Go Back   iRV2 Forums > iRV2.com COMMUNITY FORUMS > iRV2.com General Discussion
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 07-25-2016, 12:03 AM   #1
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 9
Putting a rear ramp door on a perfectly good Class A

I wanted to ask for advice on putting a rear ramp door on a perfectly good Class A. (like a toy hauler or commercial twin swing out doors) I found a toy hauler ramp with hinge rust locally for a few hundred dollars.
Why?
I am thinking about changing my a rear bedroom w/ door into a garage.
Currently I tow a Gem Cart flatbed with cooler and shell on a trailer.
It's used for concessions; soda/snacks/ice cream, like a golf course beer cart.
It is 12 ft long and about 1500 lbs empty. I may bring my icemaker too.

On the bright side I could free up the tow hitch and sell the trailer.

Please tell me if that's a dumb Idea. I can take it.
I am thinking about obstacles like suspension, weight, brakes, tires.
Also , with this weight inside, mostly behind the Tag, will I forever give up towing a toad?

Oh this is a 1990 Osh/Ford 460 FW Bounder 40 ft. 2 door tag.
I travel alone so I can be comfortable without the rear bedroom and closet.

Thanks for your advice or links.
I did not find similar in my search or youtube yet.
TomClick image for larger version

Name:	40 ft Bounder rear panel.png
Views:	94
Size:	194.2 KB
ID:	134120

Click image for larger version

Name:	40 ft Bounder rear pass side.png
Views:	92
Size:	393.8 KB
ID:	134121

Click image for larger version

Name:	40 ft Bounder bdrm closet.png
Views:	91
Size:	324.8 KB
ID:	134122

Click image for larger version

Name:	40 ft Bounder bdrm.png
Views:	89
Size:	336.4 KB
ID:	134123

Click image for larger version

Name:	40 ft Bounder rear dr side.png
Views:	90
Size:	317.8 KB
ID:	134124
__________________

__________________
WestOfRockie is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 07-25-2016, 05:50 AM   #2
Senior Member
 
Rockwood27's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Nor'easters Club
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Freedom, NH
Posts: 933
I would weigh the Bounder (ready for travel mode) to find out how much reserve carrying capacity, if any, you have on the rear and tag axles. I would then guesstimate the weight of the bedroom stuff removed, the weight of the toy hauler door added, possibly the weight of a partition wall added and the weight of the Gem. My guess is that Bounder is already near or even over on RAWR.
__________________

__________________
Fran, Mary & Zoey (silver Cocker)
2006 Itasca Sunrise 35A, 2005 W-22, Allison 1000 5 speed
'13 Ford Focus ST or '10 Prius on Master Tow Dolly 80THD-SB or '00 Jeep Cherokee 4-down
Rockwood27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 06:54 AM   #3
Senior Member
 
Chuck_Hammer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Upper Right Ohio.. or?
Posts: 391
the rear wall. is the end support for roof and both outside walls...
you will NEED to add a forward strong wall at front of garage AND reinforce area for garage door and wall, roof, floor supports.


PLUS, as already stated.. Weight, and more Weight.


doable Yes, Cost and Work is another story.
__________________
2012 Ford F 250,"XL" 6.2L Gas, 2 wheel drive. 153,000 miles
2005 Coachmen 29FKCS, Front Kitchen... 2005 Honda VTX1800F
N.E. Ohio in the Spring, Summer, Autumn.
Chuck_Hammer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 07:16 AM   #4
Senior Member
 
Selah's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,297
Just my guess: I would think the cost of retrofitting the Bounder would exceed the cost of trading the Bounder for a used toy hauler like an Outlaw.
Not to mention that unless you do a very very good job the residual values of the Bounder would be zero.
__________________
Paul, Kathy, and Tux the Mini Schnauzer
2014 Tiffin Phaeton 42 LH, 2013 Honda CRV
"When the time comes to look back, make sure you'll like what you see"
Selah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 12:04 PM   #5
Junior Member
 
mad59son's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 29
Aesthetics aside, which could be a challenge based on your abilities, I would think that the floor, back wall, and maybe even roof would need to be reinforced. There is a reason why toy haulers are considerably more heavy than a conventional RV. But hey, if Walter White can make a mobile meth lab out of a Bounder, a toy hauler should certainly be possible.
__________________
2006 Pilgrim 322FKDS pulled with a 2008 F350 Lariat w/6.4PSD hauling two wheeled toys of all kinds. I like wheels and things attached to them.
mad59son is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 12:08 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Glenn and Kathy's Avatar
 
National RV Owners Club
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Arizona high country
Posts: 1,142
It's a 1990 bounder, I would think resale value would be the least consideration in this conversion.

