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Old 04-07-2011, 07:27 PM   #1
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A question for Marines

I've got a serious question for Marines, why is your mascot an English Bulldog? Now I not impartial on this as Zeus is an American Bulldog. American Bulldogs are bigger tougher and better looking than their english counterparts. They are used to hunt wild boars, I can't imagine an english bulldogs having the stamina or tenacity for that. In England there is a movement to restore the Olde English bulldog which looks almost identical to an American Bulldog. I'm not trying to offend those with English Bulldogs as they are nice dogs, but the Marines should be represented by a fellow American. If his stupid american owner could figure it out I'd post some picturesBy the way Zeus stands 26" at the shoulder and weights 110#
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Old 04-07-2011, 07:37 PM   #2
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Hmmmmmm good question.
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Old 04-07-2011, 07:41 PM   #3
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Thanks to the German Army, the U.S. Marine Corps has an unofficial mascot. During World War I many German reports had called the attacking Marines "teufel-hunden," meaning Devil-Dogs. Teufel-hunden were the vicious, wild, and ferocious mountain dogs of Bavarian folklore.

Soon afterward a U.S. Marine recruiting poster depicted a snarling English Bulldog wearing a Marine Corps helmet. Because of the tenacity and demeanor of the breed, the image took root with both the Marines and the public. The Marines soon unofficially adopted the English Bulldog as their mascot.

At the Marine base at Quantico, Virginia, the Marines obtained a registered English Bulldog, King Bulwark. In a formal ceremony on 14 October 1922, BGen. Smedley D. Butler signed documents enlisting the bulldog, renamed Jiggs, for the "term of life." Pvt. Jiggs then began his official duties in the U.S. Marine Corps.

A hard-charging Marine, Pvt. Jiggs did not remain a private for long. Within three months he was wearing corporal chevrons on his custom-made uniform. On New Years Day 1924, Jiggs was promoted to Sergeant. And in a meteoric rise, he got promoted again -- this time to Sergeant Major -- seven months later.

SgtMaj. Jiggs' death on 9 January 1927 was mourned throughout the Corps. His satin-lined coffin lay in state in a hangar at Quantico, surrounded by flowers from hundreds of Corps admirers. He was interred with full military honors.

But, a replacement was on the way. Former heavyweight boxing champion, James J. "Gene" Tunney, who had fought with the Marines in France, donated his English Bulldog. Renamed as Jiggs II, he stepped into the role of his predecessor.

Big problem! No discipline! Jiggs chased people, he bit people. He showed a total lack of respect for authority. The new Jiggs would have likely made an outstanding combat Marine, but barracks life did not suit him. After one of his many rampages, he died of heat exhaustion on 1928. Nonetheless, other bulldogs followed. During the 1930s, 1940s, and early 1950s they were all named Smedley, a tribute to Gen. Butler.

In the late 1950s the Marine Barracks in Washington, the oldest post in the Corps, became the new home for the Corps' mascot. Renamed Chesty to honor the legendary LtGen. Lewis B. "Chesty" Puller Jr., the mascot made his first formal public appearance at the Evening Parade on 5 July 1957. In his canine Dress Blues, Chesty became an immediate media darling, a smash hit!

After the demise of the original Chesty, the replacement was named Chesty II. He became an instant renegade. You name it, he did it. He even escaped and went AWOL once. Two days later he was returned in a police paddy wagon. About the only thing he ever managed to do correctly was to sire a replacement.

In contrast to his father, Chesty III proved to be a model Marine. He even became a favorite of neighborhood children, for which he was awarded a Good Conduct Medal. Other bulldogs would follow Chesty III (bulldogs don't live long). When Chesty VI died after an Evening Parade, a Marine detachment in Tennessee called Washington. Their local bulldog mascot, LCpl. Bodacious Little, was standing by for PCS orders to Washington, they reported.

