We used to have slaves here too, but, like your example, that is ancient history relatively speaking.
We don't do witch hunts, slavery, lynchings, my goodness we don't even allow an animal to be hurt in the making of a movie anymore!
Nor do we send cavalry on horseback to fight the Native Americans anymore, misnamed "Indians" when Columbus thought he'd sailed to India originally.
Simply put, we have a history, some of which we aren't as proud of as other parts.
The bad parts we fixed more than a century ago.
Some other countries and totalitarian leaders are going in the opposite direction.
Which was the original point of this thread.
We have learned and don't behave that way anymore. We are still learning as a nation.
If you want to make it a win/lose situation that is entirely your choice. You'll have to shadow box a win/lose as I was not, nor will be, a participant.
I never implied that, you did.
But I will say that I am apalled at how so many Americans take the side against our own country, and can only count the bad, and not the blessings. Nevermind our inherent ability and successful striving to make change and right wrongs as a democracy.
I think that perhaps the Native Americans today would grin at your statement, at least those who now run Casinos and oil wells of their own for their people.
It took awhile but they, and we, are getting there.
I also daresay that making them out to be victims today would insult their own pride at adapting to circumstances in the last 100 years, and beginning to use the system to get ahead, as it should be.
We've made mistakes in our past. I also state unequivocally, that our history is filled with less bloodshed and terror than most of the other older cultures who scoff at us, for protecting them as well.
It does have its share, but today, your examples are to put it fairly, irrelevant.
It would be the equivalent of complaining that we never made a superior buggy whip. Despite the fact that we don't use horse and wagons anymore except for show.
lwmuddy, I have one question for you. Do you actually believe that if we draw into our borders, become isolationist, and just ignore what happens in the rest of the world, that they would not eventually come to our shores, as they have done so many times before?
I use they to mean whoever the country is that wants us gone at any moment in history?
If I had the power to have every American spend a day as a tutu in Africa, a health care worker in Romania, a poor family of Bedoins in Egypt or Saudi, or a peasant in Western China or the boonies of India, perhaps we would honor our own honor and commitment, more uniformly.
Heck, I would love to see every American serve two years's mandatory military service peacetime as well as wartime. I think the training, not just the weapons, and the exposure would really change a lot of perspectives for the better.
But then that is not our way. Nor should it be. That is just the statement of a guy who did serve 27 years, and saw the changes as our young professionals matured.
Just like our country did. Yet we still see folks holding the youth of our country against us. Valid only if we had not matured and changed those behaviors. Which we did. I have a feeling many of those same folks would be really upset if their behaviors as a youth were held against them as an adult, barring felonies.
We take our quality of life for granted as much as a child does their parents when not in an abusive home.
My favorite quote from Will Rogers:
"It ain't what a man knows that gets him in trouble. It's what he thinks he knows, but just ain't so."
If you post to me directly, I'll give you the courtesy of an answer, best I can do.
I will not play the bad guy to you claiming I won to your losing, as you posted.
You will be solely responsible for what you post here. If it isn't well researched or thought through, then only you can be held responsible. Not me. I do not stand over you with a weapon and force you to write what you do, good or bad.
No offense intended, none taken by me. The rest is up to you.
That my friend is called a win/win.
Keep your blinds closed or open, as Americans we have that luxury.
Only because a group of professionals will be ever vigilant, and ready, when monsters try to come to our neighborhood.
If you believe that is hype, you've never held a comrade in your arms, or a fellow American from 9/11 as they breathed their last breath.
You haven't seen decapitations and murders and had to clean up the mess. From any war.
Or witnessed genocide for whatever reason as a peacekeeper.
Or even lived outside of our country to see how the real world operates.
If you think that is insulting because it is true, nothing could be further from the truth.
We live in America, and that is exactly what the folks who protect you do, and want. If our countrymen can exibit a naivete in the world today, we have done our job well.
But it would help if we acknowledged that the horrific images on our news today are not special effects or fiction.
I am glad I do not have to make the decisions of our highest leaders today.
I am proud they can be openly criticized in our free country.
Why? Because we aren't even close to perfect. We need opposition opinions regardless of our political leanings,
In short, we do need discussions like this thread, which I originally thought would cause problems for the forum.
You see, we all CAN contibute.
This thread is about being vigilant, whether left or right, immigrant or native born, regardless of race or religion, that vigilance is necessary.
I submit, in reality, that the only time our leaders will have surely failed is when you see foreign military occupying our country.
Please do not compare our occupation of Iraq as the same as if we stood by and let that happen here. Or compare it to our system.
We have not gassed opposition states or cities in our country. Saddam did.
We do not torture our civilians and kill their families for saying anything, even one sentence against the dictator, and send their chopped up body parts to their doorstep to teach them a lesson. Saddam did.
We do, to this day, allow SALT Treaty inspectors to inspect our faciltities World-wide to prove our compliance with that World-wide treaty. If we refused the world would be sure we were hiding proscribed weapons. As we suspected, with the rest of the world, when Saddam refused UN inspectors.
I respect your right to slam us or praise us, but prefer a rational middle ground for myself. See we aren't perfect, but we are trying.
So I hope we can discuss, instead of claiming bully or victim roles, or otherwise trying to be manipulative, and continue a dialog based on opinions as well as fact.
If not, to paraphrase a Val Kilmer line as Doc Holiday, then I guess, "I'm your daisy."
(Thanks to Marcia for helping me dot my i's and cross my t's.)