Glenn
__________________
2006 Sea Breeze LX 8341 on a Workhorse W22 Chassis with 22.5 Alcoa Alum wheels,
2011 Chevy Colorado 4X4 with Ready Brake
Glenn and Kathy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 01:01 PM   #7
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 9
Thanks for the first responses,
You got my gears turning.


​Rockwood 27
guesstimate the weight of the bedroom stuff removed, the weight of the toy hauler door added, possibly the weight of a partition wall added
Yes, WEIGHT
Q a. Would anyone wish to guess the weight of the
1. Upper Bdrm wood cabinets (full width) ?? 200lbs ??
2. nightstands and bed storage base (2 drawers) mattress mirror ?? 200lbs ??
3. hanging clothes Closet 4' x 2' with upper cabinets ?? 100lbs ??
4. Rear wall and exterior Cap ?? 200-300 lbs ??
This may be same as replacement doors or ramp?

Chuck
the rear wall. is the end support for roof and both outside walls...AND reinforce area for garage door and wall, roof, floor supports.

Q b. I think I will need to see inside the rear wall frame to know what currently exists to tie into for a strong header and footer brace. I have looked at toy haulers and they don't look all that robust.
1. I'm not successful finding the Fleetwood 1990 Bounder documents to see framing style / details. I will plan to go to RV repair facility at some point to see examples and talk to them.
2. I was thinking of a welded steel box frame for the rear perimeter before I determine what size door to purchase. The door I saw has only an aluminum frame.
3. Should I consider the Upper Bdrm wood cabinets (full width) are currently structural?
​4. I certainly want to do this without disturbing either side wall. It does not need to be full width. The GEM is less than 5 ft wide with mirrors out. ​

you will NEED to add a forward strong wall at front of garage

Q c. Behind the closet is the 5 ft bathroom plumbing wall with 3 ft sink/counter and end of shower/bath. (and framed bdrm/hallway door)
1. Is this a sufficient front partition wall, if rear wall is steel framed? (I may need the few inches)
2. I could put another full width header support at least (or do I need a full stud wall?)


Selah and Glenn
Not to mention that unless you do a very very good job the residual values of the Bounder would be zero

Q d. Good point, a one of a kind will have fewer potential buyers ... but there are some toy people out there on the low end of market. It's already 25+ years old or so.
Fortunately, I don't have much investment into it to lose.
On the other hand, a rear screened patio deck is popular these days to add value.


1. Should I consider utilizing parts of the rear body cap (skin) to maintain a somewhat normal appearance.
2. Maybe I should plan to make it easy to replace the bedroom in the future. (Store instead of selling old stuff)
3. You make me think about raising a bed platform to the ceiling like I see on some newer Toy haulers (for when cart/toy is outside).


mad59son
Aesthetics aside, which could be a challenge based on your abilities

Q e. Yes that is true about me. Silly me, heck I'm selling concession at fairs instead of the good snuff haha

Yes, thanks I will look at more hefty toy hauler door and floor setups first.


Thanks, please keep it coming,
Tom


__________________
WestOfRockie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 01:12 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
TonyMac's Avatar
 
Monaco Owners Club
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Layton, Utah
Posts: 984
Your weights are way overstated, I bet your upper cabinets weigh less than 50 pounds. I'd be when you remove the bedroom weight, you'll put it all back on and further aft with the door and all its hardware.


And remember, if you put X pounds Y feet behind the rear axel, you create XY force, removing XY from the front axel and putting that on the rear axel as well as the X weight.


Fraught with danger.
__________________
Cheers,
TonyMac
2006 Monaco Safari Cheetah 40PMT
TonyMac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 01:27 PM   #9
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 9
Ah yes, the power of leverage.


Tom
__________________
WestOfRockie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 03:43 PM   #10
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 9
The GEM is 72volt, qty 6 12v = 540 pounds plus
(deep cycle batteries Deka 31g) 2 in front, 4 midpoint.

