Community Forums

**Petro** · 05-12-2008, 03:58 AM

A couple of years ago I ran across this site. It seemed far fetched at the time but now it is starting to make sense.

Here is a link to the site. It is interesting reading. Oil Crash

Don

**Petro** · 05-12-2008, 03:58 AM

A couple of years ago I ran across this site. It seemed far fetched at the time but now it is starting to make sense.

Here is a link to the site. It is interesting reading. Oil Crash

Don

Oemtech · 05-12-2008, 04:39 AM

It will take the average person a few days to weeks to digest the information provided on that site. But, if you follow all the links it will take you weeks or months

The bottom line is... the amount of oil is limited and the demand is NOT.

We need to find ECONOMICAL alternate forms of energy to offset this. We also need to change the way transport people from place to place. Our rail system is a joke compared to Europe or Japan.

RustyJC · 05-12-2008, 04:57 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by oemtech:
Our rail system is a joke compared to Europe or Japan. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Distances between cities in the U.S. are also orders of magnitude greater than in Europe or Japan. That's one factor that has historically worked against passenger rail in the U.S. Commuter rail/light rail is another matter - if it runs on the right schedules and goes to/from the right places with affordable fares, it might be a reasonable alternative in major metro areas.

Rusty

apackof2 · 05-12-2008, 06:57 AM

What we need to do immediately is drill more oil wells and remove draconian EPA regulations that make it all but impossible to build an oil refinery.

Case in point:

Arizona Clean Fuelshas been trying to build since 1998the most technologically advanced refinery in the history of the United States. When completed, the Arizona Clean Fuels refinery will produce the cleanest burning gasoline, diesel and jet fuel in all of North America.
The amount of oil is not limited...we just cannot get it because of the cost, regulations and radical environmentalists.
Somehow if you mention ANWR it means you don't care about the environment. Well, I'm hoping now people, when they say "ANWR," means you don't care about the gasoline prices that people are paying.
I usually cringe whenever I think about U.S. oil production. Ever since peaking in 1970, production at
U.S. oil fields has been spiraling downwards.
But this shouldn't be news to you, however.
In fact, I've talked about peak oil in the U.S. on numerous occasions with my Energy and Capital readers.
How far has production fallen?
According to the Energy Information Agency (EIA), we're producing roughly the same amount of oil than in 1947. As you can see in the chart below, U.S. oil production has been dropping steadily:

The Bakken oil play stretches across Montana, North Dakota and into Southeastern Saskatchewan. We're talking about some potentially massive reserves of oil, too. The amount of oil in place has been estimated between 271 billion and 503 billion barrels of oil.
http://www.energyandcapital.com/arti...production/613

Not to mention vast off shore oil reserves we are not allowed to harvest or the oil in ANWR

BTW, just out of curiosity has anyone ever even been to ANWAR?

Clearly, we need to tackle alternative sources of fuel however there is not one single alternative fuel that we now know of, biofules, wind, solar that can even provide a fraction of the fuel that we need. With continued global in countires like China and India the demand for oil will only continue to increase.
In fact China has plans to drill more wells and built for refeneries!

Therefore, until the time that alternative fuel sources are practical and financially feasible, we NEED to drill for oil and we need the capability to refine it.

And the most pratical thing anyone can do is contact your repersentive and tell them so!

Tom N · 05-12-2008, 08:17 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by apackof2:
What we need to do immediately is drill more oil wells.......
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What makes you think oil coming out of a US well will sell for less than the world price of crude??

-Tom

Tom N · 05-12-2008, 08:27 AM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Our rail system is a joke compared to Europe or Japan. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Certainly true, but Europe and Japan's mass transportation systems were paid for by heavy taxes on oil/fuel. Were they smarter than us?? No, in the USA our politicians cater to their constituents, not for what is good for the county as a whole, but to get reelected. How would a $1 a gallon federal gas tax, to fund mass transit, go over with the public today?? Hurts now but saves lots later.

