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Old 06-11-2012, 12:04 PM   #29
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That's just like there idea of using alot of metric fasteners on vehicles. They start selling more outside of the US and then start building them there so they don't have to ship them and pay import or export taxes and get cheaper labor. I own a 1980 Corvette and you wouldn't believe how many metric bolts it has. Everything sold in the US should be made here and get rid of the European Metric system here.
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Old 06-11-2012, 12:17 PM   #30
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I belive GM (and Chrysler)has paid back thier TARP money.
No sir. They still owe plenty. The gov't (as I remember) still owns millions of shares of GM stock (26% of all outstanding shares) and unless it gets to the mid 40's (double where it is now) they can't sell it for break even.
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Old 06-11-2012, 12:20 PM   #31
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FYI: There are only two major companies that make club heads in the world, for ALL of the different brands, and both are chinese companies..............just sayin'.............:nonono :
I think you will find Ping makes some of it's clubs here (and some there). Cleveland Does as well. But for the most part you are correct.
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Old 06-11-2012, 12:25 PM   #32
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It's not just cheap Walmart stuff and GM cars. A local golf course loaned me a Taylormade RocketBallz driver, on the label "Head Made in China, Shaft Made in China, Assembled in China". Cost $300 US.
$250 on eBay. Just bought one. Great quality and works just fine.
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Old 06-11-2012, 12:41 PM   #33
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Don't like it,,,, But America has to come first, but the Politicians and the needs of the Greedy ...!
I agree America should come first. However, Greedy goes multiple ways. Greedy workers wanting raises, free healthcare while working and in retirement. All those Greedy workers who want the bigger house, bigger car, that boat, extra car, RV or motorcycle they don't need but want demand higher and higher wages and benefits all of which add to the cost goods sold. Are these the Greedy you refer to?

Then there are all those low income shoppers who are just looking for low priced products. Let's not forget all those mexicans that come here to pick our crops (which Americans will NOT do) need low priced products as well. Their need for lower priced products force the stores/companies to find lower cost suppliers which at this point are mostly in Asia. But I guess these Greedy Walmart/Target/Kmart shoppers are the problem.

GM moving to China to better compete in that market makes a lot of sense just as BMW/VW/Toyota/Nissan/... have come here.
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Old 06-11-2012, 12:46 PM   #34
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Every Apple Computer product that you can buy .... "Made in China."

Am I not going to buy an iPhone, iPad, iPod or whatever ... i bet I might.

How many times do we read on the board, just go over to Harbor Freight and spend $2 on something.

NH Northern products, mostly are Chinese.

The computer you're banging on right now ... could be made in China.

Let ye who is without Chinese products in your life, cast the first stone. We live in a global economy and the world is getting smaller every day. Good news is that we're not going to have to bail out China using funds from the IMF like the PIGS.

I like GM cars and I will look for a Made in the USA product first when it comes time for us to buy a new car. Currently, the 2008 Saturn Vue XE that we own .... was made in .... Mexico.
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Old 06-11-2012, 01:02 PM   #35
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With regards to the bailouts, they were anti-capitalistic. In a purely capitalist system, greatest victory a company can win is to put their competitors out of business. This works to everyone's benefit, over the long haul. Like forest fires are an integral and important part of natures plan to revitalize the ecosystem, so it is with business. If I were in charge of Ford, I'd have been really PO'd about the government bailout of my chief domestic competitors.

What would have happened in lieu of the bailouts? Short term would have been tough for a lot of folks, but from the ashes of a failed GM would have risen new startups with new ideas and innovations. The cream of the GM crop would have migrated over to other companies, Tesla for instance, to give them an infusion of experience and know-how to bring new exciting products to market.

By bailing out these businesses that otherwise would have failed, our government has sandbagged the whole process. Now, its business as usual, again doomed to fail because nothing has changed.

The free market works well and is a self leveling, self correcting system, as long as it is left alone. Government's role is to make sure the playing field remains level, everyone plays by the rules, and otherwise get out of the way.

For our government to stick its hand in the corner pocket to keep GM's (and the UAW's) 8 ball from falling as it should have was a short term benefit for the few at the long term cost of the many. It's not how things should have played out.

Propping up the status quo is never in the best interest of progress.
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Old 06-11-2012, 01:28 PM   #36
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The cream of the GM crop would have migrated over to other companies, Tesla for instance, to give them an infusion of experience and know-how to bring new exciting products to market.
All good stuff. However, after how the Volt has been brought to market, I'm not sure Tesla would want their help!