Upon arrival at the Marine Barracks in Washington, LCpl. Little got ceremoniously renamed Chesty VII. He and the English Bulldogs who followed him epitomize the fighting spirit of the U.S. Marines. Tough, muscular, aggressive, fearless, and often arrogant, they are the ultimate canine warriors.

English Bulldogs. Teufel-hunden. Devil Dogs. They symbolize the ethos of the Warrior Culture of the U.S. Marines.

(excerpt from Warrior Culture of the U.S. Marines, Marion F. Sturkey)
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Old 04-07-2011, 07:52 PM   #4
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Retired Army but had to answer many questions like this for formal boards during my time with Joint Service Missions, All services have an Academy Mascot and some have individual unit Mascots. All have Official orders and an actual Rank, they are listed in the Department of Heraldry Archives and some have changed through the years. Here are a few links:
US Marine Corp http://www.usmcpress.com/heritage/ma...rps_mascot.htm
USAF http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bird_(mascot)
US Army http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1362897/posts
US Coast Guard http://www.uscg.mil/history/uscghist/Mascots.asp
US Navy http://www.usna.edu/PAO/facts/faqbill.htm
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Old 04-07-2011, 07:53 PM   #5
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Thank you Bob! As a Marine Brat, Grand Brat and former Marine Spouse, I enjoyed re-reading this bit of Corps nostalgia!! Ooh-rah!!

Sheila
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Old 04-07-2011, 08:45 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob/Becky D - VA View Post
Thanks to the German Army, the U.S. Marine Corps has an unofficial mascot. During World War I many German reports had called the attacking Marines "teufel-hunden," meaning Devil-Dogs. Teufel-hunden were the vicious, wild, and ferocious mountain dogs of Bavarian folklore.

Soon afterward a U.S. Marine recruiting poster depicted a snarling English Bulldog wearing a Marine Corps helmet. Because of the tenacity and demeanor of the breed, the image took root with both the Marines and the public. The Marines soon unofficially adopted the English Bulldog as their mascot.

At the Marine base at Quantico, Virginia, the Marines obtained a registered English Bulldog, King Bulwark. In a formal ceremony on 14 October 1922, BGen. Smedley D. Butler signed documents enlisting the bulldog, renamed Jiggs, for the "term of life." Pvt. Jiggs then began his official duties in the U.S. Marine Corps.

A hard-charging Marine, Pvt. Jiggs did not remain a private for long. Within three months he was wearing corporal chevrons on his custom-made uniform. On New Years Day 1924, Jiggs was promoted to Sergeant. And in a meteoric rise, he got promoted again -- this time to Sergeant Major -- seven months later.

SgtMaj. Jiggs' death on 9 January 1927 was mourned throughout the Corps. His satin-lined coffin lay in state in a hangar at Quantico, surrounded by flowers from hundreds of Corps admirers. He was interred with full military honors.

But, a replacement was on the way. Former heavyweight boxing champion, James J. "Gene" Tunney, who had fought with the Marines in France, donated his English Bulldog. Renamed as Jiggs II, he stepped into the role of his predecessor.

Big problem! No discipline! Jiggs chased people, he bit people. He showed a total lack of respect for authority. The new Jiggs would have likely made an outstanding combat Marine, but barracks life did not suit him. After one of his many rampages, he died of heat exhaustion on 1928. Nonetheless, other bulldogs followed. During the 1930s, 1940s, and early 1950s they were all named Smedley, a tribute to Gen. Butler.

In the late 1950s the Marine Barracks in Washington, the oldest post in the Corps, became the new home for the Corps' mascot. Renamed Chesty to honor the legendary LtGen. Lewis B. "Chesty" Puller Jr., the mascot made his first formal public appearance at the Evening Parade on 5 July 1957. In his canine Dress Blues, Chesty became an immediate media darling, a smash hit!

After the demise of the original Chesty, the replacement was named Chesty II. He became an instant renegade. You name it, he did it. He even escaped and went AWOL once. Two days later he was returned in a police paddy wagon. About the only thing he ever managed to do correctly was to sire a replacement.

