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Old 10-04-2019, 08:39 AM   #99
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...some big debits to your account and tried to get away with thousands. But you called your bank and the laws and regulations around electronic transactions kicked in and you actually lost no money - altho you have the inconvenience of waiting for the new card.

Bottom line -you did not actually lose any money.

You do not have this protection with actual cash. Drop your wallet, get pickpocketed or worse, and your actual cash is actually gone. No way to recover it, it's just gone.
Correct and do not think the experience with a credit card fraud is the same when a debit card experiences fraud.

A debit card is a direct pipeline into your account. When money is stolen off a debit card your money is gone, at least temporarily.

By law debit card fraud must be reported within a few days of it occurring or you're liable for the loss (credit card fraud must be reported within 60 days). In practice, no card issuer does that because they would lose customers. If you have multiple debit card frauds do not be surprised if your bank tightens that practice up against you, though.

BUT a bank almost never will just put your money back when you report the debit card fraud. They usually take up to ten business days for investigation purposes. If you have a debit card on your primary account, the one that takes your deposits, and the fraud occurs right after a large deposit, you could be without cash for up to two weeks. Bounced direct utility payments, bounced checks, they're probably your responsibility.

The only safe way to have a debit card is to have two bank accounts, your primary that accepts deposits and a secondary that is used solely for the debit card. They can be at the same bank.

Notify the bank to deactivate the debit card capability on the deposit account and then use the bank's online transfer service to move money into the debit card account as needed. If both accounts are at the same bank the money will move the same day and intra-bank transfers usually are fee-free. If there is a debit fraud on the secondary account at least you still have money in the primary deposit account to live on.

Ray
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Old 10-05-2019, 07:11 AM   #100
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Tortuga Grande - CC fraud

We travel FT. We have several credit cards. We place a limit for each card with the CC Company. Also, they call us if they detect any unsual purchases. They primarily communicate via text and we respond if we go over the set amount. We also let the CC Company know of our travel.
I know it's a hassle for some people. I'd rather be hassled or inconvenienced to call or text them. By the way, to us is not an inconvenience. It's peace of mind.
My wife, the numbers person works magic with our accounting. She daily checks accounts to make sure no one has fraudulently charged our cards. It's comes with the territory.
Also, the cards are insured in case of fraud.
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Old 10-05-2019, 10:28 AM   #101
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Old 10-06-2019, 06:12 PM   #102
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Cash is great at the farmers' market and grocery. Try to rent...anything...with cash. Try to deal with anyone online with cash. Try to buy airline tickets in advance.

Cash is fine in many situations. I always carry some. It is like trying to trade with beads in other situations.
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Old 10-07-2019, 09:18 AM   #103
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Well done
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Old 10-07-2019, 10:08 PM   #104
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Modern problems.

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We carry two credit cards. One of which gives us 5% cash back for fuel. Yesterday I checked the activity on the card and noticed a pending charge from Progressive Insurance for $3500. Thinking this to be odd, I checked online my Progressive account and it was paid in full until June of 2020. I called Progressive and they said that they did not place this charge and that I should call the bank that issues the credit card.

The bank said that the $3500 charge was indeed there and that the previous day they had declined a charge to my card of $2400 supposedly from Progressive.

They said not to worry and would investigate and let me know. In the meantime they were going to cancel the card and send me a new one. How long will that take? 7-10 days.

Here is the problem: We are on a four month trip and no time have we been anywhere for 7-10 days. Luckily, we are at the end of it and will be home next week. In the meantime we are using our back up card.

My question is: How do we avoid this happening again? Do we get a third card just for this contingency? The affected card is the only one that I know of that is usable almost anywhere and gives 5% cash back on fuel.

How did this happen? Many RV parks require a deposit over the phone when you make a reservation. They want the card number, the exp date and the code on the back. How does one reduce the exposure here?

Looking for ideas on this PITA deal.
Been hacked so many times. The best defense I have found is text alerts. All banks now allow you to sign up for alerts. Your card gets used, you get a text. Lets you head off early. All you can do is have multiple cards so you have backups. And there is no excuse for 7-10 days to get a new one. Dump that bank and find one that cares for its card holders. I also use adesignated card for recurring payments and that is all. I donít even carry it. Makes things more simple when your other cards get hacked.
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Old 10-09-2019, 06:01 AM   #105
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I refuse to use a debit card connected to a bank account. i had my bank issue a cash access card (Mastercard) which allows me to transfer cash immediately from the checking account to the cash card when needed. Should the cash card be compromised, the only risk is the cash card balance, which is kept low.

