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Old 04-23-2013, 09:03 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by 94-Newmar View Post
The axles have an upward arch/bow built into them for proper caster/camber at the wheels on the TT close to it's loaded weight. With the tires cupped/worn totally on the inside 1/3 of the surface it almost sounds like a "run" of them had the axles installed upside down OR the locating pin (for spring placement) at the axle end was welded on in the wrong position, thus the bow in the tube was incorrectly aligned. A pair of 3500# axles should have been more than sufficient on that TT.
I think the wide-trax (wide track) wheel placement may have something to do with it too. I see no benefit to this type of placement. The rear axle was worse than the front axle but all 4 tires had the same type of damage.

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EDIT: YIKES! Just found a pic you posted in another forum of your axles. That bend you see is not normal.... it should be an even bow from side to side, it's obvious it's bent badly near the one side.
Oh yes, that one side was very badly bent, it actually turned upward. There has to be an answer to this other than a bad batch of axles. It's still happening as the shop in town is still replacing them on HL RVs. The man at Customer Service at HL said this kind of bending is more common on RVs taken offroad or taken over really rough dirt and gravel roads. This RV has never been west or north of Nashville TN. Fortunately our roads don't have the potholes seen in the north and we wouldn't even consider getting off paved roads with such a large TT. Most of her miles have been on I-75 to Ocala FL and back, and a few local CGs by the lakes where we live.
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Old 04-23-2013, 09:09 PM   #16
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For those people that have axel problems, I hope that you are a member of the Good Sams club and ask them to intervene for you and see if that will help you with the cost of the problem of replacing the axels and tires.
Yes, we are members of Good Sam's Club. HLs excuse was the TT is out of warranty. So there really isn't much we can do but warn others to keep checking their tires and axles and hope they bend BEFORE the warranty runs out.
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Old 04-24-2013, 05:39 PM   #17
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Do you get Trailer Life magazine? If you do they have a section in it where people that are having problems write in to them and they contact the manufacture to see if they can help. Understand that you have to have a well written letter to them with copies of all the documentation you have . AND, they have no authority to help you they just add there voice to the complaint and sometimes that forces a company to stand up and take action rather then look bad in the print of the magazine. Besides, even if you still do not get help everyone that gets the magazine will hear of you peril.
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Old 04-24-2013, 08:16 PM   #18
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If the Lippert-supplied frame came with axles that were rated for 7000 lbs but in fact bent under that load, it is indeed Lippert's responsibility to repair - and pay for - the damages. The trailer mfgr ought to be at your side fighting for you, though.

I think you have a case against Lippert for consequential damages to the tires, but you might have to do some arm-twisting to get them to pay attention. Good Sam (Highways magazine) is one good platform for doing so.
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Old 04-24-2013, 08:28 PM   #19
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We just got our NT BRS28 back from the RV shop. Both axles, undersized for the TT were badly bent and all 4 tires were ruined. Heartland refused to take any responsibility and Lippert only replaced the axles with much heavier ones better suited to the weight of the BRS28, but we're stuck for the 4 ruined tires. This BRS28 has less than 3000 miles on it.

At the RV shop we learned that Lippert is having to replace axles that bent on Heartland RVs, including those on the Big Horns, not a cheap RV. If you have a Heartland RV (now owned by Keystone) you better crawl under there and check your axles and tires. It's said that quality went down when Keystone took over HL.

Thinking of buying a Heartland RV? Better think again.........

CHECK THOSE AXLES and tires!
Sorry you feel that way about Heartland. I have had nothing but good experiences dealing with their customer service. I ask you this, do you think Lippert (a for profit business) replaced your axles out of the kindness of their heart? Or do you think maybe Heartland was right and it was in fact Lippert's responsibility? If they replaced the axles, they admitted responsibility and liability in the matter and they should pay for the tires. Sorry, but I don't think it's Heartland's fault. Frames and axles are warranted by Lippert the same way appliances are warranted by their manufacturer.
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Old 04-25-2013, 06:28 AM   #20
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Do you get Trailer Life magazine? If you do they have a section in it where people that are having problems write in to them and they contact the manufacture to see if they can help.
Yes we get the magazine.

