The Great divide in RV lifestyles

[Geo19Irv]

The Great divide in RV lifestyles

For simplicity sake I will split RVers and campers into two groups; the Fortunate and the Budgeters. The fortunate can afford to go to “Luxury RV Resorts” and the budgeters must try to cut the cost as much as possible. Luxury RV Resorts cost on average over $100.00 per night but a “Full Timer” must calculate the cost per/year or more than $36,500.00 per/year: this is beyond the means of the budgeter.
Businesses of all kinds have to pay their overhead and try to make a profit and I can sympathizes with them however when race track seats or camping sites go empty the owners reason they must raise prices, this leads to less people paying for seats or sites so price increases must make up the difference and this leads to even less sales. Discounters like Walmart take a different approach, lower prices and attract more customers leading to more sales and profits but NASCAR and your local campground do not seem to understand this.
As I travel I see huge lots full of RVs sitting in storage and local campgrounds that are mostly empty even on weekends in the high season. The average budgeter is not stupid, but not rich, and they know that even at today’s discounted prices of $33.00 per/night the price is $12,045.00 per/year so many have cut way back on camping.
If the cost was not enough the services at your local campground are little more than a parking spot with a little water and some electric. We have a right to expect the electric service to be the same as in your home however I have found many with dangerously low voltage that can damage the components of an RV; I have seen many with only 105 volts and even 102 volts.
We join groups to try to cut the cost and when we arrive at their member parks we find the advertised price is lower than what is charged so we are paying for a parking space with low voltage. Let me show you some examples. A campground’s web-site showed a photo of a beautiful blue pool that turned out to be a mud hole, water that was not safe to drink, and 105 volts, and sewer drains higher than an RV outlet for a cost of $32 per/night at a discount of 50 per/cent off regular prices.
State and Fed parks have been “Privatized” so prices went up to help the “Bottom Line” and public land became a profit center. To compound this I saw a news article that the greedy Wall Street crowd has begun to look for profits by buying up Trailer Parks then raising lot rents to unaffordable levels; where are the poor to go? I remember camping for less than $10 per night but the cost of everything has doubled and tripled yet how much has your Social Security check or Disabled Veterans compensation gone up in the last ten years. I encourage everyone to contact their representatives and insist that the VA give service connected disabled veterans a substantial increase; as it stands now the government gives illegal aliens more than disabled vets !
So it’s a Catch 22, campgrounds have escalating costs that drive them to raise prices, this results in LESS people camping and less profit so they raise the price again and you get a downward spiral. I would think lower prices would fill those empty seats and sites leading to increased profits. If not we might be seeing the end of working people going camping leaving only the Fortunate in their Luxury RV Resorts.
I am a budgeter and don’t want to be in a Luxury Resort, I like the old fashioned, in the woods campgrounds, and I know they can not afford to upgrade their electric service to handle the loads of today’s RVs so I bought an “Auto-former” and fill my fresh water tank when I find “Good’ water. As a Full-Timer I don’t travel more than north in the spring and south in the late fall so gas is not a big expense; my biggest expense is camping. Even if I can boondock one or two days a week the other 260 nights at an average of $33 per/night adds up to $8580 and I don’t think I am alone.
So will the small budget camper and their campgrounds disappear leaving the fortunate and their Luxury RV Resorts as the future of camping ????
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[FatChance]

Sounds like you should buy a private RV park so you could move up to the "fortunate" class, since RV parks are apparently such exorbitant profit makers...

[UTTransplant]

Most folks I know on a budget stay in seasonal locations for $350-400 a month, much less than the daily rate cost you state. And if you prefer the more rustic sites and are over 62, you can camp in many/most federal sites for 50% cost. For our most recent Forest Service site, that made us pay $14 a night, and that included electric! If you work at it, you can do it for a lot less than the $8,580 you state. But even then that means only $750 a month. You couldn’t rent an unfurnished apartment with utilities for that in my community.

