Go Back   iRV2 Forums > iRV2.com COMMUNITY FORUMS > Just Conversation
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 12-16-2012, 10:45 PM   #15
RRR
Senior Member
 
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by slickest1 View Post
... The caliber of security guards needs to be looked at at many places, hospitals, airports and maybe schools. Should have military or police tactical training.
So that they can be paid minimum wage?
__________________

__________________
RRR is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 12-16-2012, 11:51 PM   #16
Moderator Emeritus
 
SarahW's Avatar


 
Fleetwood Owners Club
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: In a lawnchair
Posts: 11,204
Removing my Moderator Hat to say:

Do people actually want to live in a police state where there are armed guards everywhere? Not me. I'd like to see some personal responsibility for raising children properly and getting care for the mentally unbalanced. Personally I don't believe the world is any crazier than its ever been; it's just that we have every detail blared over cable news 24 hrs a day and plastered on the internet. Nutjobs are nothing new.

/mod hat back on.
__________________

__________________
.2012 Fleetwood Bounder 33C | 2012 Jeep Wrangler

SarahW is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 07:22 AM   #17
Senior Member
 
Vintage RV Owners Club
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 671
Quote:
Originally Posted by SarahW View Post
Removing my Moderator Hat to say:

Do people actually want to live in a police state where there are armed guards everywhere? Not me. I'd like to see some personal responsibility for raising children properly and getting care for the mentally unbalanced. Personally I don't believe the world is any crazier than its ever been; it's just that we have every detail blared over cable news 24 hrs a day and plastered on the internet. Nutjobs are nothing new.

/mod hat back on.

Very true Sara, but what are the chances of the family setting we grew up in making a come back ? I think a lot of what's wrong today goes back to the deterioration of the family.
__________________
92' Holiday Rambler 1000
The wife, me and two furry kids
If you have it, a truck brought it.
blackf3504dr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 07:27 AM   #18
Senior Member
 
CampDaven's Avatar


 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Fulltime, USA
Posts: 14,450
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by SarahW View Post
Removing my Moderator Hat to say:

Do people actually want to live in a police state where there are armed guards everywhere? Not me. I'd like to see some personal responsibility for raising children properly and getting care for the mentally unbalanced. Personally I don't believe the world is any crazier than its ever been; it's just that we have every detail blared over cable news 24 hrs a day and plastered on the internet. Nutjobs are nothing new.

/mod hat back on.

Bravo!
Treat the mentally challenged, yes.
Make parenting happen again, yes.
But....we cannot stop the news.
And we do not look for gunfights. They come to us. If you dont have one, it is not a gunfight.
Protection is what our schools need, as these incidents will surely happen again.
Strong access doors. Armed response to intruders. Etc. Right now, there is no security or deterence.
In Isreal, the teachers are trained and armed. It works!
Just sayin....
__________________
Dave and Nola, RVM1
The Journey is Our Destination!

http://davenola.blogspot.com/
CampDaven is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 07:32 AM   #19
KAS
Senior Member
 
KAS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 246
I'd like to see school teachers and administrators get training in the use of a gun and those who are comfortable with it should be carrying concealed even at the school.

They say the principal died trying to jump the guy. If she had had a gun and some training, she might have successfully used force to stop the killing. Sure, she might have missed and still died, but at least she would have had a fighting CHANCE. Those teachers were sitting ducks and helpless to fully defend their charges.

It is a tragedy, but crazy is rather unpredictable, and persons who have committed to a path of evil are difficult to spot ahead of time. Therefore the potential victims need to carry an equalizer, and as small children cannot, the adults ought to do so.

I'd be very glad to know my children's school had trained armed adults working there in case something horrible happened.

My $.02 on this.
__________________
KAS (RVM49) Rexhall owner/Spartan. "Hey! I got a glass!"-- GES
KAS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 07:49 AM   #20
Senior Member
 
CampDaven's Avatar


 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Fulltime, USA
Posts: 14,450
Blog Entries: 1
Quote:
Originally Posted by KAS View Post
I'd like to see school teachers and administrators get training in the use of a gun and those who are comfortable with it should be carrying concealed even at the school.

They say the principal died trying to jump the guy. If she had had a gun and some training, she might have successfully used force to stop the killing. Sure, she might have missed and still died, but at least she would have had a fighting CHANCE. Those teachers were sitting ducks and helpless to fully defend their charges.