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Understand that you have to have a well written letter to them with copies of all the documentation you have . AND, they have no authority to help you they just add there voice to the complaint and sometimes that forces a company to stand up and take action rather then look bad in the print of the magazine. Besides, even if you still do not get help everyone that gets the magazine will hear of you peril.
That's true and it would help spread the word. We have no documentation for anything other than the reg for the TT and what we paid for the labor over 3 hours. I spoke to Lippert and HL on the phone. I didn't tape the calls. Perhaps I should have. At least Lippert took some responsibility whereas Heartland turned their back on us.

I think I posted that one of those damaged tires collapsed as flat as a pancake within minutes of us getting the NT TT home from the shop on Monday. We should be getting the new tires next week.
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Old 04-25-2013, 06:34 AM   #21
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If the Lippert-supplied frame came with axles that were rated for 7000 lbs but in fact bent under that load, it is indeed Lippert's responsibility to repair - and pay for - the damages. The trailer mfgr ought to be at your side fighting for you, though.
Heartland does nothing for the people who buy their RVs unless it's under warranty, then they want to replace whatever is defective, such as the seats in the dinette and sofa, with the same cheap poor quality trash the RV comes with. I'm glad Lippert stepped forward as HL would have replaced the bent axles with the same undersized "tubes" the RV came with.

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I think you have a case against Lippert for consequential damages to the tires, but you might have to do some arm-twisting to get them to pay attention. Good Sam (Highways magazine) is one good platform for doing so.
I wish I could write as well as some people. Trying to explain everything to someone at the Good Sam magazine would be difficult and HL will claim the TT is out of warranty - and it is.
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Old 04-25-2013, 06:52 AM   #22
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Sorry you feel that way about Heartland. I have had nothing but good experiences dealing with their customer service.
By them always being polite you mean? Oh yes, they're very polite while they refuse to do anything but replace cheap quality materials with the same cheap quality the TT comes with. Did they replace the seats on your sofa and dinette set with better quality ones when they flattened after a few weekends use? How about the untra cheap fabric that wrinkles and deforms on the the dinette set and sofa after the first use? Where you told by the dealer they're so poor quality that you can look at them only but not use them?

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I ask you this, do you think Lippert (a for profit business) replaced your axles out of the kindness of their heart? Or do you think maybe Heartland was right and it was in fact Lippert's responsibility?
HL admitted the workmen *may* have installed the axles incorrectly. Slightly off. Did they? Then whose responsibility was it when they bent and ruined the tires and put our lives in jeopardy, along with the other people on the Interstate? If they were installed incorrectly then a lot of axles are being installed incorrectly at their plant since so many are bending and being replaced. What about quality control? Don't they check to make sure something as important as the axles are checked befor the unit leaves their mfg plant? Who was sleeping on the job when all these HL RVs slid through with incorrectly installed axles - if that was the case? Now the NT has really heavy thick axles with much heavier U bolts.

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If they replaced the axles, they admitted responsibility and liability in the matter and they should pay for the tires. Sorry, but I don't think it's Heartland's fault.
I'm sorrier since it was Heartland's fault that someone either installed BOTH axles incorrectly or that HL installed inadequate axles in a lot of their RVs, not just the TTs but their 5th wheels also. And I'm really sorry that it was also HLs fault that there is no quality control - no one to check something as important as axles before their RVs leave the plant. Don't you agree that axles should be checked before the RVs leave the plant for the safety of everyone on the road?

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Frames and axles are warranted by Lippert the same way appliances are warranted by their manufacturer.
And so that's their and your excuse to either install them incorrectly in their RVs with no one checking, or that they're installing axles inadequate for the weight of the RVs. Tell us, why are so many Lippert axles bending and needing replacement in HL RVs?
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Old 04-25-2013, 08:11 AM   #23
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OK, the person there said Keystone, (it doesn't really matter) and that when Heartland owned the Co, the quality was much better. .
=========================

What do you mean it doesn't really matter?? You bad mouth Keystone and then find out Keystone doesn't own Heartland, and it doesn't matter? It matters a lot !!!..
What other information about your complaint isn't the truth. When you post on these forums get your facts straight before you complain lady!!! There's a ton of people here who read these messages and make their decisions on factual information supplied here.
Please be more careful in the future..
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Old 04-25-2013, 08:59 PM   #24
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By them always being polite you mean? Oh yes, they're very polite while they refuse to do anything but replace cheap quality materials with the same cheap quality the TT comes with. Did they replace the seats on your sofa and dinette set with better quality ones when they flattened after a few weekends use? How about the untra cheap fabric that wrinkles and deforms on the the dinette set and sofa after the first use? Where you told by the dealer they're so poor quality that you can look at them only but not use them?

