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Old 12-12-2011, 10:48 PM   #281
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Originally Posted by tncruiser
i live in an area with tva steam plants save your fossil fuel so we can make more steam so you can fill your fuel saving (?????) vehicle , who are we kidding i just read that a 2011 ford raptor f150 (v8 3 gazillion hp) put out less pollution that a weed wacker,\. china dont give flip about earth pollution while we are buying thier crap . how clean are we supposed to be c02 is a pollutant so i guess we gotta all stop breathing. the green revolution is really a marxist revolution and most of us (my self include) buy into this crap
buy american and you will do more for the earth that any other decision you can make
my vehicle are as follows
73 dodge built in detroit
2011 f53 gtown built in indiana
2011 jeep wrangler 79% american content built in toledo
2012 ford explorer 85% american content built in chicago
i look at every label of everything i buy and always choose america 1st as my best defense for being green
Did that American made computer you used to type your reply come with a shift key and a spell check program?
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Old 12-13-2011, 06:24 AM   #282
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Did that American made computer you used to type your reply come with a shift key and a spell check program?
computer is not from USA and i dont speak or spell with a shift key
i said i choose American made when possible and as for your sarcasm i personally dont give a shift what you think
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Old 12-13-2011, 06:43 AM   #283
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Time out!

Let's stop the personal comments as they are not in keeping with our mission statement nor our rules.

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Old 12-13-2011, 08:33 AM   #284
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computer is not from USA and i dont speak or spell with a shift key
i said i choose American made when possible and as for your sarcasm i personally dont give a shift what you think
brianj
Sorry, I didn't mean to offend you or the moderator. Sometimes the sprit of my humor doesn't come through in print. I DID forget the .



On topic: IMHO, the Volt is a useful experiment. There is really no way to see if something like this is going to work in mass production unless it truly is "mass produced". Those purchasing it should realize (and I would assume they do) that the technology is in it's infant stage. There are going to be problems, the next generation will be better (or there won't be a next generation). If my commute fit into the parameters of the Volt's electric only range, I might consider joining the experiment. I wouldn't really expect my TCO to be significantly less than a high milage diesel but being a techno junkie, I might give it a try.

Personally I feel super high milage turbo diesels are the way to go for the next couple of decades. They are already widely used in Europe.
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Old 12-13-2011, 08:50 AM   #285
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Sorry, I didn't mean to offend you or the moderator. Sometimes the sprit of my humor doesn't come through in print. I DID forget the .



On topic: IMHO, the Volt is a useful experiment. There is really no way to see if something like this is going to work in mass production unless it truly is "mass produced". Those purchasing it should realize (and I would assume they do) that the technology is in it's infant stage. There are going to be problems, the next generation will be better (or there won't be a next generation). If my commute fit into the parameters of the Volt's electric only range, I might consider joining the experiment. I wouldn't really expect my TCO to be significantly less than a high milage diesel but being a techno junkie, I might give it a try.

Personally I feel super high milage turbo diesels are the way to go for the next couple of decades. They are already widely used in Europe.
"Personally I feel super high milage turbo diesels are the way to go for the next couple of decades. They are already widely used in Europe."[/QUOTE

this sir, is what you call hitting the nail right on the head.
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Old 12-13-2011, 09:15 AM   #286
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"Personally I feel super high milage turbo diesels are the way to go for the next couple of decades. They are already widely used in Europe."[/QUOTE

this sir, is what you call hitting the nail right on the head.
Maybe that's why oil companies are keeping Diesel 84 cent a gallon more than regular around here $3.99vs$3.15. By keeping the cost of diesel high they may convince some people not to switch.
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Old 12-13-2011, 09:22 AM   #287
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Personally I feel super high milage turbo diesels are the way to go for the next couple of decades. They are already widely used in Europe.
Unfortunately, the U.S. EPA's emission standards target NOx as a smog precursor - this is an area where diesels are at a disadvantage vis-a-vis gasoline engines. Further, the U.S. (and most states) imposes a higher fuel tax on diesel than gasoline. In other words, our policies serve to DISCOURAGE the increased use of the diesel engine in the U.S.

Europe, on the other hand, targets greenhouse gases (primarily CO2) with its emissions standards, and this (along with much better brake specific fuel consumption) is an area where the diesel has a significant advantage over gasoline engines. Recognizing this, most (if not all) European countries tax diesel at a lower rate than gasoline. They actively PROMOTE the high mileage turbodiesel - that's why 50% or more of their new vehicle sales (according to the statistics I've seen) are turbodiesel powered.

