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Old 11-18-2012, 08:56 AM   #57
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Twinkie will be missed!
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Old 11-18-2012, 09:05 AM   #58
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I wonder why they didn't just raise the price of the Twinkies?
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Old 11-18-2012, 09:05 AM   #59
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All this from NO MORE TWINKIES?
I'll add my 2 cents as it can't be any worse than what I've read.
I spent over 30 years in 2 different unions in the skilled trades in Cleveland Ohio.
Never, not once, did I see us gain anything by going out on strike.
We actually lost if you added up lost wages for supposed gains in pay and bennies. Especially when work that was once considered union turned to non- union as a negotiating factor.
I think unions are a good thing as long as those in charge go at negotiating with an open mind and the long term best interest of their constituency in mind.
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Old 11-18-2012, 09:34 AM   #60
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Congrats union workers. Twinkies may be going to Mexico. Nice.
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Old 11-18-2012, 09:42 AM   #61
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Depending on their position, their wages are the same or higher. Those on my level that are Representatives of the union but also workers in the same position as I am are the same. Those that negotiate our contracts, I do believe are 1.5x my wages. I do not know if they have had a raise in the past. Don't get me wrong, I have had 1-3% raises over the past 20 years per year, however my pay cuts have been more than that over the same period of time.
I must agree that unions do not always do whats best, but for the most part they do treat every man & woman the same. Can't say as much for our management.
Enough said, I said my piece and you may or may not agree with me. That is ok. the last I checked we live in a free country. I pray that it stays that way.

Thanks for your take on them. Like I said, I wasn't arguing with you. Anti-union people complain about the workers wages and union people complain about company CEO salaries, but nobody talks about how much the union itself makes.

Once all the numbers are in play, then one can see whom is at fault. Sometimes no one is at fault, the world changes and some companies can no longer compete.
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Old 11-18-2012, 09:45 AM   #62
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Congrats union workers. Twinkies may be going to Mexico. Nice.
Or china, don't Care. You will still have your twinkles , the exceptionally bright union leaders will have shown the world, and the idiot workers that decided better to strike can boost each others ego while they stand in the unemployment line. After that they can figure out whose house all 18,000 are going to live in since no income they can't make their mortgage payment. Everyone gets what they deserved.
Life is comical and good
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Old 11-18-2012, 09:45 AM   #63
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Thanks for the link.

Looks like their run just the same as any other company.


I don't know anything about unions. Just the love and hate I get to read on the internet.
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Old 11-18-2012, 09:54 AM   #64
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Egg-xactly why a lot of forums limit certain hot button topics to 'premium' members only.... they can get opnionatedly (sic) hot

We all have different viewpoints depending on our experience and 'location in life' -
some are at a stage of idealism and others are at a stage of realism
(usually directly correlated to the number of days TO BE in your life versus the number of days left in your life !)

Given that some think we should take care of everyone else at the expense of our families
and others think we should be self-reliant and not help anyone...
we will never come to a consensus...

I say, let each decide for themselves and if they want to buy for others
AND have the ability to, please do, bless you for it...

but don't make others do the same if they don't want to...
Have a great Sunday !!!
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:02 AM   #65
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Around 220 workers were I work send a little over$170,000 a year to pittsburgh local 95, We just lost our pension(frozen) have to start paying into our medical ($10.00 co-pay before select blue) and raised our retirement age to 62 and 65 depending on your age at signing. The majority of the 220 people signed this in and oh I forgot to mention there was a $12,000 dollar signing bonus. after all this pittsburgh still gets the $170,000 a year (all of them are in the central pension fund!) and alls they could say through out this is "this is the best that we can do. Did those reps. want us to go on strike? NO! if we are not getting paid they are not also, Do they care what happened to us? NO! just keep your dues coming please. the company was not bargining in good faith, they had a new 5 year contract for sale and our union reps. from pittsburgh marketed till it sold. We lost what we fought for a century to get and they still get their $170,000. Who is to blame here? The majority (young people) voted it in. You ask the what they know about pensions and medicial benifets and if they think of retirement and they say " I DONT KNOW ABOUT THESE THINGS" and dont care, I just want my pay check.
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:26 AM   #66
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Although I believe in unions, this was just silly.

If Hostess made $350 million in profits you can be sure they'd be demanding pay raises because "it's important to share in the good times."