It is a tragedy, but crazy is rather unpredictable, and persons who have committed to a path of evil are difficult to spot ahead of time. Therefore the potential victims need to carry an equalizer, and as small children cannot, the adults ought to do so.

I'd be very glad to know my children's school had trained armed adults working there in case something horrible happened.

My $.02 on this.


YES!
Protection.
Deterence.
A chance.
ANY perp can get a gun. No chance if it is not a gunfight.
And that ain't just in schools
__________________
Dave and Nola, RVM1
The Journey is Our Destination!

http://davenola.blogspot.com/
CampDaven is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 08:17 AM   #21
Senior Member
 
W4MBG's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: Williamsburg, VA
Posts: 650
wait! that guy in CT could not have used guns. they are illegal in schools.

oh yeah, that doesn't work.
__________________
1999 Winnebago Minnie 29', Ford V10, Close to stock.
W4MBG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 09:21 AM   #22
RV Mutant #14
 
Wayne M's Avatar


 
Winnebago Owners Club
Texas Boomers Club
Freightliner Owners Club
iRV2 No Limits Club
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 12,190
Whoa! Whoa! Whoa!

I purposely started this thread to get away from the CT Shooting. let's just focus on security and the lack of. Post information about carrying weapons in school in the school thread. Let's get back on topic.

Example: It was mentioned that strong access doors are needed and that is very true, but when strong access doors are used, why have a window 20 feet away that can be broken and access gained. The strong access door has no purpose if other pitfalls are so obvious. The strong access door is "for show."

Now take it a step further: Strong access doors, bars on windows made to be opened only from the inside in need of escape. Even then, a perpetrator with planning could render the window security non functional by visiting at night and taking steps to render a window as not being secure. What steps are necessary to ensure continued security. I can think of something with the window, maybe two. One, the person responsible for the room the window is in will physically check to ensure it is still a secure environment, and/or a physical walk around of the building prior to any activity in the building to ensure that there has been no tampering with security devices.

Security is a never ending process. It is unfortunate that when a violation of someones security occurs, steps are only taken to tighten the security violation that caused the mishap. Someone, somewhere, entered into a public or private building and caused harm, damage, or both. The answer was to lock the the doors, but the windows remained in a weak state.

Take for example our public buildings infrastructure. Many of them have fire doors. When these doors are opened it sets off an alarm, however the door can only be opened from the outside. At the close of business does a security person walk around and push on each door to ensure it is firmly closed? I would hope so, because such a door can be by passed leading to entry from outside.

How many times have you seen a similar door without an alarm, propped open by a rock, so people could "take the shortcut" for a work break.

I guess my point is that we will always have nut cases out there, and some of them are smarter than the average person. It is not just a security guard responsibility, or an owner responsibility, it is everyone's responsibility to constantly be observant and report suspicious behavior. However, it then becomes, "I don't want to get involved."

Complacency in our society.

Relate security measures to your RV lifestyle. Wow!
__________________
Wayne MSGT USMC (Ret) & Earlene (CinCHouse)
2015 Winnebago Tour 42QD
RVM14
It is what it is, and then it is what you make of it.
Wayne M is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 09:23 AM   #23
Community Administrator
 
Route 66's Avatar


 
Newmar Owners Club
Retired Fire Service RVer's
Spartan Chassis
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Newark, DE
Posts: 25,605
Let's get back on topic.

__________________
Adios, Dirk - '84 Real Lite Truck Camper, '86 Wilderness Cimarron TT, previously 4 years as a fulltimer in a '07 DSDP

Route 66 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 06:26 PM   #24
Senior Member
 
CampDaven's Avatar


 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Fulltime, USA
Posts: 14,450
Blog Entries: 1
Security is needed. But another thought...

At least 38 of the 61 mass shooters in the past three decades “displayed signs of mental health problems prior to the killings"

The mental health system is broken.

http://m.psychologytoday.com/blog/bl...f-not-now-when
__________________
Dave and Nola, RVM1
The Journey is Our Destination!

http://davenola.blogspot.com/
CampDaven is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 08:55 PM   #25
Senior Member
 