By the way, as a mechanical engineer who has worked for a manufacturer of large industrial engines (gaseous fueled as well as diesel) for 38+ years, I agree that use of the European-style turbodiesel should be encouraged in the U.S. as yet another "Green" technology.


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Old 12-13-2011, 09:26 AM   #288
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1st gas engine autos were expensive...not idiot proof and by far not reliable.
1st diesel engine autos were the same and way under powered.
Time has made improvements with them both.
Same will happen with the electric movement. It is in it's trial stages...and there is a lot that has not been thought about (ie. road tax, smart elec meters, future electric costs etc etc).
Would electric be so popular if oil prices were less? NO. Is electric cleaner than oil for fuel? Who honestly knows??? All the google searches available won't tell us the truth. The media sure can't, as most tests are leaning 1 way or the other...so who actually knows?
Can electric vehicles be better in the future? Sure....
Is an electric vehicle the "answer"? for some it is, and some it isn't
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Old 12-13-2011, 11:18 AM   #289
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1st gas engine autos were expensive...not idiot proof and by far not reliable.
1st diesel engine autos were the same and way under powered.
Time has made improvements with them both.
Same will happen with the electric movement. It is in it's trial stages...and there is a lot that has not been thought about (ie. road tax, smart elec meters, future electric costs etc etc).
Would electric be so popular if oil prices were less? NO. Is electric cleaner than oil for fuel? Who honestly knows??? All the google searches available won't tell us the truth. The media sure can't, as most tests are leaning 1 way or the other...so who actually knows?
Can electric vehicles be better in the future? Sure....
Is an electric vehicle the "answer"? for some it is, and some it isn't
Electric cars have been around since the 1890s on and off History of Electric Vehicles - Early Years
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Old 12-13-2011, 12:01 PM   #290
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FACT- The Volt has a 9.3 gallon gas tank that does take premium fuel. (This is required because the premium fuel has better stability which may be needed because it is not being used.)
Why not use 87 and add your own Stabilizer good for over a year for the gas?
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Old 12-13-2011, 06:18 PM   #291
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I heard what your saying but for $1.50? Not worth my time.
Plus higher octane can/should run a little more timing which in turn should get a smidge more mileage.
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Old 12-13-2011, 10:51 PM   #292
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Hondo, you are correct. Electric cars have not ever been attempted to be mass produced in the qty the current manufacturers/ gov't are wishing. There has never been so much push for electric cars until recent years.
With time, they may or may not take a grasp on the drivers requirements...but with time if they follow suite of the other type autos of the past...they will get better.
Personally I have NO use for an electric car...as a matter of fact...not even an electric golf cart...and once I am old(r) and crippled...my "Rascal" scooter will be gas powered.
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Old 12-14-2011, 08:37 AM   #293
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Originally Posted by offthewall View Post
Sorry, I didn't mean to offend you or the moderator. Sometimes the sprit of my humor doesn't come through in print. I DID forget the .



On topic: IMHO, the Volt is a useful experiment. There is really no way to see if something like this is going to work in mass production unless it truly is "mass produced". Those purchasing it should realize (and I would assume they do) that the technology is in it's infant stage. There are going to be problems, the next generation will be better (or there won't be a next generation). If my commute fit into the parameters of the Volt's electric only range, I might consider joining the experiment. I wouldn't really expect my TCO to be significantly less than a high milage diesel but being a techno junkie, I might give it a try.

Personally I feel super high milage turbo diesels are the way to go for the next couple of decades. They are already widely used in Europe.
not offended just wanted to use my "i dont give a shift" comment
i still maintain electric is not free so no savings of dollars or pollution we are just moving it around and when we start paying a road tax on electricity we will all wake up to the fact we are taxed,overtaxed and retaxed
safe and great travels in 2012
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Old 12-14-2011, 11:01 AM   #294
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The staff would like to ask for everyone's help on this thread.

As you know we have tightened our Community Rules to prohibit the discussion on politics/government policies which are not directly pertaining to RVs. Members and staff alike are working our way through the transition to these new standards.

This thread pre-dates our new rules and already contained a lot of political discussion which had been allowed so we are being just a bit more lenient here while this thread runs its course.

Please help us by keeping your comments as objective as possible.

Thanks

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