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Old 11-01-2019, 01:05 PM   #15
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Who pulls up to a military gate with an RV in tow and no credentials to enter the base? You should have stopped well short of the gate and walked up and asked first. I have access and I've done this when I wasnt sure if I could navigate through that particular gate. NO, NO, NO, unauthorized personnel are going to be turned back, particularly after 9/11 and particularly a foreign national. The poor guard/a on duty did not want to process paperwork I'm sure.
Often there is no indication that you will not be able to pass or divert until it is too late. Then you cannot turn an RV around and have to go to the gate.
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Old 11-08-2019, 09:07 AM   #16
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I am 100% Disabled and can go on base wherever I go as far as I know. I have a DOD Picture ID card as does my wife to enter and shop. I would however try my best not to go in with a camper as the roads at many are not made for that type of vehicle. Much better to go around and avoid the hassle.
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Old 11-08-2019, 09:30 AM   #17
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They returned our vehicle documents and driver’s licence when we had turned around and were heading back out past the security booth including a United States District Court Violation Notice for $281.00.
Do you have your copy of the violation notice? Is it an official document?

If the answer is yes, they cannot hide from the paperwork trail.

In your conversations with those involved did you discus the damages to your RV? If so, they had no recourse or way out of filing some paperwork. It became an incident when discussed.

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Old 11-09-2019, 12:10 AM   #18
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Do you have your copy of the violation notice? Is it an official document?

If the answer is yes, they cannot hide from the paperwork trail.

In your conversations with those involved did you discus the damages to your RV? If so, they had no recourse or way out of filing some paperwork. It became an incident when discussed.

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Yes, I have a copy of the violation notice but it is very ' washed' out as it was pouring rain when they filled out the notice; hard to read a lot of it; can recognize Officer Flack's name and number (11299) and of course the violation notice number (7805508)...so there should be a paper trail, no doubt. It was fairly obvious that major damage had occurred to our MH as they came and looked at the damage when we ' mentioned' we were unable to get out the main door.....it was the officer who indicated this was a ' military incident' and hence all the 2 1/2 hours to copy by hand the information contained in our vehicle licence and insurance papers. And then the violation notice when we were exiting the base for $281.00 for what Officer Flack described as 'duty damage'....where does that fit in for a small patch of white paint from our MH on the huge cement block.?....by the way most of the military personnel seemed not much older than 20 or so and they seemed to be having a bit of a laugh about the whole thing inside the guard house despite the anxiety we were experiencing..... anyway, having decided to wait for a date in court rather than just paying the fine, nothing ever came in the mail and after the 45 days the notice indicated when you should call the CVB and find out what's going on, I did so and was told there was no record of that violation notice with CVB. 5 months later in August, I called again (thinking maybe there was a delay due to the Federal shutdown last January) and still no record of that violation notice with CVB..... I will call the numbers given to me through one of the posts next week and see if I can get some answers.......just don't want any problems at the border if we head south again ( eg outstanding warrant,unpayed fines etc.)
As I mentioned in my earlier post, we respect the laws of every country we visit on our travels, including our own and simply want to know where things stand.
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Old 11-09-2019, 09:25 PM   #19
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Sounds like the citation was just CYA on their part because they knew they screwed up. Ive had some weird encounters at base entrances including entering in uniform in my command vehicle and had M16s pointed at me while one guy told me to move forward and another told me to back up. Both of them pointing their weapons at me. One of them ended up with a reduction in rank.

So I can empathize with you but I agree with others that you should resolve the issue formally so it isnt hanging over your head. I don't know about filing a claim for your damages but it seems like something worth considering.
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Old 11-10-2019, 08:41 AM   #20
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The gate guard was just following orders on admittance to the base.

Post 9/11 a large vehicle with no military stickers approaching the gate?

While the incident is regrettable as you ended up at the gate by mistake and it resulted in damage to your vehicle it was your mistake not the militaries.

Even though she told you to turn immediately, you chose to make the turn without looking to make sure it was possible to do so safely and without damage.


The only reason the damage would be the militaries fault is if she poked a gun in your face and prevented you from assessing the ability to make the turn.

You are the captain of your ship and as such responsible for the consequences of your actions mistake or not.
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Old 11-10-2019, 10:10 PM   #21
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You are the captain of your ship and as such responsible for the consequences of your actions mistake or not.
You're not in charge of anything when at a military gate, especially one you have no permission or credentials to enter.

p.s. I was a CVW8 flight deck maintenance chief on CVN-68.
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Old 11-10-2019, 10:18 PM   #22
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The MPs also tend to be the ones assigned to that duty as they are least likely to commit any independent thought, blindly following orders to the best that their limited brainpower can manage.

I had a situation once while checking in to go on base in South Carolina, where the Mensa candidate had somehow been told that nobody was allowed to bring a vehicle on base without producing the registration and insurance (which I of course had and did)... And this genius was convinced that "insurance" meant I needed to prove FULL COVERAGE not just liability only. To him, liability wasn't actually insurance. Since my insurance card didn't specify (and nobodys should) he insisted that I call my company to get a copy of the binder to prove what I had. I didn't know better at the time about the rules... And all I had was liability b/c the car was 20 years old with 300k miles!

It took close to 90 minutes before an officer showed up, learned what was happening, and told this fool to go sit in the corner. 30 seconds later I had the pass and was on my way. I've been on about 15 other bases for work and NEVER had this issue come up again. Also NEVER been asked for my vehicle registration OR insurance again either. Just show ID, get the name of the sponsor or the business I was there for, and here's your pass, have a nice day sir.

