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Old 09-13-2016, 03:11 PM   #15
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I put a 180 stat in last summer. How are you that accurate with mileage and gas consumption on the genny? So is it less costly to have the dash air that the rooftop?
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1989 Champion LaSalle 34' 454 ci always doing something to it
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Old 09-13-2016, 03:15 PM   #16
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Not sure what the dash btu is, roof is 13,500. I buttoned everything up last night with out pulling it all. I really don't know if its junk or not. If it needs a compressor I wont fix it. Maybe buy a few cans of R-12 and see what happens
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Old 09-13-2016, 03:26 PM   #17
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I don't believe there's a way to improve gas mileage by 2-3mpg by removing something that wasn't being used anyway.
I'd sign up for that though. .....during the fall anyway!
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Old 09-13-2016, 11:19 PM   #18
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I don't believe there's a way to improve gas mileage by 2-3mpg by removing something that wasn't being used anyway.
I'd sign up for that though. .....during the fall anyway!

Losing weight will gain gas mileage. Losing the pump belt, being driven by a pulley(s) gains some gas mileage. Losing a heavy pump/all brackets/condenser/radiator gains some mileage Everything that engine has to lug around costs in gas mileage. Though maybe overstating the mileage, you will gain some, but I know even for a big block, they aren't known for mileage where you need torque and power, and certainly one possibly pulling 9500+/- pounds, as gearing also plays into gas mileage.
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Old 09-14-2016, 12:03 AM   #19
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I keep track of mileage on every trip so it is pretty accurate.
I changed my dash a/c over to 134a shortly after I bought the rig in 2009. R12 is too expensive and getting scarce, plus you need a certification to buy it, which I have.
When I did the change over I changed the oil in the compressor, all of the lines, expansion valve and drier. I rewired the electric fans to work with the a/c on or I can turn them on manually which works great at gas stops as it keep the carb cooler and no gas smell or vapor lock on restart. I live in Phoenix so that is a plus. I also installed a hi/low pressure switch on the drier to protect the system.
As a test of your system you could put air pressure in the system to check for major leaks. Don't leave it in long and be sure to suck the system down to remove the air. If it holds air and no leaks found drop 2 or 3 cans of 134a in the system and see if it cools. If it works then you can do a proper change over as the old lines let the 134a permeate thru the hose walls and the oil may get sludged up. This is cheaper than buying R12 and then finding out the system won't work. The condensor is probably large enough so the advice to change it for most motorhomes isn't needed from what I have seen. I replaced mine last year as it developed a leak.
Many vehicles here in Arizona were changed from R12 to 134a with nothing else done and they will work for awhile, sometimes a long time.
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Old 09-14-2016, 09:59 PM   #20
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I keep track of mileage on every trip so it is pretty accurate.
I changed my dash a/c over to 134a shortly after I bought the rig in 2009. R12 is too expensive and getting scarce, plus you need a certification to buy it, which I have.
When I did the change over I changed the oil in the compressor, all of the lines, expansion valve and drier. I rewired the electric fans to work with the a/c on or I can turn them on manually which works great at gas stops as it keep the carb cooler and no gas smell or vapor lock on restart. I live in Phoenix so that is a plus. I also installed a hi/low pressure switch on the drier to protect the system.
As a test of your system you could put air pressure in the system to check for major leaks. Don't leave it in long and be sure to suck the system down to remove the air. If it holds air and no leaks found drop 2 or 3 cans of 134a in the system and see if it cools. If it works then you can do a proper change over as the old lines let the 134a permeate thru the hose walls and the oil may get sludged up. This is cheaper than buying R12 and then finding out the system won't work. The condensor is probably large enough so the advice to change it for most motorhomes isn't needed from what I have seen. I replaced mine last year as it developed a leak.
Many vehicles here in Arizona were changed from R12 to 134a with nothing else done and they will work for awhile, sometimes a long time.
I was looking on Ebay, they have 3 cans of R-12 for 60, changing hoses must get costly as they are long
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Old 09-15-2016, 08:50 AM   #21
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We use hot shot which was recommended by the folks who do commercial systems and it is a mix of many magic things but it works fine as a direct replacement for R12 and is about same cost as r134.

Not sure on how hard to buy as we got ours from the folks doing our equipment.

We used the conversion in a can kit for our jeep which was the different oil and the gas and it worked well, later changed the dryer and needed to charge every year but after adding a can of leak stop that we found at estate sale it seems to be holding longer...yes we are cheap....

Vehicle ac units are not that costly to repair given places like self service wrecking yards and online wholesale places the parts cost have dropped greatly so if labor is free then it can be fixed....Leave it in place as it does have value there as the large amount of work to remove it may result in a tiny mpg gain it will take many miles to re coupe that but having it gone will make it much harder to sell.
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Old 09-15-2016, 12:30 PM   #22
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We use hot shot which was recommended by the folks who do commercial systems and it is a mix of many magic things but it works fine as a direct replacement for R12 and is about same cost as r134.

