RV Trip Planning Discussions

Go Back   iRV2 Forums > iRV2.com COMMUNITY FORUMS > Just Conversation
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 09-18-2014, 12:08 PM   #1
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Island Heights, NJ
Posts: 233
Please Write Subway

Last week in Paterson, NJ a Subway rest. mgr refused to allow a disabled Veteran bring his therapy dog into the shop. Mgr (a muslim) stated that dogs are dirty. I have gone online to Subway.com and told their customer service that I would like to know what Subway will do to make sure this does not happen again. If all of you Irv2 members contact them we can make an impression and support our warriers

15 Vegas with a red toad
tooltrdr is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 09-18-2014, 01:35 PM   #2
Senior Member
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Northwestern Montana
Posts: 3,162
What is a therapy dog? Are they the same as a service dog used by handicapped persons?

dieselclacker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2014, 01:40 PM   #3
Moderator Emeritus
smlranger's Avatar

Country Coach Owners Club
Freightliner Owners Club
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Glen Allen, VA
Posts: 7,716
Blog Entries: 1
Therapy dogs provide assistance for vets with PTSD and TBI. We just had a wonderful testimony as to the value of these precious animals to the vets here at the IRV2 National Rally from former US Marines who have PTSD. These veterans are gaining valuable support from therapy dogs provided by Paws for Vets.

Therapy dogs are used for a variety of purposes..... they are used to provide comfort and support to hospitalized patients (children and adults), residents of nursing homes, rehab centers, and people in similar circumstances. These dogs are a true blessing to those in need.

I will certainly send a message with my feelings to Subway.
'07 Country Coach Allure 470 Siskiyou Summit #31578, Cummins ISL 425; 2014 Ford F150 toad; Air Force One Toad Brake.
Glen Allen, VA
smlranger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2014, 01:47 PM   #4
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 3,030
In California there are codes re bringing dogs into resturaunts. Not that I do not sympathize with someone who has fought for our country and is disabled, but this came up before and the person in question did not have the proper documentation and was asked to leave.The owners also need to worry about all their other customers too, many who prefer not to eat with dogs.

If this is a dog for a blind person I can see your reason to be upset, but we have had numerous people people try to bring their dogs into resturaunts when there was no obvious reason, staing they were therapy or "companion' dogs. If they had documentation then the resturaunt owner would alow it, if no documentation they would be asked to leave. If they didn't do this many people would take advantage and bring their dogs in just because they think it's fun to take their dog in a resturaunt. And then where do you draw the line, ie high end dining establishment allowing dogs in. Again I am all for supporting our wounded Veterans, but many non veterans/non wounded have taken advantage of this.
Mike & Charlotte
2014 Newmar Canyon Star 3610
Orange County, California
Mike and Cha is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2014, 02:05 PM   #5
Senior Member
doc's Avatar
Appalachian Campers
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Dixie !! (north Georgia) USA
Posts: 3,061
Good points all Mike and Charlotte
doc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2014, 02:42 PM   #6
Senior Member
osok's Avatar
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Huffman, TX
Posts: 779
Asking Subway what they are going to do to make sure a disabled vet is not refused service because of service dog is a very important question. Americans With Disabilities Act, states that a disabled person can not be refused service/entry due to having a service animal.

I think the vet should have stood his/her ground and not left the store. Subway manager needs an education. The vet has a course of action that can be taken to ensure Subway gets the message.

I like to believe this was just a managers misinformed action and not policy of Subway.
2016 Dutch Star 4369
osok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2014, 04:11 PM   #7
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: In Red Bay headed to Spring, TX
Posts: 183
We have a certified therapy dog and are tested every two years. Even with that, we are not allowed entrance to most establishments and especially restaurants. If the dog is a service dog, then the dog is allowed but just saying your dog is a Therapy dog does not give you any special rights. Here is the ADA Definition of a Service Dog
Revised ADA Requirements: Service Animals
John & Becky Perrella
Katie Bug Our Pug
2009 Allegro Bus 43 QRP
JSPERRELLA is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2014, 04:21 PM   #8
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 653
There is a difference between a "service animal" and a "therapy animal." Service animals are allowed on the New York City subway system, for example, and therapy animals are not. Here is how the MTA defines the two:

“Service animal” means a guide dog, signal dog, or other animal individually trained to perform tasks for the benefit of a person with a disability that such person is unable to perform due to such disability, such as guiding persons with impaired vision, alerting persons with impaired hearing to sounds, pulling a wheelchair, retrieving dropped items or providing rescue assistance. The term service animal does not include a therapy animal or animal used for emotional support.

Did this veteran have a service dog or a therapy dog? If it was a therapy dog, then it wouldn't be allowed on the New York City literal subway, either, and that has nothing to do with Sharia law.

Also, this is from the Dept of Veterans Affairs website:

VA has started a research study to determine if there are things a dog can do for a Veteran with PTSD that would qualify the animal as a Service Dog for PTSD. The study is expected to take several years to complete.

It sounds to me like dogs that help with PTSD aren't service dogs. That's not to say they're not useful or valuable, but if they're not actual service dogs, then they don't have automatic permission to enter anywhere dogs would not otherwise be allowed.

As Mike and Cha said, people are playing pretty fast and loose with companion dogs. They think a therapy dog, or a dog that provides them emotional support, should be allowed anywhere a service dog is.

Or they're like the woman who wrote this: Confession: My ?Service Dog? Is a Total Fraud She justified her fraudulent service dog credentials by saying, "Frankly, I just really like having my dog with me. Is that so bad?"

