Western Horizon members beware

[bdpreece]

Western Horizon Resorts is selling off Indian Waters and 7 other parks #1 Mobile Home Parks For Sale, RV Parks For Sale & Park Loans

[bdpreece]

Actually after I posted this I found another listing further down in the for sale section for an 8 park portfolio. So it looks like WH is liquidating anything they can. For those of us who fell for the sales pitch and bought in it looks like we have been had.

[read & learn]

As C2C members, we have stayed at 4 of those parks. Now my question is; What does your sales agreement say about future sales and rights if the parks are sold?

[Chickadee]

G'morning Western Horizon Folks:

WOW,....sure looks like WHR is bailing. !!

FYI, we are currently parked at Desert Shadows/Western Horizon here in Casa Grande, AND.....we are planning to attend a 3 p.m. meeting here at the park with none other than Jim Loken!! Now, until reading Brian and Loretta's (bdpreece) alert above just this morning, we simply thought Loken was here for one of their usual presentations. In fact we were kinda looking forward to this meeting since we have never met Mr. Loken, and we thought it was kind of nice to be here during this rather surprise visit!... WELL, looks like this session will be a whole lot more.

This is a surprise for us as well as others!!

Steve & Lynette
(WHR members since 2006)

[two2go]

No surprise. Bad economy. Nil RV sales bundled with promotions to visit a property and get a sales pitch. High investment for facilities that are past prime. We were considering letting our AOR membership lapse, and now it looks like that will be automatic.

[Beagle RC Air]

Sorry to hear this news. We were members of WHR for 5 years and found the whole camping experience ok. Compared to Naco and TT, which we owned prior. WHR was head and shoulders better.
All of these time share camping group regulations are confusing and most Rver's probably will never get their moneys worth.
beagle

[bdpreece]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chickadee G'morning Western Horizon Folks: WOW,....sure looks like WHR is bailing. !! FYI, we are currently parked at Desert Shadows/Western Horizon here in Casa Grande, AND.....we are planning to attend a 3 p.m. meeting here at the park with none other than Jim Loken!! Now, until reading Brian and Loretta's (bdpreece) alert above just this morning, we simply thought Loken was here for one of their usual presentations. In fact we were kinda looking forward to this meeting since we have never met Mr. Loken, and we thought it was kind of nice to be here during this rather surprise visit!... WELL, looks like this session will be a whole lot more. This is a surprise for us as well as others!! Steve & Lynette (WHR members since 2006)

From what I have heard Mr. Loken will only answer questions that have been pre submitted in writing so if you have any questions you need to check with the office.

[dons2346]

In the states of WA and CA, by law, if a membership park is sold, another one is supposed to be provided within the immediate area. If you look at the parks WH has sold and those that have been purchased, you will see this is not happening. In fact none have been purchased.

A couple of months ago, a gentleman wrote to the WA state attorney general expressing his concern that no parks had been replaced in the state of WA. The answer he received from the attorney general was pretty much "yes we know but.....". The office did not and would not put pressure on WH to comply with the laws of the state because it would probably put an economical hardship on WH.

So it appears that not much will be done to force Loken to replace sold parks.

One question I have is why is he making the rounds now in the southern area when the parks are less than half full? If he was a real service orientated company, he would come when max people would be available. The way he is handling it is the easy way out.

[bdpreece]

It looks like WH is dead. It is more a question of how long it takes to bury them. And yet not too long ago I read where they were still trying to sell new memberships. If you get an opportunity to use the free camping offer do it then tell them where they can put their membership.

[Chickadee]

G'morning:

Well we did attend Mr. Loken's meeting here at Casa Grande, AZ yesterday.

The point he tried to make was that WHR is developed as a camping program not as an initiative to own real estate. In other words, WHR is not, and they aren't aiming to build an inventory of company owned RV parks. Although over the years WHR has purchased parks in regions where RV'rs liked to stay, such as the Southwest and the Northwest, in order to accomodate RV'rs, it isn't their intention to necessarily OWN a bunch of such parks, rather, it is their intention to operate a camping program.

Now, that the economy is heavily impacting the costs of operating such campgrounds, WHR is finding it may be more effective to sell owned real estate and lease sites to provide camping for the members.

Mr. Loken is trying to keep the camping program alive for the benefit of members and the best way to do so is to maybe sell owned parks.

From our perspective, we've always found the WHR system and particularly the personnel, whether at facilities or in the reservation office, to be OUTSTANDING folks and extremely helpful. Basically, we like the WHR operation, and it makes little difference to us whether WHR owns, or leases the parks in the WHR catalog of resorts.

Steve & Lynette

[Chickadee]

bdpreece:

Oh, forgot.

No, (at least in this instance), it is not true that any questions had to be "pre-submitted in writing" beforehand. Mr. Loken stayed and answered all questions from the floor.

Additionally, we can't agree with your assessment that...."it looks like WH is dead." At first blush, however, when first seeing the for sale postings for the campgrounds, it sure made one wonder, eh?

Steve

[bdpreece]

Well if selling and leasing back works for the members I have no problem with that. Unfortunately he sold Tall Chief and St George and we no longer have use of them. I under stand Loken is trying to put a good spin on this one but the word I got was WH failed to pay the lease back in a timely manner and ELS stepped in and took over. Thus the lease back contract was nul and void.

[SSteve]

Shortly after we joined WH in Feb of 2009, WH sold it's property in Abita Springs, LA and another (don't remember which) in WA based on business performance. Abita Springs is no longer affiliated with WH, but is available through ROD and I suspect the same is true of the property in WA (Mr. Loken is involved in ROD as well).

Granted, a sample size of one or two is hardly conclusive, but it may indicate that when WH properties are sold, they stand a small chance of remaining WH affiliates.

Additionally, I'm a bit confused about the business decision to sell in a shaky real estate market and lease sites for member use. If true, unless WH leases ALL of the sites at each property sold, reservations are going to become tough to get. Curiously, a recent addition to the WH fee structure was, give WH a few more thousand dollars, and a member can make reservations 120 days out instead of the current 90.

I hope I'm wrong, but it seems like WH might be cashing out.

I hope Mr. Loken gave the real story.

Steve

[bdpreece]

The point that I suspect most are missing in the lease back agreement idea is if WH sells a park with say 150 sites to an other membership company, how many sites are they leasing back. The buying company is probably going to want to hold the majority of the sites for their own members. WH will probably only get 10 or 15 sites.