But when they lose $350 million there's no talk of sharing in the bad times.

Sadly, that is the case in many collective bargaining agreements. They have become one-sided forms of profit sharing.

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Old 11-18-2012, 10:40 AM   #67
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the exceptionally bright union leaders will have shown the world, and the idiot workers that decided better to strike can boost each others ego while they stand in the unemployment line.
Oh very mature.

Lets close this thread before the union bashers get to crazy with the name calling.
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:45 AM   #68
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Hostess CEO's Yearly Salary Tripled from $750K to $2.5 Mil, As It Blames Labor For Bankruptcy




Last edited Fri Nov 16, 2012, 07:21 PM USA/ET - Edit history (3)
Hostess Blames Union For Bankruptcy After Tripling CEO’s Pay

Today, Hostess Brands inc. — the company famed for its sickly sweet desert snacks like Twinkies and Sno Balls — announced they’d be shuttering after more than eighty years of production.

But while headlines have been quick to blame unions for the downfall of the company there’s actually more to the story: While the company was filing for bankruptcy, for the second time, earlier this year, it actually tripled its CEO’s pay, and increased other executives’ compensation by as much as 80 percent.

At the time, creditors warned that the decision signaled an attempt to “sidestep” bankruptcy rules, potentially as a means for trying to keep the executive at a failing company. The Confectionery, Tobacco Workers & Grain Millers International Union pointed this out in their written reaction to the news that the business is closing:

BCTGM members are well aware that as the company was preparing to file for bankruptcy earlier this year, the then CEO of Hostess was awarded a 300 percent raise (from approximately $750,000 to $2,550,000) and at least nine other top executives of the company received massive pay raises. One such executive received a pay increase from $500,000 to $900,000 and another received one taking his salary from $375,000 to $656,256.

snip

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2012/11/16/1203151/why-unions-dont-shoulder-the-blame-for-hostesss-downfall/


*********************


updated to add: no different at American Airlines, United Airlines, Northwest, etc......

AA is close to settling with its beleagured front line workers. Bankruptcy was just the CEOs's way to break their union agreement with the pilots, flight attendants, mechanics, etc:

"....Mr. Horton put American’s parent, AMR, into Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection in November 2011.....


".....But there potentially is another reason — one that would be a perverse incentive — that Mr. Horton may be shunning a deal with US Airways before emerging from bankruptcy: a giant payday.

Mr. Horton and his management team stand to receive somewhere between $300 million and $600 million if he can make it through bankruptcy court without merging first with a rival like US Airways.

In an odd twist of the bankruptcy process, airline management teams have typically managed to extract 5 percent to 10 percent of the company’s shares for themselves upon exiting Chapter 11, with the C.E.O. often getting 1 percent.

This happens, oddly enough, despite some of the same management wiping out shareholders (including themselves) by filing for Chapter 11 in the first place. AMR is expected to be valued at as much as $6 billion if it exits bankruptcy independently, analysts estimate.

Over the last several decades in the airline business, this is where C.E.O.’s have gotten rich.

Take a look at United’s bankruptcy back in 2005: Glenn Tilton, who was then the airline’s chief executive sought 15 percent of the company’s equity for management from creditors; after pushback from creditors, management lowered its request to 11 percent. After some back and forth, management was awarded 8 percent of the company. Mr. Tilton received a pay package worth nearly $40 million in new shares and other compensation in the company’s first year after emerging from bankruptcy.

A similar story played out when Northwest went through Chapter 11. Its former chief, Doug Steenland, received a package worth some $26.6 million in new shares when the company emerged from bankruptcy in 2007.
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Old 11-18-2012, 10:49 AM   #69
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So far, this spirited discussion has remained 'fairly' civil, which is permitted by iRV2's rules.

It needs to stay civil.

Quote:
Originally Posted by georgetown350 View Post

Lets close this thread before the union bashers get to crazy with the name calling.
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Old 11-18-2012, 11:10 AM   #70
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The public has some blame here. The public is trying to curb its bad habits of eating to much calories and has gone health diets. Twinkies doesn't qualify and thus the profits have sagged. Who wants to buy a dying company? Selling the factory items to a bread maker maybe?
Nothing that company made was healthy eating. All those carbs/sugars and starches contributed to the obesity epidemic in this country, along with all the diseases that go with a fattening high-carb/sugar diet. Let the company rest-in-peace.
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