Not sure on how hard to buy as we got ours from the folks doing our equipment.

We used the conversion in a can kit for our jeep which was the different oil and the gas and it worked well, later changed the dryer and needed to charge every year but after adding a can of leak stop that we found at estate sale it seems to be holding longer...yes we are cheap....

Vehicle ac units are not that costly to repair given places like self service wrecking yards and online wholesale places the parts cost have dropped greatly so if labor is free then it can be fixed....Leave it in place as it does have value there as the large amount of work to remove it may result in a tiny mpg gain it will take many miles to re coupe that but having it gone will make it much harder to sell.
I use EnviroSafe in my cars with no problems, both in R134a and R12 systems. It's a HFC like Hot Shot-2. The nice thing is the replacements don't require you to replace your R12 hoses, so you can just repair what needs repairing and not need to buy expensive hoses. You also don't need to replace the oil.

If you do decide to go the replace hoses + R134a, most hydraulic hose shops can crimp new AC hose on your existing ends for much less than you would pay for a new hose. That's what I do unless the ends are bad.
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Old 09-15-2016, 02:11 PM   #23
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Another vote for EviroSafe. Can be bought on Amazon for around $10 per can, they also sell cans of sealant and a/c oil. You'll just have to figure out where the leak is and repair it! The r-12a can be safely mixed with any remaining R-12 in the system. Better than trying to switch the entire a/c system over to 134-a! I repaired the a/c in my 1992 Tioga using EnviroSafe r-12a, and it gets cold enough that I'll turn the thermostat UP after about 20 minutes of driving because it's too cold!! It works way better than the 134-a system in my 2000 Suncruiser. A very nice problem to have in this Phoenix heat lol. However, if you decide to pull the a/c compressor & condenser, I wouldn't expect you to see any lower engine temps unless your cooling system is marginal/has hidden problems
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Old 09-17-2016, 05:46 PM   #24
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I'm going to try the envirosafe and see what happens. As to the cooling on this rig, we drove 130 miles to Thomson Causeway Thursday with around 80 degree temps. I noticed on the highway doing between 55 and 60 mph, the gage was around 1/3 but when we were on hilly up and down roads making the engine work a little harder, the gage is "heading" towards the half way mark, this is after a good flush and new antifreeze. The cooling system was really filthy, especially the reservoir, had to take that inside to the slop sink and scrub out the sludge.
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Old 09-17-2016, 07:11 PM   #25
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Deano, I still have an operational GM gauge on my unit, I also have a Auto Meter gauge inline also. Before I rebuilt the radiator my GM gauge would ride the 1/3 - 1/2 area with a 180 stat in it. At the same time the Auto Meter would indicate 195 at 1/3 to 220-230 at 1/2.
After the recore, the Auto Meter rides right on the 180 mark and the GM gauge rides at the 1/4 mark.
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Old 09-18-2016, 04:36 AM   #26
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I'm going to try the envirosafe and see what happens. As to the cooling on this rig, we drove 130 miles to Thomson Causeway Thursday with around 80 degree temps. I noticed on the highway doing between 55 and 60 mph, the gage was around 1/3 but when we were on hilly up and down roads making the engine work a little harder, the gage is "heading" towards the half way mark, this is after a good flush and new antifreeze. The cooling system was really filthy, especially the reservoir, had to take that inside to the slop sink and scrub out the sludge.
If the cooling system was really filthy, it may need more than one flush. When I took my engine apart, I noticed that there was sludge at the bottom of the block that hadn't come out with flushes and blocked the main block drains. Not much heat is generated down low in the block, but if water isn't circulating it can't cool. There are also a number of products on the market that you can put in your cooling system to help dissolve the sludge while you drive. You put them in, drive for a while, then flush. Also, check the fan clutch to make sure it's engaging as it should.
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Old 09-18-2016, 08:23 AM   #27
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If the cooling system was really filthy, it may need more than one flush. When I took my engine apart, I noticed that there was sludge at the bottom of the block that hadn't come out with flushes and blocked the main block drains. Not much heat is generated down low in the block, but if water isn't circulating it can't cool. There are also a number of products on the market that you can put in your cooling system to help dissolve the sludge while you drive. You put them in, drive for a while, then flush. Also, check the fan clutch to make sure it's engaging as it should.
As far as the fan clutch, I'm not sure what I should be looking or listening for. When I start the coach up I definitely here the fan roaring then seems to quiet down. With the doghouse of and engine running it looks to be turning like it should, bowing lots of air?
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Old 09-18-2016, 08:25 AM   #28
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Deano, I still have an operational GM gauge on my unit, I also have a Auto Meter gauge inline also. Before I rebuilt the radiator my GM gauge would ride the 1/3 - 1/2 area with a 180 stat in it. At the same time the Auto Meter would indicate 195 at 1/3 to 220-230 at 1/2.
After the recore, the Auto Meter rides right on the 180 mark and the GM gauge rides at the 1/4 mark.
wow, 220-230 seems like that would damage things
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