[xrated]

Originally Posted by Geo19Irv

The Great divide in RV lifestyles

For simplicity sake I will split RVers and campers into two groups; the Fortunate and the Budgeters. The fortunate can afford to go to “Luxury RV Resorts” and the budgeters must try to cut the cost as much as possible. Luxury RV Resorts cost on average over $100.00 per night but a “Full Timer” must calculate the cost per/year or more than $36,500.00 per/year: this is beyond the means of the budgeter.
Businesses of all kinds have to pay their overhead and try to make a profit and I can sympathizes with them however when race track seats or camping sites go empty the owners reason they must raise prices, this leads to less people paying for seats or sites so price increases must make up the difference and this leads to even less sales. Discounters like Walmart take a different approach, lower prices and attract more customers leading to more sales and profits but NASCAR and your local campground do not seem to understand this.
As I travel I see huge lots full of RVs sitting in storage and local campgrounds that are mostly empty even on weekends in the high season. The average budgeter is not stupid, but not rich, and they know that even at today’s discounted prices of $33.00 per/night the price is $12,045.00 per/year so many have cut way back on camping.
If the cost was not enough the services at your local campground are little more than a parking spot with a little water and some electric. We have a right to expect the electric service to be the same as in your home however I have found many with dangerously low voltage that can damage the components of an RV; I have seen many with only 105 volts and even 102 volts.
We join groups to try to cut the cost and when we arrive at their member parks we find the advertised price is lower than what is charged so we are paying for a parking space with low voltage. Let me show you some examples. A campground’s web-site showed a photo of a beautiful blue pool that turned out to be a mud hole, water that was not safe to drink, and 105 volts, and sewer drains higher than an RV outlet for a cost of $32 per/night at a discount of 50 per/cent off regular prices.
State and Fed parks have been “Privatized” so prices went up to help the “Bottom Line” and public land became a profit center. To compound this I saw a news article that the greedy Wall Street crowd has begun to look for profits by buying up Trailer Parks then raising lot rents to unaffordable levels; where are the poor to go? I remember camping for less than $10 per night but the cost of everything has doubled and tripled yet how much has your Social Security check or Disabled Veterans compensation gone up in the last ten years. I encourage everyone to contact their representatives and insist that the VA give service connected disabled veterans a substantial increase; as it stands now the government gives illegal aliens more than disabled vets !
So it’s a Catch 22, campgrounds have escalating costs that drive them to raise prices, this results in LESS people camping and less profit so they raise the price again and you get a downward spiral. I would think lower prices would fill those empty seats and sites leading to increased profits. If not we might be seeing the end of working people going camping leaving only the Fortunate in their Luxury RV Resorts.
I am a budgeter and don’t want to be in a Luxury Resort, I like the old fashioned, in the woods campgrounds, and I know they can not afford to upgrade their electric service to handle the loads of today’s RVs so I bought an “Auto-former” and fill my fresh water tank when I find “Good’ water. As a Full-Timer I don’t travel more than north in the spring and south in the late fall so gas is not a big expense; my biggest expense is camping. Even if I can boondock one or two days a week the other 260 nights at an average of $33 per/night adds up to $8580 and I don’t think I am alone.
So will the small budget camper and their campgrounds disappear leaving the fortunate and their Luxury RV Resorts as the future of camping ????
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Just my opinion, but it seems to me that if you can afford a Newmar motor coach, you should probably be able to afford the support "snake" that goes under the sewer drain line and make it possible for the sewer connection to work! Just sayin.

[RVPioneer]

Seems we already have enough “dividers” to go around. Why try to perpetuate the issue within the RV industry?

I consider myself more along the lines of a “fortunate budgeter”. Realistically, this is where all but the fabulously wealthy would have to place themselves. However, I find it meaningless to categorize ourselves.

[Finance]

TLDR. Not because of the length, but because it appears to be just another divisive screed about inequality. Don’t we get enough of that from the mainstream media???

I don’t know or care which pigeonhole I’m supposed to be assigned to, however ANYONE participating in the RV “lifestyle” is fortunate.

If you think people that have larger bank balances got there without BUDGETING, being thrifty, and working for it, I disagree.

