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Old 06-20-2016, 06:55 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Old-Biscuit View Post
Motor 7..........

You stated Fridge was ON

Should have blown fridge AC fuse on circuit board and possibly heater element
MIGHT have damaged fridge circuit board

Converters always take a hit when subjected to 240V AC.......

Luckily A/C wasn't on.....Microwave usually survives (internal ceramic fuse blows)
The main RV breaker was tripped, as was the one for the Converter/Charger. The Converter breaker would not reset while the Converter was plugged in which led me to remove and inspect it. Fridge is working now even with the Converter out of the RV.

I have a battery charger on the RV now to keep them up. However, the A/C which was off when this happened runs, but the compressor does not kick in. I am hoping when the new Converter arrives this week and I plug it in that the A/C will work. If it doesn't, then something took a hit on the A/C & I have until Sunday to figure it out because we are off to Manitoba.
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Old 06-20-2016, 07:13 AM   #16
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Nothing about any union here and being a self installed circuit dies NOT let "pump guy" wiggle off the hook.

A single line powered circuit with a single breaker in a non - commercial residential panel is most likely going to be 120 volts.

And it may or may not be wired to code but if the "customer" states that it is okay to swap from single to dual breaker that is a modification of existing so it must all be brought to code meaning the licensed person needs to determine and confirm what is there and do it correctly.

If it was 120 vac rv plug and done correctly it should have had 3 wires and one should have been white for neutral but if home brew could have been anything.

Reusing that wire for a hot lead could have resulted in someone being killed.

In your case, the neutral line was connected to 120 vac hot and out of phase with other so possibility of hot skin if safety ground in rv attached to neutral which is common combined with a possible bad cord which also is common could result in a 240 vac difference between the skin and a lamp.

A licensed electrician who knows what they are doing would have asked exactly was on the circuit and verified both by touch and measurment.

Your pump was connected to the rv outlet so it would have been in the path.

Folks using wrong colors and having other things oddball make life difficult for folks doing work later and those doing that work always need to verify exactly what is going on.

Easily adds much additional time to our work on most jobs but that is how we discover Un fused power leads and other hazards.

No this is not about unions...It is about living to see the next day.
The wire running to the Rv plug from the breaker box is a 10Ga 2 wire w/ground. The pre-assembled 30 Amp Rv box w/recepticle is a 120v already set up with the green ground wire wired from back of recepticle to the box leaving only the white and black wires to hook up.

The pump guy said it was ok to use the 2 wire 10 ga w/ground to power the 220 well pump. You are correct, the lack of the third wire had me wondering how this will work. So he ran a black out of one side of the double breaker, the white out of the other side and left the ground as a ground.

I changed the breaker for the RV plug back to 120V, so it is now correct and on it's own circuit. I had and extra 220 Dryer plug in my shop about 2' from the entrance of the well pump line, so I wired the pump to that. This obviously leaves the white neutral coming from the breaker box unused when going to the 2 wire lead to the pump. The pump is still grounded with the bare ground wire.

As you can tell I am not an electrician. But, can you explain the difference between the white neutral and the bare ground wire? Both appear to "ground' inside the breaker box....different grounding bars, but both grounded.
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Old 06-20-2016, 07:38 AM   #17
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Ok, I found a good explanation to my question:

http://www.esgroundingsolutions.com/...n-a-sub-panel/

But, I still do not understand what happens when not using the white neutral wire on a 220 set up....3 wire to 2 wire.
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Old 06-20-2016, 07:45 AM   #18
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From my limited knowledge of electricity, (please correct me if I am wrong) here's how I understand it. If you disconnected the bare ground the system still works. There should not be electricity running through the bare ground. The Neutral white is the "return" if you will. It is where the electricity returns to ground when the system is operating.

So Bare ground= safety (I believe would prevent damage to you and you equipment in the case of a short)

White Neutral = the electricity return line/Normal "hot" path to ground to complete the circuit.


I think I may not be fully understanding, when you say 3 wire are you talk like red, white, black and bare ground?
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Old 06-20-2016, 08:32 AM   #19
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Pleas Google house wiring as it is not that complicated but a little much to detail with a phone...too lazy this early...sorry for that.

Zero current should ever normally flow in the bare or green wire.

It is "safety" ground and it is the current path for a short to ground.

Let me explain maybe...experts can add too.

Normal current path is hot and return for a loop.

But what if the heater in your fridge breaks down and shorts out to the housing but stays functional as a heater?

Voltage now present on housing and anything it touches.

It touches fridge cabinet making it hot and since it is connected to chassis the chassis is hot.

Grab door to get in get nailed.

The current is just fine as heater is just fine so breaker does not trip.

Now connect the chassis back to the breaker panel so there is a current path for that short back TO THE PANEL and that path is what causes breaker to trip.

That is basic process but NEC may have different wording.
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Old 06-22-2016, 09:01 PM   #20
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New converter/charge controller is >in<. Roof A/C working(wheew), second casualty was the $30 dvd player, can't find any other damage....yet. Changed the filter/fluid in the tranny today and took it out for a test ride...all systems "go". Headed for Manitoba on Sunday...it's been a looooong week.
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Old 06-22-2016, 09:10 PM   #21
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Open the did player and look for a fuse.

Most are universal switching power supplies for international sale so it may already be capable of high voltage with a jumper.

Fuse should be obvious and cheap.
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Old 06-22-2016, 09:29 PM   #22
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Open the did player and look for a fuse.

Most are universal switching power supplies for international sale so it may already be capable of high voltage with a jumper.

Fuse should be obvious and cheap.
I did open it.....rather large 2"x2" spot on the inside of the lid that looked like a mini space shuttle launched.....no bueno...I killed it.

I solved my mystery on the 220 3 wire w/ground to 220 2 wire w/ground. Black and red go to black and white. Bare ground on the 2 wire side grounds to the box/earth. 3 wire ground also goes to box/earth, and the white wire gets capped off. Well pump only requires 220v, the white wire in a 3 wire 220 is for running things that also use 110v like clothes dryers, welders, etc.
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Old 06-23-2016, 08:41 AM   #23
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Where in Manitoba are you headed? That's where I am from, although we are in Niagara Falls right now.

Have a safe trip.
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Old 06-23-2016, 08:44 AM   #24
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Minnedosa, north of Brandon, home of the Rock in the Fields(aka RockFest)
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