Sorry that this happened to you. I would definitely follow up with the base chain of command. That they ordered you to do things that your vehicle was not capable of doing shows only their own lack of independent thought capacity. A smarter person would have ordered the traffic behind to clear, and allowed you to back out - thus preserving their force protection orders AND clearing the obstacle to their continued daily duties.

Hope there isn't a next time, but respectfully requesting assistance from an officer may be the best move.
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Old 11-11-2019, 11:47 AM   #23
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That's basically how we felt and just followed orders......your military in the US makes a much stronger ' impression' than our Canadian Military and with all the armaments these young guards had in hand and hanging from their uniforms, it was quite intimidating especially after the ' incident'; some excitement was occurring beyond the norm and they made a good show of their weaponry. For about an hour we were kept in the dark as to what was happening, we couldn't get out our main door and I kept asking through the driver's window with basically the same response:" a military incident" and a report must be filled out. They were confused by our Canadian insurance and ownership papers so they had to record everything on the two pages by hand written copying. I suggested we could back up a bit, steer a bit to the left and clear the cement block and get into the interior compound as there was a long line of cars backed up behind us, probably base members just wanting to get home. It was pouring rain and getting late in the day. My wife did start to get somewhat angry and asked to see their supervisor ( Officer Flack who eventually showed up but basically reiterating the same limited information as to how long we would be detained etc.) We were not sure of how much damage had been done ( we had a limited view from one of our side windows) and unsure of the safety of our vehicle, where we would go etc,etc.......
Anyway, once we had turned around and were heading out and given the citation, I was very apprehensive what might happen if I refused to sign it; basically just wanted to get out of there and figure out what to do. We did carry on to the RV park in Elma where I shouted at the office that we were unable to exit the vehicle at this point and we needed a spot for the night ( rather than struggle through the emergency exit) and drop down to the ground) which might have caused some more commotion ( calling the police etc.) Fortunately, we had stayed here before and he recognized our name and vehicle and he gave us spot. I then struggled my 71 year old body out the emergency exit, dropping to the ground and went to have a first look from the outside. I spent the remaining bits of daylight crow-baring the door open and bashing away with my small sledge hammer to make it more or less functional in terms of closing and locking. ( Just a bit more of the drama of a not so pleasant beginning to our voyage to the south).....
So, again, I really appreciate all of your feedback and opinions ( although they differ somewhat) but is great to see the independent and freedom of expression we are afforded in our part of N. America, particularly when it comes to complaints involving the military. My wife and I have travelled extensively throughout the US and found nothing but friendly, helpful, proudly independent local folks.....not the big bad ' American boogieman' syndrome we grew up with as kids up here in Canada. Thanks again to all who posted and despite this unfortunate incident, we still feel the safest in the US compared to many other countries we have travelled to.
Will post later what happens when I call the phone numbers given to me in this post.......
Sure appreciate all the forums available here; many helpful and interesting topics
Baden & Riki
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Old 11-11-2019, 12:11 PM   #24
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Anyway, once we had turned around and were heading out and given the citation, I was very apprehensive what might happen if I refused to sign it; basically just wanted to get out of there and figure out what to do.
In the future, sign things like that with the word "Duress".
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Old 11-13-2019, 04:23 PM   #25
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One thing I learned from the Lazy Days driving school is to not proceed unless you are absolutely sure it is safe. It's OK to hold up traffic if you are unsure. I've followed that rule along with a few annoying honking horns but haven't hit anything.... yet.

Use the GOAL method when driving or parking. Get Out And Look.
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Old 11-14-2019, 06:56 AM   #26
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Last October 2018 on our first trip to Disney World all the signs were being replaced at Disney, a generator powered " sign " trailer parked at the side of the road was off, saw it latter at a week stay as we traveled around the World. When it was on it showed the exit for fort wilderness, at the time i was clueless, so i drove up to the main gate, had a toad.

The person at the gate said go forward after we showed our reservation, and we promptly got lost and wound up at the back gate to i think magic mountain.

There was a dead end as i approached to the left a guard shack, to the right no signs, the guard saw me i saw him made eye contact, opened my window he was maybe 50 feet away, to the right a very large garage with many large doors before the guard shack, i say to him what do i do now?

I shout again at him i knew he heard me but didn't reply, went on maybe 3 times me shouting and him just looking at me, at this point a very long line of trucks, looks to be delivery trucks, some tractor trailers, at this point i should have got out and walk up to him, however i made the wrong decision, made the left drove up to him, and he hit a switch and these barriers come up out of the ground and now i'm stuck.

I get out and say to him " why didn't you reply to me " he ignores me, so i say i got to turn around there must be a place to turn around somewhere thru that gate the tractor trailers must be able to turn around, still no reply he is just looking at me.

Thankfully no large trucks pulled up to my rear stayed at the T, the truckers were professional.

So i unhook the toad, back it into the large entrance to the garage, back the Mh into the entrance and turn around, still no direction from the waste of life guard.

Stop get out, ask my wife to follow me in the toad, and make my way back.

All the while a large group of Disney workers are watching me i'm asking one and all for direction, and get not one single reply.

We get back to the main road, and make that right at the fork before the main gate, and there was a sign, no signs at all on the back roads, i was lucky finding the main road.

Oct 2019 trip to fort wilderness we are already old hands at the back roads and such at WDW.

Learned my lesson not sure, get out and make sure that what your trying to navigate can be navigated, traffic behind you will wait .
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Old 11-14-2019, 09:08 AM   #27
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Must have been Goofyís day to man the guard shack. Glad you were able to sort it all out though.
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Old 11-14-2019, 09:32 AM   #28
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Must have been Goofyís day to man the guard shack. Glad you were able to sort it all out though.
Goofy talks ... Pluto doesnít. So maybe it was Plutoís day.
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