agreement to deliver your new MH to you. That makes it so he cannot deliver your old one to the new purchaser and the pressure is on him. He owes his part of the transaction to make it complete and I would believe legal. It seems to me you do not have a problem he does so let him sweat the details, but do not surrender the title otherwise he is off the hook. Without the title for the new buyer he does not have a sale, without your MH he does not have a sale. He may lose both if he messes around any longer.
I would be very cautious with this advice and would suggest you consult legal council before you consider withholding your title much longer. While I am not a lawyer, I was in business long enough to have my fair share of experience with contracts and performance responsibilities. Verbal conversations and "actions" hold considerable legal consequences and the fact that you left your RV with the Dealer will likely shift the responsibility to you to prove that he was obligated to just "store" it on your behalf and not sell it? If withholding the title causes the Dealer's sale to collapse you could find yourself being sued for damages as the buyer threatens to sue the Dealer and the Dealer threatens to sue you!

BTW... Are you sure you didn't sign any kind of a contract or agreement for your new MH? If you are not very careful you could find yourself owning 2motorhomes and possibly spending a considerable amount of $$$$ & time helping your lawyer pick-out the options for his new Mercedes as he tries to unwind this mess in your favor. If I were you I'd proceed with caution and probably seek advice from my lawyer to be sure I knew my obligations and my exposure before I became too confrontational..... good luck!
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Old 04-22-2014, 06:58 PM   #20
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Since none of us have a copy of your contract, I sure hope you read and understood what you signed. My guess is that you signed a contract that gave the dealer the right to sell your MH (hopefully at some minimum price). This plus your deposit are what you are putting down on the new MH. The sales tax would only apply to the purchase price of the new MH and has nothing to do with the trade.
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Old 04-22-2014, 08:49 PM   #21
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I would be very cautious with this advice and would suggest you consult legal council before you consider withholding your title much longer. While I am not a lawyer, I was in business long enough to have my fair share of experience with contracts and performance responsibilities. Verbal conversations and "actions" hold considerable legal consequences and the fact that you left your RV with the Dealer will likely shift the responsibility to you to prove that he was obligated to just "store" it on your behalf and not sell it? If withholding the title causes the Dealer's sale to collapse you could find yourself being sued for damages as the buyer threatens to sue the Dealer and the Dealer threatens to sue you!

BTW... Are you sure you didn't sign any kind of a contract or agreement for your new MH? If you are not very careful you could find yourself owning 2motorhomes and possibly spending a considerable amount of $$$$ & time helping your lawyer pick-out the options for his new Mercedes as he tries to unwind this mess in your favor. If I were you I'd proceed with caution and probably seek advice from my lawyer to be sure I knew my obligations and my exposure before I became too confrontational..... good luck!
Jack1234 makes good observations here and I take no umbrage that they take my commentary to task. I actually was asking a question however in this circumstance my attempt sounds directive.
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Old 04-22-2014, 09:29 PM   #22
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I like the idea of escrow. How can the dealership not understand the risk to yourself on that point?

Can they assure you they will be in business at time of delivery of your new coach.

If they won't meet you in the middle this way, they are bad business and don't give a you know what about you.
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Old 04-22-2014, 09:55 PM   #23
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Thanks for everyone's response. I signed a simple buyers order stating what I will pay difference between my coach and the new one and on the contract it states that they can pick my trade in up in mid March and when the new coach will be delivered.
That is the contract and I signed a production report of the options on the ordered coach
I know that dealers have payoffs on trade ins very often and they have to wait on titles so I do not understand the rush because he has the trade in and money paid on my trade in and he has no investment.
I do owe $85,000 difference but I worry about the new coach not being as I ordered then I am in a bad position
Oh well time will tell
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Old 04-22-2014, 10:11 PM   #24
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Was your trade-in free and clear of any liens?

Have you had conversations with the dealer about your concerns?
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Old 04-23-2014, 11:37 AM   #25
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As a dealer, I will give you this advise. I have run across just this situation many times. A trade is sold before the deal is consummated . DO NOT I repeat DO NOT give them the title. You are correct, there are many situations where it takes a while for the dealer to get title to a vehicle they sold. Your example of a coach having a payoff is one. Some banks drag their feet and we might not get title for 6 or 8 weeks. By withholding title, you put the pressure on the dealer to get your new coach to you as fast as possible. Trust me they do not want to get their attorneys or yours involved and neither should you at this point. The dealer has one thing in mind and one thing only and that is keeping two deals together and making profit. He will do whatever it takes to keep them together. He will stall the buyer of your coach, urge the factory to move yours along ect, ect ect. Don't worry about it, June is right around the corner. Usually the big issue that arrises when getting title is a problem is the new owner being able to drive his coach because he may not have license plates. In this case you said he traded a coach so he probably transferred his old ones or if he did get new ones, he has a 90 day tag. The dealer won't hear boo about the title to your trade until either the bank the new owner financed through starts calling or if he paid cash the new owner starts calling. In any case it can easily be put off by the dealer in a few ways. Most likely he will tell them he's waiting on a bank to provide it or it was a lost title and he had to apply for a new one. Trust me your dealer knows how to work the system. If it makes you feel better, have him put the funds in escrow. You took a chance and your payoff to the bet was hedged against a greater trade value. The way I see it, you both won.
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Old 04-23-2014, 12:26 PM   #26
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Give them the title. But, wait, only after you get it in writing from the dealer's officer that has the power to honor such a promise.

The letter should state that they agreed on the price of the new coach as negotiated in the amount of $$$$$$$.

That they have received $$$$$ from you in cash money to be deducted from the agreed price of the new coach.

That they have received your coach as a trade in on the new coach in the amount of $$$$$$ to be deducted from the agreed price of the new coach.

That they have already sold your trade in and are requesting the title so they can close that deal.

That they agree to return the $$$$$ cash deposit and the cash value previously given to you on your trade in if they do not respond ,in writing, to this letter in 2 working days.

You will then agree to turn over the title of your trade in to them.

Have your lawyer put the above in proper legal form , notarized if needed, and sent to the dealer via best and fastest way.

This would only take about half a day if you do all the foot work to keep every thing flowing as it should be.
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Old 04-23-2014, 12:26 PM   #27
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Help with dealer selling my trade in before I have received my coach that was ordered

My experience is that my coach was in winter storage and could not be handed over to the dealer when the contract was signed. I did give them the no lien title and there was an understanding that once the trade in could be taken out of storage we would take possession of the new one. However, the dealer never prepped the new coach in the interim and gave me a ready date of 3 weeks in the future. He wanted the trade soonest, but I told them they could have it when I picked up the new one. I know they have several people interested in it. My only leverage is the trade at this point. Hopefully, the prep will be to my satisfaction and I can move forward with the new coach. I enabled the dealer to take the coach off his books , his insurance, etc, and did not gotten the benefits of the new coach yet. My bad. Tomorrow is delivery day
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Old 04-23-2014, 01:17 PM   #28
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Was your trade-in free and clear of any liens?

Have you had conversations with the dealer about your concerns?
Yes my trade did not have any liens

Yes I have and he said he needed the title by the end of April because the person who purchased it needs to get the tag for it
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