Nor do I see an epidemic of affordable camping disappearing. Everywhere we go, places are busy. At every price level.

[twogypsies]

I kinda skimmed over your post because it was too hard to read. Try using paragraphs.

I kinda got the gist of it. Many full-timers can do so on $20-30,000/year. That's everything.... camping, insurance, food, medical, fuel, etc. There are many ways to cut costs. We did!

[Wbago97]

I'm a fortunate budgeter building a boondocker.
EDIT: Apologies, this was an attempt at humor but on re-read I saw you mentioning that you are a Disabled Vet.

[Solo_RV_Guy]

Without jumping into the abyss...


The reason Vulture Capital investors are going after RV parks is because... wait for it... that's where the land is. Maybe 30 or 40 years ago those RV parks were out in the boonies but now the cities and suburbs are getting closer. As there is a finite amount of land available the RV parks are low-hanging fruit to those firms who can pony up eye-watering amounts of money to purchase an RV park. They don't intend to make money from them, in fact they probably hope they do not, as that would impede zoning changes or otherwise impede conversion of the land and redevelopment into tract housing, apartments, and retail/office space.


Yes, there is a strata of economic reality. Some folks have more and others have less (some far, far less). What to do as RVers who want to enjoy our travels, friends and temporary neighbors? I don't know but I think that aspect is worthy of discussion. Noting and complaining about obvious economics is kind of arm-chair quarterbacking and less productive.

[Spdracr39]

Pretty simple to me, Like any other hobby if you can't afford it don't do it. There is no constitutional right to live in or travel in an RV. It costs what it costs just like fishing, hunting, golf ..... Those that can afford to have a hobby indulge and those that can't should find a new more inexpensive hobby. If we try to push cost control, business owners will invest in other businesses and there will be no RV parks, Nascar or whatever. I don't understand why people want to blame others because they can't afford or are to cheap to pay for what they want. Thank you for your service but life isn't always fair especially when speaking of economics.

[Old-Biscuit]

We can afford 'Luxury Resorts' but don't like them
RV Parks are a place to park/sleep while we enjoy the surround area and what it has to offer.


We did everything we wanted to do, went where we wanted to go, saw what we wanted to see and did so on $2000/$2500 month for EVERYTHING including savings
And did it Debt Free



Don't care how others do it.to each their own

[mobilemike]

Yadda-Yadda..........
So, some people have things, others have less.............I am mad because life is unfair.

A political rant about class differences.

[Dutch Star Don]

Originally Posted by spdracr39

Pretty simple to me, Like any other hobby if you can't afford it don't do it. There is no constitutional right to live in or travel in an RV. It costs what it costs just like fishing, hunting, golf ..... Those that can afford to have a hobby indulge and those that can't should find a new more inexpensive hobby. If we try to push cost control, business owners will invest in other businesses and there will be no RV parks, Nascar or whatever. I don't understand why people want to blame others because they can't afford or are to cheap to pay for what they want. Thank you for your service but life isn't always fair especially when speaking of economics.

Wow....This is the perfect response. As I read through each thread, I was assembling my response, but then saw the above.

I've loved to have a 45' diesel trawler to tour the west coast, but that's way out of my budget. Live within your means, not others.

[Itchytoe]

I read this whole thread. Very long OP that brings up the differences between the high end luxury RV resorts, and cheap RV parks. Think of it from an owner's perspective. They want to make more money. That's why you see more of those luxury resorts. Would you take a 75% pay cut to downgrade your resort to a cheap park? No? Then why would you expect anyone else to?



The demand for cheap RV parks is low, so the availability is also low. If you look for cheap places, you'll find them though. They are there, just not in the heart of Toronto, or downtown Houston, or Manhattan, or West Palm Beach. However, Woodsfield Ohio has a few, and they are waiting for you to show up. Would you like their phone numbers? The lot next to me is available. Water, electric, sewer, and wifi are included in the rent. Just a quick FYI, places close early and not just on Sunday.


I understand that it's annoying to not be able to find what you want, but full-timers and people looking for cheap accommodations are the minority when it comes to RVs.