Aguyfromcalg's Avatar
 
Forest River Owners Club
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 859
I have been reading the posts on this thread with interest. What I have noticed is this. If you chose to obey a security structure or personnel then it is 100% effective. If not then it isn't. It won't really matter how well a person is trained or paid for that matter if the uniform the person is wearing is not respected and obeyed. In my opinion it's the uniform and the authority it conveys to the person that is the deterrent. Once some one chooses not to obey and respect symbols of authority people in position of authority then that person will do as they wish. If a child sees a parent disrespecting or disregarding a security structure or a uniform won't the child do the same thing? Are not our parents our role models, for good or for bad?
How many remember the song " Cat's in the Cradle" by Harry Chapin?
__________________
2010 Coachmen Freelander 30QB E450 V10
Have Kids Will Travel
Aguyfromcalg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2012, 09:38 PM   #26
RV Mutant #14
 
Wayne M's Avatar


 
Winnebago Owners Club
Texas Boomers Club
Freightliner Owners Club
iRV2 No Limits Club
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Texas
Posts: 12,190
Now I think the "Aguyfromcalg" understands.

Security is what we perceive it to be, and what someone else perceives it as can a very different perspective.

A lock on a door tells me that If I don't have the key to stay out.

A lock on the door to someone who has the intent of breaking in, means nothing. The stronger the lock for anyone with the illegal mind to get in is just a harder to get into place. We call them "deterrents."
__________________
Wayne MSGT USMC (Ret) & Earlene (CinCHouse)
2015 Winnebago Tour 42QD
RVM14
It is what it is, and then it is what you make of it.
Wayne M is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 05:32 PM   #27
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 225
I hope this contributes in a small measure to the conversation. In FL several years ago crooks in the Miami area were forcing certain cars off the road. Interesting enough the only cars being forced off the road were rental cars leaving the airport. Once the cops figured that out a few bait cars put an end to that nonsense. After their capture, IIRC, the paper quoted the miscreants as saying they knew that a rental car just leaving the airport wouldn't have anyone inside with a gun.

When concealed weapons permits were starting to be issued widely in Florida there were a lot of questions about where they could actually be carried. State authorities were quoted in the newspapers that it would be illegal to enter a rest area with a weapon. In no time at all the crooks started robbing folks at rest areas. They even murdered some Englishman and shot his girlfriend at a N Florida rest stop. The state officials quickly realized that their "no firearms in rest areas" policy was getting people killed, robbed, assaulted, etc. so they changed it.

These days rental cars no longer have tags that are distinctive. They no longer use a certain group of letters to identify them as they once did. If you have a legitimate concealed weapons permit you can legally enter a Florida rest area.

If you look at these various shootings around the country it seems to me that they occur nearly always in a place where the perpetrator, crazy or not, can be reasonably certain that no one will be carrying a gun. It would be a sad day when everyone in the USA felt as if they had to carry a gun to be safe however, anytime I see a sign that says no firearms on the door of a post office, ranger station, etc. I never fell very comfortable inside and I can't wait to leave. If I was a maniac a sign like that would be an open invitation to me to enter and commit mayhem and murder. I think one sensible course of action would be to allow school officials to carry weapons if they wish to do so and make sure that those who do so receive adequate training. Publish that info in the newspaper and on TV periodically. Once the word got around I think bad stuff might be happening a lot less frequently. Note that I did not say anyone should be required to carry a firearm. It should be voluntary and it should never be published who does and who does not have a gun in their pocket.
__________________
Check out my photos and videos at:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/80431173@N00/collections/
grafxman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-18-2012, 06:24 PM   #28
Senior Member
 
Caveman CBB's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Storden,MN
Posts: 672
Um,, Bad things happen. It's good to try and be careful to mitigate them from happening more often. But, they will still always happen. Security is a way to mitigate bad things from happening but, it will not stop it.

Personally, I don't even lock the doors on my house. All door locks would do is keep my friends out. Anyone that wants to break it could do it easily because I'm half a mile from my nearest neighbor. The person breaking in would do more dollars worth of damage to the door then what he would get in profit once he got in this old house. lol

NOW, I mitigate the chance of someone breaking in here by being nice to everybody. I don't care you race, religion, or any of that sort of stuff. AND, I don't care if you have been in jail or prison. In my county of, 11000 people, about 2000 of us have been in jail or prison at some point in out lives. So, by being the person everybody likes, trusts, and can ask for help (When there not breaking the law of course) I don't have any problems with anybody.

I realize this attitude and life style will not work for those of you in big cities. But, it works well for me. I'm more worried about getting struck by lightning them being a victim of crime. And, I don't lose sleep over worrying about getting struck by lightning. I just don't stand in the middle of a open field during a lightning storm !!

Sorry, if I didn't explain this very well. It's hard to explain.
__________________

__________________
Caveman CBB is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:12 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.