Social Security Changes

[Lindsay Richards]

The top 5% of federal taxpayers pay 75% of the paid federal taxes and the bottom 49% pay no federal income taxes. How in the world can anybody think that the people who actually do create the jobs are not "anteing up"? How much is would make you guys happy? We did quite well for years with the present tax codes back when we were spending 18% of GDP. Now that we have surged to 25% of GDP all of a sudden the tax rates are too low. Our spending is the problem. I don't think asking any able bodied person to get off the couch and get a job is "attacking the poor". This is the way America has worked from the beginning. Only recently have we had such a large dependent population. If you haven't seen anybody wanting to retire at 53 on this thread, you haven't been keeping up. You might want to read it before making that type of comment.

[wnytaxman]

Originally Posted by Hamshog

Taxman,

What difference does it make how a company makes it's money??? If your company nets $100,000.00 this year and XYZ Construction nets $100,000.00 this year, what the h3ll differance does it make??? You shuffled paper with numbers on it and charged the customer, the contruction company built something and charged the customer. You paid out more in payroll and XYZ paid out more in material. Both made the same to pay tax on...

This is part of what's wrong with our tax system. Some want to make it more complex than it needs to be.

Flat tax would also do away with 50 to 75% of the IRS also!!!

Regards, Hamshog

The key word Hamshog is bottom line. How do you calculate what the bottom line is? Different items are treated differently and you would still have to have rules to decide what is deductible or what is not. Much of the comlexity of the tax law has to do with what counts as income and what does not. The same is true of deductions.

We live in a very complex world which may be too complex for simple solutions. In a way we have moved toward a flat tax already, but it has resulted in a large part of the population paying no income taxes. We still have the issue that most of the tax burden in this country is borne by a relatively small percentage of the population and a flat tax would change who would bear that tax burden.

[TechWriter]

Originally Posted by wnytaxman

I'm not sure where I've been incendiary, but if I have stepped on someone's toes, it was not intentional.

You haven't bothered me, but you really should answer my questions about how many overdressed poor kids you saw.

Originally Posted by wnytaxman

Also most on here are probably a little bit better off financially than a great number of Americans.

And then some. Let me expand your on-point generalization . . .

The majority of us would also be older, white males and thus tending to be conservative (to say the least). Knowing that we are an ever increasing minority does not make us sleep better at night. I would guess most of us feel that the future is not what we were told (or sold) when we were much younger, and we want to blame someone for this -- certainly not ourselves -- and our blame list includes politicians (who we elected), poor people (because it's easy), and occasionally the rich. But we don't do that very often because we admire their success and wish it were us. Like buying lottery tickets.

Originally Posted by wnytaxman

Yes, I do have my ideas of what could be done to improve SS, but I would also like to know what others think. If I didn't care what other folks think, I wouldn't have asked the question.

Mmmmm . . .

[wnytaxman]

Okay, Tech. Let's hear what your solutions are. You have been very quick to point out that with which you disagree, but I would love to hear what your solutions would be. How would you resolve the issues of Social Security and its tenuous circumstances?

[TechWriter]

Originally Posted by Lindsay Richards

I don't think asking any able bodied person to get off the couch and get a job is "attacking the poor".

You just did. You're assuming poor folks on just laying around.

[TechWriter]

Originally Posted by wnytaxman

Okay, Tech. Let's hear what your solutions are. You have been very quick to point out that with which you disagree, but I would love to hear what your solutions would be. How would you resolve the issues of Social Security and its tenuous circumstances?

Something all of us would hate . . . short of Soylent Green.

[Lindsay Richards]

You just did. You're assuming poor folks on just laying around.

Nope, go back and read it. I said able bodied. That means people who can work, but are happy to not work and accept the handouts. You are the one who equated this to the poor. I have no problem with helping people who have no way to help themselves (and I do help them), but I have no patients with able bodied folks who are lazy. I also have no patients for those who want to keep them down by giving them subsistence welfare.

[TechWriter]

Originally Posted by Lindsay Richards

Nope, go back and read it. I said able bodied. That means people who can work, but are happy to not work and accept the handouts.

How many of the poor (or whatever you want to call them) do you think are "happy not to work"?

[wnytaxman]

Originally Posted by TechWriter

Something all of us would hate . . . short of Soylent Green.

Please share with us on what your solutions would be.

[Lindsay Richards]

How many of the poor (or whatever you want to call them) do you think are "happy not to work"?

Are you talking about the able bodied welfare recipients?

[TechWriter]

Originally Posted by wnytaxman

Please share with us on what your solutions would be.

Higher taxes & less benefits.

[TechWriter]

Originally Posted by Lindsay Richards

Are you talking about the able bodied welfare recipients?

Out of the total number of people getting welfare . . . how many are able bodied and should be forced to work?

[Lindsay Richards]

Out of the total number of people getting welfare . . . how many are able bodied and should be forced to work?

All of the able bodied. Do you disagree?

[wnytaxman]

Originally Posted by wnytaxman

I think there are a number of changes that would help the system, if not make it healthy again.

1. I would raise the full retirement age to 69 and gradually raise the early retirement age to 64. In the past this was done by adding one or two month increments onto retirement benefits so that the change wasn't horrendous.

2. I would make the receipt of SS benefits to be more needs based. If you make over $150,000 and you are drawing SS benefits you would start to lose benefits and once you topped $250,000 you would receive no benefits.

3. I would raise the wage cap to $150,000. I would also start to include income that heretofore has been excluded from SS taxes such as rental income and personal service S corp. income.

4. I would make disability status more difficult to obtain. The inclusion of rental income would also remove some from the disability ledgers because they use the rental income exlusion as a way to still claim they are disabled.

5. I would get the politicians to admit that Social Security is not an annuity, but just another tax.

6. I would reform Medicare by allowing those over 65 to opt out of Medicare and continue with their Health Savings Accounts. Tort reform would go a long way to improve the cost of Medicare also.

In case you are wondering how many of these effect me, the answer is just about all of them. It wouldn't make sense to ask others to do what I am unwilling to do myself.

Okay, the asbestos suit is on. I'm ready!

Originally Posted by TechWriter

Higher taxes & less benefits.

Tech, you could have saved yourself some attack time by reading the earlier posts. For reference my post of suggestions was number 225. It may be gramatically incorrect to quote oneself, but that's the only way I can put that info into a response.