-Tom

diandtom · 05-12-2008, 10:28 AM

I just heard on Fox News the price of fuel could double in the next year.

When the Democrats got control of the house they were going to bring the price of fuel down.

So where is it?
Tom

Oemtech · 05-12-2008, 12:01 PM

Rusty has a point about distance between cities. But, had the US put some effort into the rail system after WW II we may not be in the mess we are in now. I can remember in my home town that the Hormel meat packing company use to ship meat by the train load daily. We even had ice houses in the rail yard. When I worked at Wilson's Meats I loaded box cars with pork products on the night shift.

Drilling more wells and building more refineries is not the answer... There is a finite amount of oil and the fast you use it the sooner you will need something to replace it. We need to look at wind, solar, Geo Thermo, Nuclear and anything else.

There are 2 sayings that come to mind....

Could-a, Should-a, Would-a

and

Pay Me Now or Pay Me Later

We Could-a done it and we Should-a done it and Would-a done it but we didn't! So, we are in the Pay Me Later mode!

TXiceman · 05-12-2008, 04:37 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by diandtom:
I just heard on Fox News the price of fuel could double in the next year.

When the Democrats got control of the house they were going to bring the price of fuel down.

So where is it?
Tom </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Problem is neither party controls the oil prices, the Saudi's and OPEC are in control.

But we all need to look at riving smaller vehicles more. Granted, they won't do to pull a larger TT, but for Mom to run to the grocery store, we do not need a 5000#, v-8 powered SUV. We have always driven smaller cars and are still alive to tell about them...plus we have bought a lot less gasoline over the years.

Ken

apackof2 · 05-12-2008, 05:01 PM

I don't. That's not the point.

The market (in some regards public policy here)sets the price and the price is higher because demand is high and the product availibity is low.

We can't do anything about demand but we can do something about supply.

And we need to because not only will global demands increase but our own as well

Accordingly, recent forecasts by the International Energy Agency (IEA) report that sustaining annual growth in the global economy to 2030 will require a 40 percent increase in global oil supplies. The growth in worldwide demand for natural gas is expected to be even larger, increasing 68 percent by 2030.

In addition to bolstering other energy sources, finding and producing more oil and natural gas are vital to maintaining a healthy economy and a high standard of living<A HREF="http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080512/EDITORIAL/106641496" TARGET=_blank>

Energy Need Rises</A>

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Tom N:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by apackof2:
What we need to do immediately is drill more oil wells.......
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

What makes you think oil coming out of a US well will sell for less than the world price of crude??

-Tom </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Tom N · 05-12-2008, 06:01 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by apackof2:
I don't. That's not the point.

The market (in some regards public policy here)sets the price and the price is higher because demand is high and the product availibity is low.

We can't do anything about demand but we can do something about supply.

And we need to because not only will global demands increase but our own as well
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I misinterpreted your post as meaning to drill immediately to bring oil pricing down. Sorry.

Drilling now and capping the wells for future use, when a shortage develops, may be good policy for the US. But what oil company is going to drill now and pump later. Large investment now with returns far off in the future. Drilling now to reduce gas pricing encourages more oil usage, is counterproductive to the security of the US and postpones progress toward the real solution to the oil problems and that is developing alternative ways of fueling cars.

Better to just give everyone a tax rebate (coming soon to a mailbox near you) to help ease the pain at the pump.

And when are you getting an RV?

-Tom

Jestme13 · 05-12-2008, 09:14 PM

Stay tuned, we will all get to see it first hand soon enough.

Bob (WA0MQE) · 05-13-2008, 02:49 AM

The only thing that's consistent about the oil, and thus gasoline/diesel situation is every day somewhere someone comes out with a new story, speaking of shortages, as well as oil is not in short supply. Oil will continue to increase, oil will drop back down. Likewise many here, as well as other forums, include links to stories that claim both the above making some think because there news stories and/or comments come from noble writers they might be true. Everyone knows the real truth is about $$$. It will always be about $$$.

Why do we continue to discuss these issues? What are we trying to deduce?