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Old 12-12-2011, 08:05 AM   #99
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Well gentlemen I did my 20 as well and somewhere along the lines while serving it seems I had to adhered to a lot of regulations, here I thought we all came under the same UCMJ while serving not to mention that each branch had it's own operational rules and regulations so please do not put the freedom card out there.
I'll stop at this point.
First thanks for your service. the "Freedom Card", too old to play games John. We can slice and dice this subject and there always will be polarization between the far-left and far-right. My point is this, we have a sizable number of RV'ers on this forum that enjoy the hobby/sport of shooting and maintaining guns and for our group to be banned from discussing/sharing information on this hobby is untenable. There are members involved in hobbies from sewing to fishing that are free to discuss their particular interest. We will have folks on both ends of the spectrum that will attempt to 'stir the pot' to provoke a response -- we need to deal with these posters on a case by case basis -- not punish the majority for the actions of a few. Provide us a sub-area under the "Hobbies..." category and we'll keep our discussions to ourselves -- if others disagree with our hobby/sport.
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Old 12-12-2011, 09:03 AM   #100
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Provide us a sub-area under the "Hobbies..." category and we'll keep our discussions to ourselves -- if others disagree with our hobby/sport.
I think this is a good suggestion. A clearly defined subject area where people who have an interest in the subject can share stories, ideas, experiences would be good. Those that do not like guns do not have to click the links. I for one have little interest in the subject so would not go there. There are those that don't like guns will of course find a need to put their 2 cents worth and start a firestorm.

I also understand what the moderators are trying to do. Some subjects are lightning rods and some people just can't help themselves and get personal and go into attack mode. Some take a simple subject like wal-mart parking and turn it into an attack on capitalism which then of course results in rants about dirtbag democrats or repugnant heartless republicans.

Tough to legislate civility.
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Old 12-12-2011, 12:12 PM   #101
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That's my thought Tom -- RV'ers are "Family" and share many interest. I would like to hear from others on the shooting ranges around the places we tend to frequent and their ideas on other gun related subjects.
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Old 12-12-2011, 12:30 PM   #102
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Why do the owners of this forum have to run it the way you want? You can always start your own forum and set up the rules as you see fit. I have belonged to a couple of forums that became "sewers" due to the lack of civility. The moderators were unable to clean them up and now they are not moderated at all. The people that wanted to have honest discussions have now all left.

As always, this is just my opinion and yours may be different.
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Old 12-12-2011, 03:52 PM   #103
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Why do the owners of this forum have to run it the way you want? You can always start your own forum and set up the rules as you see fit. I have belonged to a couple of forums that became "sewers" due to the lack of civility. The moderators were unable to clean them up and now they are not moderated at all. The people that wanted to have honest discussions have now all left.

As always, this is just my opinion and yours may be different.
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Old 12-12-2011, 04:05 PM   #104
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iRV2 Rules Change

Two things my wife and I never discuss with friends or enemies--politics and religion. Forums like this one is no place for either. If it does not directly relate to RVing, then it does not belong here.
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Old 12-12-2011, 04:49 PM   #105
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Why do the owners of this forum have to run it the way you want? You can always start your own forum and set up the rules as you see fit. I have belonged to a couple of forums that became "sewers" due to the lack of civility. .....

This is EXACTLY the issue here. Even when there is a discussion area for this kind of content, it inevitably slops out into the rest of the board. There are plenty of good places on the web to discuss these few hot button topics and in this same vein, we would like to maintain iRV2 as a great place to discuss RVing.

Really this is about being venue-appropriate; e.g. you may occasionally cuss in some circumstances but not at your grandmothers Thanksgiving dinner table, you may usually hang around in sweats and t-shirts but you put on a suit to go to a funeral, you may like to hoot and holler at a basketball game, but you whisper at the library.

We are an RVing forum.
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Old 12-12-2011, 06:21 PM   #106
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This is EXACTLY the issue here. Even when there is a discussion area for this kind of content, it inevitably slops out into the rest of the board. There are plenty of good places on the web to discuss these few hot button topics and in this same vein, we would like to maintain iRV2 as a great place to discuss RVing.

Really this is about being venue-appropriate; e.g. you may occasionally cuss in some circumstances but not at your grandmothers Thanksgiving dinner table, you may usually hang around in sweats and t-shirts but you put on a suit to go to a funeral, you may like to hoot and holler at a basketball game, but you whisper at the library.

We are an RVing forum.
I agree with you on everything but "Even when there is a discussion area for this kind of content, it inevitably slops out into the rest of the board. "

For instance, I don't care at all about 60% of the forums on here like
Expandables, Hybrids, & Lightweights Discussion

So I don't visit or read them. I'm glad they are here for the people that do. So, if we had a sub forum on guns & RVing people who do not care about guns should not visit that forum. If they do and post then THEY are the ones causing trouble not the gun forum members.