HL admitted the workmen *may* have installed the axles incorrectly. Slightly off. Did they? Then whose responsibility was it when they bent and ruined the tires and put our lives in jeopardy, along with the other people on the Interstate? If they were installed incorrectly then a lot of axles are being installed incorrectly at their plant since so many are bending and being replaced. What about quality control? Don't they check to make sure something as important as the axles are checked befor the unit leaves their mfg plant? Who was sleeping on the job when all these HL RVs slid through with incorrectly installed axles - if that was the case? Now the NT has really heavy thick axles with much heavier U bolts.

I'm sorrier since it was Heartland's fault that someone either installed BOTH axles incorrectly or that HL installed inadequate axles in a lot of their RVs, not just the TTs but their 5th wheels also. And I'm really sorry that it was also HLs fault that there is no quality control - no one to check something as important as axles before their RVs leave the plant. Don't you agree that axles should be checked before the RVs leave the plant for the safety of everyone on the road?

And so that's their and your excuse to either install them incorrectly in their RVs with no one checking, or that they're installing axles inadequate for the weight of the RVs. Tell us, why are so many Lippert axles bending and needing replacement in HL RVs?
No, I never had a problem with my Heartland sofa. All the issues I had were very promptly resolved after my shakedown cruise and I never had another single issue. However, if I did have a problem and they offered to replace it I wouldn't expect a better sofa than I originally bought. You purchased this product and had ample chance to compare to others and inspect it. You in fact used it past the warranty period, yet expect them to treat the case as if you just bought it. If the dealer said it was so cheap that he wouldnt sit on it, I wouldn't have bought the trailer either. I guess we have to agree to disagree. To me good service is replacing the item, and to you it is getting you a much better item than you bought.
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Old 04-25-2013, 09:08 PM   #25
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Let's try to not get too heated about this please.
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Old 04-28-2013, 06:34 PM   #26
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=========================

What do you mean it doesn't really matter?? You bad mouth Keystone and then find out Keystone doesn't own Heartland, and it doesn't matter? It matters a lot !!!..
Why - if Thor owns both? The RV repair shop told us Keystone took over Heartland. Why should I not have believed them?

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What other information about your complaint isn't the truth.
What? I posted the pics of the ruined tires and bent axles here.

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When you post on these forums get your facts straight before you complain lady!!!
Why would I not believe the woman and the mechanic? They work with these RVs all the time. Are my complaints costing YOU money?

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There's a ton of people here who read these messages and make their decisions on factual information supplied here.
Please be more careful in the future..
Why would the woman and mechanic LIE about it? Why would I choose to think they're BOTH liars? I had no reason to think they'd lie to us.
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Old 04-28-2013, 06:41 PM   #27
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No, I never had a problem with my Heartland sofa. All the issues I had were very promptly resolved after my shakedown cruise and I never had another single issue. However, if I did have a problem and they offered to replace it I wouldn't expect a better sofa than I originally bought.
Get it straight! I offered to PAY for a better quality sofa. Why have them send a new one, jump through all the hoops to get it, when the same thing would happen after a few camping trips?

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You purchased this product and had ample chance to compare to others and inspect it.
Since when to the dealers allow you to take the RV camping a few times before selling it to you - to compare it to others lent to you by other dealers? You must have some really different Dealers where you live.

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You in fact used it past the warranty period, yet expect them to treat the case as if you just bought it.
The cushions flattened before we had the TT for 2 months. Did you even read what I posted?

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If the dealer said it was so cheap that he wouldnt sit on it, I wouldn't have bought the trailer either.
Yes, but they don't tell you the cushions are only to look at and not sit on. Had I been told that I wouldn't have bought the Heartland BRS.

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I guess we have to agree to disagree. To me good service is replacing the item, and to you it is getting you a much better item than you bought.
Why replace poor quality crap with more crap? In a few weeks or months they would have had to replace them again. We would have had to jump through the hoops over and over and over..... I was willing to PAY for better quality. Did you even read what I posted?
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Old 04-28-2013, 06:47 PM   #28
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Let's try to not get too heated about this please.
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