Hybrid tree hugger rant...

[Dunner]

Yep, with headers, cam, ported throttle body, cold air intake, etc.

The only thing "Cash for Clunkers" did was put people in cars they couldn't afford and take some really great cars off the road.

[Dunner]

Has nobody noticed that is a Stepside Dodge Ram?

[Ramblin]

Originally Posted by two-niner

Ramblin: I was not implying you are a "pretender". You are a straight shooter.

And Newcastle Brown Ale does make one's thinking more clear. Seasonal Blue Moon is real clarity, you may want to give them a try.

Kerry

...and I did not take your post as any implication. I used yours as an opportunity to further expand on my beliefs on the topic.

Per your suggestion, Blue Moon Seasonal is on my list for the next beer run.

[slickest1]

Originally Posted by Dunner

Has nobody noticed that is a Stepside Dodge Ram?

It's the first one I've seen. Kind of looks like a Chevy box!

[slickest1]

As an x-logger, I don't have too much use for the tree huggin types that buy these hybrid cars, and tout themselves to be green. If you were to look in their garbage can you would see how green most of them are not.

[Dunner]

Yes, it's a Cheby box. Had it on the road Nov/93(94 was the first year for the new Ram). People were calling and going into Dodge dealers wanting one.

[Lindsay Richards]

You are just lucky your friends didn't buy a Chevy Volt. You would have come to blows.

[rollondown]

Well I look at it this way, I havn't seen a hybrid that can pull my 5'er with the ease of my Cummins Dodge. It also gets 20+ MPG when not pulling. It has 110k on it with no new batteries installed.

[Dogpatch]

Originally Posted by RickO

Ahhh... if we could only do that here on the forum.

Rick

Ditto my friend! Sometimes I just shake my head.

Nice recovery on the friendship conversation Ramblin!

[Craig_R]

Originally Posted by Ramblin

Just to double check myself, since I made this entire argument up out of thin air, and after multiple Newcastle Brown Ale's, I did a little math this morning.

Based on the numbers on the toyota website, MSRP's, MPG claims, etc, I came to the following conclusion:

Camry Hybrid base model VS Camry base model, assume 24000 miles per year usage (which would be low for me, but easy math), and $3.25 per gallon for fuel, which may rise or fall over the timeframe.

Add the City/Hwy MPG of each together and divide by 2 to arrive at an avg MPG for 50/50 mixed driving.

Hybrid = 41MPG avg, $25,990 msrp
Standard = 30MPG avg, $22,055 msrp

To drive the standard model 24000 miles, it will take 800 gallons of fuel, at $3.25 is $2600/yr.

To drive the hybrid those 24000 miles, it will take 585 gallons of fuel, at $3.25 is about $1900/yr

The fuel cost difference is $700, the difference in msrp is $3935 for a payback of 5.62 years before you see any savings from increased fuel economy.

Over those 5.62 years, you will have driven about 135,000 miles.

The battery waranty is 100,000 miles, but you have to get 135,000 miles out of it for payback. Possible... probable, even.

Most people I know don't drive a car more than 5 years. They take out a 60 month note on one, and trade it in for the "new car smell" (and another 60 month note) as soon as they pay it off. (I never understood this behavior) But in order to achieve ANY savings, they would have to drive this one almost 6 years, AND get 33% more life out of the original battery than it is warranted for.

Knowing the folks in the original post as I do, I will virtually guarantee they will be shopping for another new car in 5 years, and will never recoup their hybrid investment.

Just to bring the thread back on point. Ramblin' you did a great analysis on the whole Hybrid vs. Gas Burner. The only thing your forgot was the $7,500 Tax Credit for Plug-In Hybrids and Electrics that the rest of us are footing the bill for. Of course I'm not exactly sure how one would calculate that in, which is exactly what the pols in DC are counting on.

The only reason I thought of that was because my brain was being fueled by a little Sam Adams Summer Ale as opposed to the New Castle Brown.

[Ramblin]

Originally Posted by dogpatch

Ditto my friend! Sometimes I just shake my head.

Nice recovery on the friendship conversation Ramblin!

We've been friends for years, he expects it from me. We agree to disagree on almost everything. One thing we regularly agree on is how well ribeye over real charcoal goes with an ice cold beer and good music. All the hybrid talk really takes a back seat when you put it in that context.

[Dogpatch]

Originally Posted by Ramblin

We've been friends for years, he expects it from me. We agree to disagree on almost everything. One thing we regularly agree on is how well ribeye over real charcoal goes with an ice cold beer and good music. All the hybrid talk really takes a back seat when you put it in that context.

I agree as well. You really can't beat fresh kill on real charcoal. It's really tough to duplicate that taste on today's gas grill.

That coupled with the other two accoutrements and topped off with some good friendly banter makes for a real winner!

[LadyFitz...]

Originally Posted by dogpatch

...You really can't beat fresh kill on real charcoal...

Ah yes, the smell of burning dead cow. Love it!

[Dunner]

Kinda hard to put a live cow on the barbie. They don't fit and put up one hell of a fight when you try.