In contrast to his father, Chesty III proved to be a model Marine. He even became a favorite of neighborhood children, for which he was awarded a Good Conduct Medal. Other bulldogs would follow Chesty III (bulldogs don't live long). When Chesty VI died after an Evening Parade, a Marine detachment in Tennessee called Washington. Their local bulldog mascot, LCpl. Bodacious Little, was standing by for PCS orders to Washington, they reported.

Upon arrival at the Marine Barracks in Washington, LCpl. Little got ceremoniously renamed Chesty VII. He and the English Bulldogs who followed him epitomize the fighting spirit of the U.S. Marines. Tough, muscular, aggressive, fearless, and often arrogant, they are the ultimate canine warriors.

English Bulldogs. Teufel-hunden. Devil Dogs. They symbolize the ethos of the Warrior Culture of the U.S. Marines.

(excerpt from Warrior Culture of the U.S. Marines, Marion F. Sturkey)
A very interesting tale, I must say an American Bulldog has all the qualities plus they're American !!
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Old 04-07-2011, 08:53 PM   #7
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A very interesting tale, I must say an American Bulldog has all the qualities plus they're American !!
Sorry, but it is not a "tale." The Marine culture is steeped in history and we honor those who went before and the traditions they established. We do not believe in altering our history for the lastest and greatest fad. Just the way we are. You have to be one to understand.

I'm sure your dog is great and the breed is fearsome, but don't expect the Marine Corps to change this particular tradition in any of our lifetimes.

Bob
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Old 04-07-2011, 11:23 PM   #8
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Hmmmmmmmmmm do you think that the American Bulldog as a breed originated from the English Bulldog?
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Old 04-07-2011, 11:41 PM   #9
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Semper Fi.. always loved to see the USMC come marching in...meant we could leave the area and head home to family as all that remained was the cleanup !
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Old 04-08-2011, 12:01 AM   #10
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Here is the breeding history of the American Bulldog.

History/Origin:
Bulldogs in England were originally working dogs who drove and caught cattle and guarded their masters' property.

Jem Burn's Cribb, around 1850
At one time, the breed was used in the grueling sport of bull baiting. With the outlawing of the sport in England in 1835, the original type of Bulldog disappeared from Britain and was replaced with the less athletic dog we now know as the English Bulldog. Yet the original Bulldog was preserved by immigrants who brought their working dogs with them to the American South. By the end of World War II, the last remnants of the working English Bulldog were disappearing in the U.S. Thanks to the breeding programs of John D. Johnson and Allen Scott, the breed was brought back from the brink of extinction. The American Bulldog was recognized by the United Kennel Club in 1999 in the rare, working class.


As you can see, the English Bulldog is the strain that finally produced your breed of dog. Since the Marines stick with tradition and do not sway in their long held beliefs and ideas, we are proud to know that our past is preserved instead of blowing in the wind.
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Old 04-08-2011, 02:11 AM   #11
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Semper-Fi Y'all
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Old 04-08-2011, 04:30 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by Bob/Becky D - VA View Post
Sorry, but it is not a "tale." The Marine culture is steeped in history and we honor those who went before and the traditions they established. We do not believe in altering our history for the lastest and greatest fad. Just the way we are. You have to be one to understand.

I'm sure your dog is great and the breed is fearsome, but don't expect the Marine Corps to change this particular tradition in any of our lifetimes.

Bob
Sorry,I didn't mean to denigrate Marine history, I honestly didn't know the facts behind the tradition. It just seems odd the with all the americanism going on, the choice seemed strange that an English Bulldog would represent American Fighting Men with such a proud history.
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Old 04-08-2011, 05:15 PM   #13
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Sorry,I didn't mean to denigrate Marine history, I honestly didn't know the facts behind the tradition. It just seems odd the with all the americanism going on, the choice seemed strange that an English Bulldog would represent American Fighting Men with such a proud history.
No offense taken. It was clear you intended none.
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Old 04-08-2011, 11:48 PM   #14
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Bulldo info

English Bulldog Information and Pictures
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