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Old 02-06-2015, 04:45 PM   #15
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I have total respect and admiration for those that served then and now. Just think the times and events will look differently upon their accomplishments.

Yeah, television and moving pictures are no longer emerging technologies. We are unlikely to be remembered for the long list of famous actors like those above. Still, there must be something left on earth to create from scratch while the naysayers rest on the laurels of their age demographic.
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Old 02-06-2015, 07:36 PM   #16
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Some 500 Major League Baseball players traded in their team uniforms for service uniforms during World War II.
Baseball in Wartime - Those Who Served
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Old 02-06-2015, 09:25 PM   #17
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Some of the sentiment intoned by the article and some responses are totally unfair to our current armed forces members. I totally agree that our "greatest generation" was extraordinary in many ways but they also believed in a fight that was much more defined. Hitler and Tojo were clearly as bad as they come. It was very easy to see that our nation was under a clear and present danger. It was something that nearly every American could see and understand.

While we might all agree that there are some really bad people (Osama, Al Qaeda, ISIL...) the nature of battle has changed. While, for the most part, WWII veterans served in a symmetrical war with front lines, uniforms and traditional battle styles; starting with Vietnam our warriors faced a totally new landscape. The methods of battle were significantly different with the new form of asymmetrical warfare. Politics became important in how wars were prosecuted. Declarations of war no longer became the way we entered into conflicts.

These service members were tasked with fighting wars with fuzzy rules of engagements, combatants hiding in civilian populations, avoiding IEDs, working with coalition "partners" and going against the very people (Saddam Hussein/Iraq, Mujahideen/Taliban as examples) that we trained in the first place.

It is important to remember that we have been at the War Against Terror for 13 or more years. The US's direct involvement in WWII lasted just just short of 4 years. Many of our current service members have spent more time on combat duty than any of our WWII vets. This is not only because of the duration of our war but also caused by the downsizing of our military forcing more and more re-deployments.

We will never see a war like WWII that totally motivated a nation to take the actions they took to survive and required an "all hands on deck" mobilization of our men and women. Our enemies are ever changing and the manner they wage war are much less direct. We aren't battling armies, we are battling a widespread ideology that hides in plain sight and cares little about the non-combatants they hide within. As long as we play whack-a-mole, we will be fighting non-stop.

At the same time we are locked into a vicious cycle of trying to win a war while pinching pennies. It is a fact that as a nation we don't have the stomach to raise the funds to fight a more robust war. In effect, we as a nation, are not totally committed to this war as we were to WWII. We also don't seem to have a stomach to send our forces into another ground war.

I'm not trying to debate the politics but just point out where I think we are and why we ought not dismiss the work of our present day warriors. It just isn't right or fair.

BTW...The newest phase of our war on terror will not end in days, months or years...decades will be the measuring stick. Our men and women continue to serve us well even knowing what could be ahead.
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Old 02-07-2015, 11:22 AM   #18
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My intention for posting this was not to diminish the work and dedication of our present day troops who serve. We all should have a sincere heartfelt appreciation for what they do and the sacrifices that they have, and are making.
I think that the real point is that so many of our young people admire people simply for their notoriety, not their accomplishments. I remember a commentary by George Will when he commented on ‘The top ten most admired women’ in the United States (circa late 90s). Monica Lewinsky was on that list . I looked for that commentary, but couldn’t find it. It was right on the money.
The point is that the current ‘younger generation’ mistakes notoriety and celebrity, for honest and courageous heroism.
For example, the Kardashians are famous only for ‘being famous’. Yet most young people idolize them.

Our returning veterans deserve more!!!!!
And the ones who didn't return, deserve even more
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Old 02-07-2015, 12:41 PM   #19
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My intention for posting this was not to diminish the work and dedication of our present day troops who serve. ...
I don't think that was your intent either. However, the whole premise that they don't make them today like they did before seems to draw out the nostalgia of the "good ole' days". I've heard too many comments on too many forums that seem to try to say those that WWII were more heroic than current day service members.

As to the status "celebrity" of some rather "interesting" folks, that is entertainment media driven. 50 years ago the vast majority of papers wouldn't spend the the money for ink to print some of this drivel. With today's TV and internet some of these "celebrities" get a disproportionate amount of press. Scandal sells and is cheap to produce. BTW, don't confuse "famous" with "respected". Folks like to watch a continuing train wreck.

I am not sure of your point about Tillman and "friendly fire". Friendly fire has been around as long as there has been war. It is horrible but not unique. I was researching the death of my FIL's brother on June 7th, 1941 who was a member of the 501st PIR dropped behind German lines in the early morning before dawn on D-Day. All indications were that he survived his jump and was killed the next day as a result of friendly fire from the guns of the USS Quincy. Research by Stephen Ambrose (Author of Band of Brothers) shows that a group he was working with called in a fire mission on a German gun emplacement. The first 4 rounds were drop dead on target. No one knows why the Quincy fired 4 more rounds that dropped short killing him and 4 comrades along with wounding several others.

BTW...a bit of trivia. Ambrose's "Band of Brothers" was based on Easy Company of the 506th PIR, 101st Airborne. His first attempt to chronicle a unit of WWII was actual on the 501st PIR which was the sister unit to the 506th and my FIL's brother "AJ" trained on the same schedule as the unit in his published works. For reasons unknown he scrapped that manuscript of the 501st but it was finding bits and pieces of it that solved the mystery behind AJ's death. I can go on and on about the 501st story, especially at Bastogne, but that could be a whole new thread.
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Old 02-07-2015, 12:58 PM   #20
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They don't make 'em like they used to

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerryl View Post
I think that the real point is that so many of our young people admire people simply for their notoriety, not their accomplishments. I remember a commentary by George Will when he commented on ‘The top ten most admired women’ in the United States (circa late 90s). Monica Lewinsky was on that list . I looked for that commentary, but couldn’t find it. It was right on the money.
The point is that the current ‘younger generation’ mistakes notoriety and celebrity, for honest and courageous heroism.
For example, the Kardashians are famous only for ‘being famous’. Yet most young people idolize them.

Well, Gerryl, I think that insulting stereotypes like these (which seem to be pervasive throughout your posting history) are part of the reason for the responses in this thread. It's a fine thing to admire people who are worthy examples of human accomplishment, and to be inspired by them to do better things with your own life. It's quite another thing to assert that nobody will ever do better, and that those upon whom we rely to carry our legacy into the future are idiots who are incapable of distinguishing between notoriety and real accomplishment. You offer a list of people who are famous for their prowess at faking emotions in front of a camera. There is a long list of inventors, captains of industry, Astronauts, Nobel laureates, Senators, Congressmen, Judges, Governors, Cabinet Secretaries, Foreign Ambassadors, and Presidents of the United States who served honorably in WW2, but they are not on your list. They made groundbreaking and paradigm-changing contributions that have profoundly changed the world, but their names are not listed. In their place, is a list of television and motion picture celebrities, the textbook example of people who are "famous for being famous." Confused? Yes, I think that you are.
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Old 02-07-2015, 01:19 PM   #21
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They don't make 'em like they used to

Just to lighten the mood, does anyone find it interesting that on the good ship Minnow, the Skipper had been in the Coast Guard and Gilligan had been in the Navy?

That's the show Gilligan's Island if you need a hint.
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