For me that last exciting product GM offered up was the Pontiac Solstice which of course died when Pontiac died. Let's see they kept Buick and killed Pontiac...
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Old 06-11-2012, 01:47 PM   #37
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He didn't say 7 out of 10 SOLD out of the states, he said BUILT out of the USA.
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:30 AM   #38
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What boils my blood is that the TARP money(USA TAX MONEY) Was supposed to help the companys stay in business here in the US.
WE didn't give Toyota, Nissan, or Hyndia tarp money.
That money was not so that GM could give some of it to the goverment of CHINA.

I don't mind on bit GM selling cars there. Build them in china, sell them in chine. THat makes sense.
Sell em here, build them here.

I think All this shipping around the globe is a waste. I completly understand shipping car to places that do NOT have the factorys and the people that can do it on thier own soil.
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Old 06-12-2012, 11:47 AM   #39
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"The fuel under our feet" will only be sold to overseas buyers. We could open up the U.S. to drilling everywhere and the biggest world bidder would get that fuel. High fuel prices are here to stay because thats the way of the world.Most of the Alaskan pipeline when it was first opened went to Japan dont know who gets it now. China Maybe ??
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Old 06-12-2012, 12:36 PM   #40
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This report is a waaay too biased and misleading....they scare you with the "7 out of 10 vehicles are made outside the US" stat, so you think all the manufacturing is going to China. What they they completely fail to mention is that the Camaro, Impala, Equinox, GMC Terrain and now the Buick Regal are all made in Canada. The Aveo, Cadillac SRX, and many of the Silverados, Sierras, Avalanche, Suburban/Escalade etc are made in Mexico, the Caprice is Australian....and I can go on. So is China the only issue?? Is the US now facing outsourced manufacturing, seeing American products built elsewhere?? Nope! Although I agree that outsourcing has become a problem, it's been this way for 20++ years now.

Part of what is happening is GM is ramping up Asian production for the Asia market. Take the Chevy Cruze for example. It's built almost everywhere the US to Vietnam, and each plant services its respective market. I do agree that China is sketchy, and GM is being a bit greasy in their tactics to lure prospective business though.

Go buy a Dodge!
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Old 06-12-2012, 01:02 PM   #41
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"The fuel under our feet" will only be sold to overseas buyers. We could open up the U.S. to drilling everywhere and the biggest world bidder would get that fuel. High fuel prices are here to stay because thats the way of the world.Most of the Alaskan pipeline when it was first opened went to Japan dont know who gets it now. China Maybe ??
Exactly. It's a world market. Saying we can drive down the price of fuel by ramping up domestic production is like saying my daughter is going to drive down the price of Minute Maid by selling homemade lemonade in the front yard. All she's gonna do is run out of lemons, and then be forced to buy the Minute Maid anyway.

What increasing domestic production WILL do is, for the short term anyway, allow us to stop buying oil from people that hate us and use the money we give them to launch attacks on us. We won't bankrupt them, we're not their only customers, but we will be free of Opec's tyranny. At least until we deplete our supplies and have to go crawling back.
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Old 06-12-2012, 01:12 PM   #42
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GM has had their engines built for years in China. Any of you who have had or own a GM with the 3.4 V-6 know about the intake manifold PLASTIC gasket that fails causing you upteen dollars to have repaired. The car that quickly comes to mind is the Pontiac Grand Am. This leaking problem has been going on for over 12 years and GM won't cover it unless you're still under warranty. When my 03 Grand Am (Toad) started leaking at 38,000 miles I contacted GM when I was told it was a common problem. Their response was that if I took it to a Certified GM garage they MIGHT help with the repair costs since I had low mileage. Three GM dealers quoted me a minimum of $1,000.00 and then said I would more then likely need new heads. I found an honest shop in Barstow, CA who fixed it for $500 bucks and didn't have to replace heads. He even showed me were it was leaking. Labor intensive to get the intake gasket replaced. I contacted GM to see what they would do and because it was done at a non-GM garage I was not given a penny for their dumb idea of using plastic gaskets. I asked if my Grand Prix with the 3.8 had the same potential problem with a plastic gasket, GM said yes. I was ready to buy a new Equinox to replace old Toad, but after hearing that they also have Engine coolant leak problems I choose not to. I traded my Grand Prix, under 40,000 miles in on a new CRV before it started leaking. I still have the Grand Am since it now has a non Plastic gasket.

Would I ever buy another GM product?? Heck NO.
If you don't believe me, google "coolant leaks with GM engines" Can't believe that after all these years GM won't do anything to correct this on going problem. I was a devoted GM guy for over 50 years, never another one for me.
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