I remember first becoming suspicious about service dogs a couple of years ago when I was at an outdoor event and a woman had a dog with her that had on a "service animal" vest, but the dog didn't act like any service animal I'd ever seen--it was jumping around, pulling on the leash, and barking. I thought, "Hmm...I bet she just bought that vest somewhere."

So like Mike and Cha I'm okay with people not accepting, on face value, a vest that says "service animal." And I'm okay (actually more than okay) with restaurants not allowing therapy dogs in, whether the person with the therapy dog is a veteran or not.

Edited to add: Thanks for posting that link, JSPERELLA. I found this part really interesting:

When it is not obvious what service an animal provides, only limited inquiries are allowed. Staff may ask two questions: (1) is the dog a service animal required because of a disability, and (2) what work or task has the dog been trained to perform. Staff cannot ask about the person’s disability, require medical documentation, require a special identification card or training documentation for the dog, or ask that the dog demonstrate its ability to perform the work or task.

I wonder how the woman with the faked credentials would answer the question, "What work or task has the dog been trained to perform?" Of course, I don't see a list of "correct" answers, so I guess it's still up to the establishment whether the dog "qualifies" as a service dog, which really isn't a great solution.
oatmeal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2014, 06:02 PM   #9
Senior Member
DDDonkey's Avatar
National RV Owners Club
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 456
Therapy dogs are not allowed every were, period. I have a service dog, she is used for PTSD as wells as mobility issues and can go every where I need her too. Even though I don't agree with the vet being kicked out,the manager has the right. I too am a disabled vet (only 32 and retired) and have been asked many times if my dog is a service dog because of the fakes out there. Most people don't even know my dog is there, I was taught to treat her as a brief case in public. I get tested every two years to maintain her certification the the organization that I got her from, even thought there is no national certification, or state for that matter. It is the people that fake service animals that ruin it for the real ones.
DDDonkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-18-2014, 06:11 PM   #10
Senior Member
99-Am.Star's Avatar
Newmar Owners Club
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,794
Many times a disabled Veteran does not have a "visible" disability. Those dogs are trained to help with the mental problems of these Veterans by sensing a problem so they can stop it before most people would notice. Could this be a hoax by a non caring Veteran? maybe, but not likely in my opinion.
1999 NEWMAR American Star (for sale) SOLD !!![* Newmar Kountry Kklub # 19708 * THOUSAND TRAILS * 2006 Chevy 3500 Dually Dmax/Ally SOLD* Curt Q20 (For Sale)* Prodigy P2 *US ARMY 1965-1967 * Disabled Vietnam Veteran 1966-1967 * Life Member VFW *
99-Am.Star is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2014, 10:06 AM   #11
Senior Member
oakcreekeric's Avatar
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Oak Creek, WI
Posts: 1,068
I hate these types of situations... why does the minority always seem to ruin it for the majority...

I think there should be an insanely high fine for anyone who tries to pass their "pet" off as a service animal...
Eric & Denise
2012 Itasca Sunstar 35F
2017 Harley-Davidson Ultra Limited
oakcreekeric is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-19-2014, 02:25 PM   #12
Senior Member
wa8yxm's Avatar
Damon Owners Club
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 24,022
I once met an RVer in Church, .. how did I know him... Recognized his therapy dog.

I have seen people complain about a dog in a restaurant.. Of course when I called the dog, and its human by name and made a comment or two the complainers tried to vanish (Do not know why they should do that Mary could not see them.. The puppy could, as could I , but Mary could not) .

Laws vary from state to state.. MOST all states do allow "Seeing Eye Dogs" into restaurants and such.. However laws regarding other kinds of service animals are a big behind.. A therapy dog is one such animal.

That said.. IF the dog is clearly a service animal.. I would not have a problem with him (All dogs by the way are HIMS.. and if you want to know what a female of the species is called.. Well a dog is a son of a ----H)
Home is where I park it!
wa8yxm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2014, 11:55 AM   #13
Senior Member
Lindsay Richards's Avatar
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Tavares, FL
Posts: 1,644
Subways are mainly franchises and individually owned and operated. There are a lot of wonderful therapy dogs and unfortunately there are people who try to game the system and give them all a bad name. Very hard to tell the difference. You can buy the "vests" on line.
Lindsay Richards is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-20-2014, 12:17 PM   #14
Senior Member
lanerd's Avatar
Tiffin Owners Club
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Home in warm Sou Calif for the winter.
Posts: 1,401
Plus, you have to ask if the vet could not be without his "therapy" dog for the few minutes it would take to get his meal and leave...or even if he ate the meal there in the restaurant.

I'm a great admirer of "service" dogs as they go through months of specialized training before they are given to the disabled person who deserves one. However, I don't think that those people who feel that they just can't do without their dog when they go into eating establishments or grocery stores are doing a great discredit to those service dogs and their owners.

FWIW, I am a vet and can sympathize with my fellow vets who did not come back the same person as they were when they left.


Ron, Sandie and Lilly
2013 Tiffin Phaeton 42LH 400 ISL | 2011 GMC Terrain SLT-2
Roadmaster All Terrain | US Gear Unified Brake System | Pressure Pro
lanerd is offline   Reply With Quote

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Any Experience with "ACC Warranty Group" for Extended Warranty? bdaball iRV2.com General Discussion 47 06-10-2016 10:34 AM
Tax write off Cola ny iRV2.com General Discussion 23 05-25-2014 09:13 AM
Anyone else know exactly what they want but are too scared to write the check? ie2special Class A Motorhome Discussions 30 04-17-2014 12:54 PM
RV TV Retrofits thomaspryan Class A Motorhome Discussions 17 08-02-2013 08:26 AM

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:54 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.