It's not easy but ....
I may have to set up my batteries to put 4 of them (360 lbs) into a drop tray under the flatbed.
A cheap harbor freight winch may make it manageable to R&R the tray.

I could drive in forward and have the heavy 2 batteries and motor/trans over the tag axel.
The tray could be rolled forward of the RV's rear axels for travel.
I also have a good 72 volt inverter/charger so I could use the pack for house batteries.

Tom
__________________
WestOfRockie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 04:56 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: PNW
Posts: 172
Along with the weight consideration and what you carry in the garage you need to look at the actual frame of the MH. That chassis did not have a tag from Oshkosh but was added by Fleetwood (or at least that is how I think it was done). When they add a tag to a gas mh they usually extend the original frame and certify it for how they see the MH being used. Sometimes the extended frame piece is smaller then the original, could be butt welded, bolted together using splicing plates. All things to look at and consider.

Converting to a garage might place a heavy load where it was not designed to be carried even though the total weight is under the axle allowance (again think leverage). I am not saying it can not be done but thinking of things that might need to be looked at carefully as you proceed.

Another resource to look at is the skoolie bus conversion people. I know some have added garages and although it would be a different vehicle (no added tag) they could share experiences that might help you.

Mike
__________________
mikelcan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 05:08 PM   #12
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 9
Mike,
It makes me think that factory probably would also design to minimize the weight of cabinet etc. behind the tag axel.

I'll check the frame next week. 100 miles away.
Eventually I will need to weigh it as is before deciding on the project too.

If I did this, would I lose the ability to 4 wheel pull a toad?
What about trailer a boat ?

Thanks, Tom
__________________
WestOfRockie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 05:53 PM   #13
Community Moderator
 
Scarab0088's Avatar


 
Damon Owners Club
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: SoCal
Posts: 13,375
What an exciting idea!!

We have an Outlaw. Class A Toy Haulers are NOT Diesel Pushers. The weight and balance of a front engine RV chassis has no problem loading the rear end - just like a big Box Truck - because the primary engine/transmission is over the front axle. The rear suspension possibly could get overloaded...but with that Tag axle, I bet it would be very hard to exceed the combined rear axles max capacity.

Background: The original Outlaws were simply a Damon Daybreak forward of the garage wall (made on 22K, 24K, 26K and 27K GVWR chassis). New Outlaws are simply a TMC Challenger forward of the garage wall (but on the top-of- the-line 26K Chassis)

The factory just increased the strength of the frame extensions rearward of the end of the OEM 252" wheelbase frame to accommodate the garage floor rating (2500lb).
See this video for a peek at the design:
Click image for larger version

Name:	0421131400.jpg
Views:	26
Size:	582.0 KB
ID:	134175


About towing...you lose nothing regarding towing...see our signature photos.

If you do this...hope you post all about it.

Best luck
__________________
Kim and Steve, Mustang LCDR (Ret), Damon Outlaw #1193
I have seen gross intolerance shown in support of tolerance, Samuel Coleridge
https://www.irv2.com/attachments/signaturepics/sigpic84535_7.gif
WE LOVE OUR OUTLAW RV
Scarab0088 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-25-2016, 08:49 PM   #14
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 9
example
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	keystone-mountaineer-ramp.jpg
Views:	26
Size:	20.8 KB
ID:	134188  
__________________

__________________
WestOfRockie is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
class a, door



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rear ramp porch and severe weather Mr. M Toy Haulers Discussion 7 11-11-2015 05:05 AM
Ramp to enter a class A drhartley Class A Motorhome Discussions 12 11-17-2013 09:38 PM
Looking for a good dog ramp Tov National RV Owner's Forum 6 12-31-2012 06:00 PM
the perfectly sized kenworth powerboatr HDT Conversions 2 12-31-2011 05:43 PM
Installed A 12volt Outlet at the ramp door 56Nomad Toy Haulers Discussion 22 11-30-2005 08:03 PM

» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Our Communities

Our communities encompass many different hobbies and interests, but each one is built on friendly, intelligent membership.

» More about our Communities

Automotive Communities

Our Automotive communities encompass many different makes and models. From U.S. domestics to European Saloons.

» More about our Automotive Communities

Marine Communities

Our Marine websites focus on Cruising and Sailing Vessels, including forums and the largest cruising Wiki project on the web today.

» More about our Marine Communities


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:17 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.