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Old 02-20-2015, 02:19 PM   #29
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Civil Asset Forfeiture

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Old 02-20-2015, 02:32 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Sagamore View Post
I think the police have been gradually changed from protection to a nazi state in this country. It is close to no return in giving up all of our freedoms since the patriot act.
I agree. I was an officer until I retired in 1998 and watched as the younger folks came up and started veering from the intent of the law to the letter.

Many of them have a real complex of "us against them".

But I am not blinded either by some of the good guys.

Time will tell where it will end up.
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Old 02-20-2015, 03:45 PM   #31
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I live at the South end of the "Emerald Triangle" in Northern California. Our local paper reports on a pretty regular basis on asset seizure from motorist's on Hwy 101. Most of them have nothing other than having "too much cash". In one case, the man was stopped because he was young, had long hair and was driving a Beemer. He had a lot of cash but nothing else. In the USA, why should I have to prove where my money came from (or forfeit it) if I have committed no other crime or violation?
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Old 02-20-2015, 06:07 PM   #32
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I live at the South end of the "Emerald Triangle" in Northern California. Our local paper reports on a pretty regular basis on asset seizure from motorist's on Hwy 101. Most of them have nothing other than having "too much cash". In one case, the man was stopped because he was young, had long hair and was driving a Beemer. He had a lot of cash but nothing else. In the USA, why should I have to prove where my money came from (or forfeit it) if I have committed no other crime or violation?
Because your local LE has more info than you and the media on the guy they stopped and seized the property from, again more stories without all the info. Have they stopped you and seized your assets, probably not because you are not transporting money or dope, and don't associate with criminals who do so. The traffickers never put the money and dope together anyways. I have yet to hear from an honest law abiding Citizen on IRV2, who was out enjoying the great outdoors with his/her non drug bought MH, getting it or any of their assets seized.
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Old 02-20-2015, 06:20 PM   #33
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"the man was stopped because he was young, had long hair and was driving a Beemer"

This is what the LEO reported, are you OK with that? Do those "facts" make him dishonest? By the way, they took his money and let him go with no charges.

I am very conservative but I don't like the idea of asset seizure without any criminal charges being filed. What happens if some law group decides they want your RV?
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Old 02-20-2015, 07:14 PM   #34
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Well that is what bothers me the most, regardless of whether there is some under cover sting we are not privy to. Taking property from people without them being charge with a crime is obsurd.
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Old 02-20-2015, 07:22 PM   #35
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Well that is what bothers me the most, regardless of whether there is some under cover sting we are not privy to. Taking property from people without them being charge with a crime is absurd.
Moreover it violates the constitution. Congress, nor any state can write a law that is in conflict with the constitution. They can however pass an amendment which they have not done.
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Old 02-20-2015, 07:25 PM   #36
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"the man was stopped because he was young, had long hair and was driving a Beemer"

This is what the LEO reported, are you OK with that? Do those "facts" make him dishonest? By the way, they took his money and let him go with no charges.

I am very conservative but I don't like the idea of asset seizure without any criminal charges being filed. What happens if some law group decides they want your RV?
I guarantee you that's not why they stopped him, that's just the info they report out to the media. Probably 90% of the time they let them go, the main reason is so there are no reports necessary where the probable cause is disclosed, so they will be able to continue the investigation on the bigger fish and not compromise it. There will be an Asset Forfeiture Hearing in the near future( dates vary by amount/circs/jurisdiction)but usually within 30 days) and I will tell you that about 99.9% of the time they never show up to fight it. That would be a clue that they are not targeting innocent people like yourself. And guess what when the case is all wrapped up they get warrants for those they let go and arrest them and file criminal charges.

Being conservative as you say you are I'm sure if you had all the info and could actually read a whole case from start to finish that may cover months if not years of investigation, you would agree they are doing the right thing, and as economically as possible with the taxpayers money. Nobody in our Government is out to seize my MH, that worry is not even on my radar. You Gotta trust somebody, this isn't some third world country, it's just some criminals who think our rights are so free here in the US, who try to make an illegal buck off selling their drugs here because they would be killed in their country.
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Old 02-20-2015, 07:38 PM   #37
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In this case you are just wrong. The young man got an attorney and the whole case went thru court and the testimony was reported in the paper. The young man lost because he would not or could not explain where the money came from (to the courts satisfaction). The LEO's even admitted they stopped him because "he fit the profile" of a drug runner. No crime committed, assets forfeited. It didn't happen to me so no big deal?
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Old 02-20-2015, 08:01 PM   #38
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In this case you are just wrong. The young man got an attorney and the whole case went thru court and the testimony was reported in the paper. The young man lost because he would not or could not explain where the money came from (to the courts satisfaction). The LEO's even admitted they stopped him because "he fit the profile" of a drug runner. No crime committed, assets forfeited. It didn't happen to me so no big deal?
All I can say is nobody but the guy who lost his money and his attorney knows the whole story. He forfeited the money another clue that there was probable cause you just don't know about. The Judges don't take this lightly, this is the USA, and the Courts err on the side of the defendant like they should. Do you know this for a fact, and by that I mean were you sitting in court and heard the Judges decision, and his reasoning for the decision. Do you really believe the Judge thought "well you look like a dope dealer, and fit the profile and the Cops don't really have any reason for taking the money, they just stopped you to mess with you and found some money, but Oh well we're going to keep it anyway". If you believe that than I don't know what to tell you that would help other than laying out more of the process. And you are probably not as conservative as you think you are. The real truth in life is if it weren't for alcohol and drugs LE would have very little to do on the street crime aspect these days. Ask any street Cop and he/she will tell you the same thing.

You cannot believe everything you read in the paper. That's how Urban legends like this get started, a lot of misinformation gets reported and exaggerated, kinda like the "telephone line" you played in elementary school to teach you how much the story can change when info is exchanged thru several people with different perceptions. There was a reason the "young man" could not or would not reveal where he got the money( and not because he could not remember). I will tell you in the very few times where someone actually contested the seizures, the judges are very liberal in returning the money, usually when it came down to LE not wanting to reveal all of it's probable cause which would hinder the bigger investigation. This has been a big resource in the fight against Illegal Drugs being sold to the youth( and adults ) in the US.
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Old 02-20-2015, 08:05 PM   #39
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Old 02-20-2015, 08:10 PM   #40
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I agree. I think we have to agree to disagree on this and move on. I would like to hear from other people before this gets shut down and I am blacklisted on IRV2 and the RV police come and take my RV
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Old 02-20-2015, 08:10 PM   #41
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Old 02-20-2015, 08:13 PM   #42
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In this case you are just wrong. The young man got an attorney and the whole case went thru court and the testimony was reported in the paper. The young man lost because he would not or could not explain where the money came from (to the courts satisfaction). The LEO's even admitted they stopped him because "he fit the profile" of a drug runner. No crime committed, assets forfeited. It didn't happen to me so no big deal?
No UFO Pilot, Mike is exactly correct. Common sense tells you that there just isn't a conspiracy behind every squad car waiting to seize your money and motor home. LEO's have far more important things to do every day. And in your relating the facts of the story, the young man apparently looked similar to others who were known to run drugs, had a large amount of unexplained cash, and could not or would not satisfy the court as to its origin. And he had an attorney to help in court. Sometimes you just have to accept that two plus two equals four. Don't do anything illegal, comply with lawfull requests from LEO's and you have nothing to worry about.
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