I utilize American Express as well. Their alert to charges is instantaneously. Many times, the alert comes to me BEFORE a waitress returns to my table with the receipt at restaurants. ...thats fast.

Someone mentioned cell phone signal reception earlier. 99% of the time, we have cell phone signal. Our phones are the latest LTE Gigabyte signal which is blistering fast and typically gets a great signal. A few times the signal was very low, but able to operate texts and emails.
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Old 10-09-2019, 06:13 AM   #106
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Thanks to everyone for the great advice, esp. on notifications and having a separate card for auto pays. I am going to do all of them.

But, only one person in all 41 posts addressed my question in post 19. Just how the hell does the crook get the money?...besides buying a Progressive Policy, that is. I am not so sure that many crooks would go to the trouble.


Unfortunately, what ever banks due to stop financial thefts....crooks figure out a way to exploit weaknesses.
As stated before and depending on the refund policy of a carrier, the crook buys a policy with the fraudulent card transaction, cancels the policy, then obtains a refund via a check typically mailed to a post office box or unoccupied home address to be exact. Progressiveís exploited weakness is they refund via check, not back to the origination card. The check can be cashed at a bank or some grocery stores ( good example, like Walmart) with fake ID.

Seems like a lot of work, but crooks donít care and have other methods to obtain larger cash transaction by fraudulent means and typically target senior citizens.
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Old 10-09-2019, 08:44 AM   #107
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No cash at the Costco gas bar.
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Old 10-09-2019, 08:53 AM   #108
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Costco is about the only place we use a debit card but we always select 'Credit' when prompted. the charge still hits our bank account but no without a PIN the info is useless to a crook. my wife is the Costco fan. me? not so much.
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Old 10-09-2019, 09:41 AM   #109
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.....As stated before and depending on the refund policy of a carrier, the crook buys a policy with the fraudulent card transaction, cancels the policy, then obtains a refund via a check typically mailed to a post office box or unoccupied home address to be exact. Progressive’s exploited weakness is they refund via check, not back to the origination card. The check can be cashed at a bank or some grocery stores ( good example, like Walmart) with fake ID.
.....
Progressive told me in a phone conversation that the only way they would issue a refund check is if the policy was paid for by a check that had cleared. Otherwise the refund will go out the way it came in...such as a credit card.
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Old 10-09-2019, 11:33 PM   #110
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I refuse to use a debit card connected to a bank account. i had my bank issue a cash access card (Mastercard) which allows me to transfer cash immediately from the checking account to the cash card when needed. Should the cash card be compromised, the only risk is the cash card balance, which is kept low.

I utilize American Express as well. Their alert to charges is instantaneously. Many times, the alert comes to me BEFORE a waitress returns to my table with the receipt at restaurants. ...thats fast.

Someone mentioned cell phone signal reception earlier. 99% of the time, we have cell phone signal. Our phones are the latest LTE Gigabyte signal which is blistering fast and typically gets a great signal. A few times the signal was very low, but able to operate texts and emails.
That's so cute.

Move out west and tell me about getting cell phone reception 99% of the time. You will have service within a few miles of towns which may be 80 miles apart. It might surprise you to know that includes well over 50% of the US land mass. I always laugh when I see all this stuff being advertised (streaming music, for example) when I know that's not gonna happen in about 50% of places.

If you are east of California and west of St. Louis you better not expect to have continuous cell service. I also lived in the Appalachians. Don't bet your life on cell service there, either.
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Old 10-10-2019, 10:05 AM   #111
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No prosecution

What troubles me most is there is no prosecution. The culprit bought an insurance policy! Really? Shouldn't be hard to find him/her. CC companies just write it off and we pay in fees and interest. I was hacked for a $1000 microscope. I had the shipping address. Discover treated me well but did nothing to protect the vendor. I called the vendor personally and they were able to recall the shipment. Discover would not have contacted them for 30 days while their "fraud" investigation crawled along. The problem is so overwhelming, it is ignored. Prosecution is so difficult because of evidentiary requirements and state lines. The crook is almost guaranteed free of police harassment. And that is why the problem is rampant.
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Old 10-10-2019, 11:05 AM   #112
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My late mother-in-law did not trust online shopping. However, she had no trouble with giving her credit card information out over the phone.

Want to know what one of the most common businesses run out of 'for profit' prisons is? That's right...retail call centers. If you make a purchase over the phone there is an excellent chance you are giving you credit card info to an inmate.

Online security is pretty good.
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