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Old 03-15-2012, 09:42 AM   #15
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Jim,
That is a well thought out post. In the end though, your goal is to sell more products and use this forum (I am not affiliated with irv2 in anyway) to do so. Whether it be direct or indirectly.

The way I see it, is the forum is a consumer forum and if a company would like to participate, they can get an account from the forum that allows that.

If not, then perhaps, another avenue in directly or indirectly selling goods is the best way to go. I see it differently than most I guess. I think the information is invaluable, but at the same time, call it whatever one wants, it is spam. Spam in the general sense of a forum is to use the forum to sell goods and that is what someone is doing.

iRV2 offers a solution for those that want to take part in that for a fee. If they dont want to pay the fee, they offer the ability to post, but I dont see anything wrong with not allowing links for those that do not want to have a commercial account. The only issue one has is the time it takes to type it out and that goes back to how much is your time worth because it can be alleviated by having a paid account.

It seems to me that people want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to sell their goods (either directly or indirectly) without a commercial account. Is it fair? Maybe or maybe not, but in my opinion, it does not seem outlandish (not that anybody said that).

This is not a non-profit organization clearly, just as those that want to sell goods are not either. It seems they offer a fair solution to those that want to use this as a commercial tool.
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Old 03-15-2012, 10:11 AM   #16
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I think it's sad that some people believe it's more important to try to prevent any possible gain by a commercial member (unless, of course, they pay for it) than to enable the best flow of information to the users of the forum (the community that the forum exists for). Anything that's a disincentive for the most knowledgeable people (commercial or not) to provide timely and relevant information is the wrong way to go, IMO.

If there's specific behaviors that need to be discouraged, then document those behaviors and remove it when it happens. But this particular blanket rule does more harm than good.

joe
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Old 03-15-2012, 11:37 AM   #17
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Joe, I have to disagree with your assessment. I for one do not care to see commercial vendors and ads on the forum. Often someone will come on a forum just to farm some business and offer a little help. Given the opportunity they will be trying to get people to their site for any and all help.

If a business persons profits from "advertising" in this type post, he is a commercial enterprise. I guess for me it all boils down to "There ain't no free lunches". I look at it as advertising and that is part of the cost of doing business.

My nickels worth.

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Old 03-15-2012, 11:44 AM   #18
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Proper advertising also pays for this forum that most of us really enjoy and appreciate. I'll second the " there is no free lunch ".
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Old 03-15-2012, 11:51 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TXiceman View Post
Joe, I have to disagree with your assessment. I for one do not care to see commercial vendors and ads on the forum. Often someone will come on a forum just to farm some business and offer a little help. Given the opportunity they will be trying to get people to their site for any and all help.

If a business persons profits from "advertising" in this type post, he is a commercial enterprise. I guess for me it all boils down to "There ain't no free lunches". I look at it as advertising and that is part of the cost of doing business.

My nickels worth.
I agree completely.
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Old 03-15-2012, 12:14 PM   #20
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Joe, I have to disagree with your assessment. I for one do not care to see commercial vendors and ads on the forum. Often someone will come on a forum just to farm some business and offer a little help. Given the opportunity they will be trying to get people to their site for any and all help.

If a business persons profits from "advertising" in this type post, he is a commercial enterprise. I guess for me it all boils down to "There ain't no free lunches". I look at it as advertising and that is part of the cost of doing business.

My nickels worth.

Ken
So you would rather not see commercial vendors on the site at all, even if they're the most knowledgeable about the products and can give the most current information?

For many vendors, social sites like this are an alternate method of providing support to their customers, in addition to email or whatever other on-line support they provide. For them to use sites like this to provide specific, on topic information is a win on both sides. They post the info once, many people have access. Good for both. Discouraging this doesn't help anyone.

Look, I agree that blatant advertising posts aren't welcome, and should be addressed by the moderators when it happens. But do you really believe that the moderators don't have enough judgement to be able to tell the difference and that the only way to address the real problem is a blanket prohibition? Which still needs to be enforced manually anyway?

joe
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Old 03-15-2012, 12:19 PM   #21
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Proper advertising also pays for this forum that most of us really enjoy and appreciate. I'll second the " there is no free lunch ".
I don't know about you, but IRV2 is getting zero advertising revenue from me. I see NO ads on this site at all. I'd rather I had to pay a buck or two a month for no ads than see knowledgeable people not participate because they won't pay crazy rates for the privilege. I guess I'm the odd man out here.

joe
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Old 03-15-2012, 12:22 PM   #22
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FlyingDiver: If your handle is all one motion, I would not care to be in the back seat.

This is a COMMERCIAL site and you are wasting your breath & keyboard.

Kerry
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Old 03-15-2012, 12:27 PM   #23
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FlyingDiver: If your handle is all one motion, I would not care to be in the back seat.

This is a COMMERCIAL site and you are wasting your breath & keyboard.

Kerry
It's mine to waste.

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Old 03-15-2012, 12:32 PM   #24
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True.

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Old 03-15-2012, 12:39 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by FlyingDiver View Post
So you would rather not see commercial vendors on the site at all, even if they're the most knowledgeable about the products and can give the most current information?

For many vendors, social sites like this are an alternate method of providing support to their customers, in addition to email or whatever other on-line support they provide. For them to use sites like this to provide specific, on topic information is a win on both sides. They post the info once, many people have access. Good for both. Discouraging this doesn't help anyone.

Look, I agree that blatant advertising posts aren't welcome, and should be addressed by the moderators when it happens. But do you really believe that the moderators don't have enough judgement to be able to tell the difference and that the only way to address the real problem is a blanket prohibition? Which still needs to be enforced manually anyway?

joe
Joe, FWIW, I agree with you. It would be better for us to be able to have the input and suggestions from the commercial folks. However, a few months back when I was loudly protesting the new rule prohibiting all talk of gun related topics, I learned something about this forum. It's not here primarily to service the best interests of the RV community. It's here to generate revenue through ads and corporate sponsorships. Now that I have made peace with that fact, I'm OK with their rules, and I understand better the motivation behind them. From this perspective, your point that these rules are a disservice to RVers is moot, because being of service to its members is not the primary focus of this, or any commercially run forum. Sad but true.
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Old 03-15-2012, 01:00 PM   #26
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Old 03-15-2012, 01:44 PM   #27
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Absolutely amazing!!!
I beg of you, please tell me I'm wrong.

I know the members are here in support of each other, and the volunteer mods are here in support of everyone. And out of that has risen probably the best community resource for the RV lifestyle anywhere on the net. If I didn't believe that, I would not weigh in on this topic, nor would I have become a contributing member and put an iRV2 decal on my coach. I have protested rules here before and was met with a clear 'live with it or leave, but it's not changing' message.

That said, can you tell me the purpose for which this forum is maintained by its owners, if not for reasons stated above? Can you then tell me why there are rules enacted and enforced in contradiction to members and guests best interests, like the one FlyingDiver is asking about?

The lasting value of forums such as this is not the conversation at hand, but the information resources left in the wake of those conversations. To deny the inclusion of valid, relevant information for reasons such as 'There aint no free lunches', or because some topics are difficult to moderate is a disservice to the current community, and to those who come behind us to mine the resources we have left behind.

Or.... maybe not.
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Old 03-15-2012, 01:55 PM   #28
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Darn. I wish this forum software had a "Like" button.

joe
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