Sure, there may be some heated discussions about some issues but it would be between the forum members not the general members.

I found the thread about "carrying guns in your RV" educational and very informative. It's too bad it was in the general discussion section where a lot of members who don't like guns posted their views. If it had been in a sub forum that wouldn't happen and we RVers who carry guns would have a place to discuss laws and ideas about carrying a gun in a RV. (going into Mexico or Canada with one can cause a lot of trouble if you don't know the rules) so why not be able to talk about it?

The same goes for laws and RV's. If one political group is trying to pass laws that will effect our RVing we should know and have a place to discuss it. People who don't care about it don't have to visit.

I run a board myself and know what it takes to keep it civil. I don't allow religion on my guitar board because it has nothing to do with guitars. The same here on this board. (unless when it comes to paying the bills)

So maybe the people who make the rules could consider a sub forum for a few of these subjects and assign someone who cares about these issues as mods. Any talk about these subjects outside of the forum would be banned. That might make everyone happy.
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Old 12-12-2011, 07:03 PM   #107
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The same goes for laws and RV's. If one political group is trying to pass laws that will effect our RVing we should know and have a place to discuss it. People who don't care about it don't have to visit.

Discussions about laws and legislation as it pertains to RVs is not off limits. What is off limits is general political discussions and random swipes at 'the other party' and while this is a line that may take some adjusting to we are hopeful that this is a good balance for the community.
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Old 12-12-2011, 09:47 PM   #108
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OMG... someone with an "adult attitude"... if ya dont like it dont read it ! WOW What a concept.

And we wonder why we aren't allowed to say the Lord's Prayer or Pledge of Allegiance in schools... must have several ACLU Lawyers on staff !

Censorship and the killing of Free Speach are prime reasons our country is what it is these days. Heaven forbit we should speak of religion, murderous firearms, or corrupt politicians...
Mega and I have choreographed this exchange to show you all why the rules exist.

The thread begins with a simple recitation of facts. My cohort then cleverly injects a falacious absolute, eg suggesting that the Pledge is not allowed, popular but false urban lore. He understands the facts indicate otherwise, but has shown you through brilliant role play why iRV2 must employ these standards, police itself.

None of us, Moderator or Member, will object to a presentation concerning the viability or solvency of Social Security, particularly in light of its effects on retired Americans who utilize RVs. It's like me saying, "At 5:32 AM the sun will rise over the California coast." Simple fact.

Invariably, someone has to add, "It would rise earlier if the Japanese whaling fleet weren't slaughtering all dolphins within 300 miles of the Hawaiian islands," and suddenly, we're off the iRV2 playing field. Emotion, fabrications, and some good ol' fashioned opinionating act in concert to propel the discussion outside our rules.
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Old 12-12-2011, 10:01 PM   #109
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...Sure, there may be some heated discussions about some issues but it would be between the forum members not the general members.
With all due respect, discussions are not only between members in a particular Forum. All our Forums are visible to all our members & all members may post in any Forum. There is no separation between what you call a forum member & a general member; they are one & the same.

It has also been observed discussions in one Forum can move & creep into other Forums. They don't always stay contained to where they originate.

Because we want ALL members to be able to enjoy ALL our Forums, for that reason, we have restrictions on some content.

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Old 12-13-2011, 06:38 AM   #110
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we would like to maintain iRV2 as a great place to discuss RVing.

Really this is about being venue-appropriate;...
...We are an RVing forum.
Straight from the marketing department of the advertising corporation that owns this forum and many others, for the sole purpose of selling advertising to companies in the rv industry? (and many other industries, this is not an rv specific corporation...google "social knowledge")

A "community" of people such as this one will discuss many things. It's really not possible to legislate "staying on subject" without destroying the community.

why does the general discussion forum still exist then?
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Old 12-13-2011, 06:54 AM   #111
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Here is how I look at not allowing some topics on a forum.

Say you have purchased brand X automobile four in a row. The first one was great so you buy a second. From then on they get worse and you keep having problems with them. So what do you do? You stop buying them of course.

So on they forum there is a discussion about topic X. At first there is no problem but after that there is a battle when this topic is discussed and it gets worse every time. So what do you do? Keep fixing it. No you get rid of the problem.

In a perfect world your every car you bought would be great and we could talk about anything on a public forum and never have an argument.

Thanks for listening to my analogy.
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Old 12-13-2011, 07:04 AM   #112
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Folks, regardless of your political affiliation and/or thoughts on gun control, we need to consider what the majority of the country has decided when it comes to gun legislation -- only one state, Illinois, does not allow some form of concealed carry by private citizens, http://www.nraila.org/maps/rtc.jpg, and many RV'ers carry guns when they travel. In addition, more RV'ers than many realize carry a concealed weapon during their daily visits to Wal-Mart and other public places. Our sticking our head in the ground and ignoring the number of gun owners as relates to RV'lng is not going to change this growing practice.
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