Go Back   iRV2 Forums > iRV2.com COMMUNITY FORUMS > Vintage RV's
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 04-18-2012, 08:03 PM   #99
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: wpbfl
Posts: 72
more..

leadman, 'preciate your help. you don't need to read all the posts, just the couple before yours. i gave a rehash to simplefy things.

next up, i just pulled off the fuel pump filter and can blow thru it easily. guess that means two things... 1, that filter is not the cause of my problem, and 2, looks like i'm, what's the term? starts with 6th loa?

i realize what the sock is, but how do i tell if i have one? i draw fuel near the bottom of the tank, in front of it. my point of draw is a 7/16" 90 deg threaded nipple into the tank. i keep thinking the sox are used when the fuel pump is internal and is accessed at the top of the tank. is is this correct or not?

so, after i remove all the gas, how do i do the flushie thing?
am
__________________

__________________
allegroman is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 04-18-2012, 10:19 PM   #100
Senior Member
 
fleamarketer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Rochester
Posts: 789
Here is a example of a in tank pick-up and the element on the end of it is the "sock".

__________________

__________________
fleamarketer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 12:32 AM   #101
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 500
When I was working for International Trucks we would do the vaccum test on the engine end of the fuel line with a hand held vaccum pump with the little canister that was used to bleed brakes. This canister would capture the fuel and prevent it from gonig into the pump. If no fuel could be drawn into the canister at the end of the line we would work back towards the tank at the next connection, etc. This eleminated the guess work and did not fail to locate where the problem was. The problem could be a hose, filter, regulator, connections to the regulator or tank, etc. Just a systematic elemination of the components that is relatively simple to perform.

Where is the regulator located that you replaced? I just replaced the one on my MH and it is in the line shortly after the fuel tank. My tank has an in the tank fuel pump as well as a mechanical pump on the engine.

You should also be aware that the inner lining of the old composition fuel hoses has come loose inside and would cause the flow of fuel to diminish or stop. The new fuels are causing many problems with the older vehicles as many here are aware of.
__________________
leadman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 02:11 AM   #102
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: wpbfl
Posts: 72
more

fleamarketer, since the sock is at the top of the pic, it looks like the assy is actually upside down because the suck would have to be from the bottom of the tank. that means the round plate in the pic must be the cover plate at the top of the tank. the gas would be pulled from the top in your case, but in mine, the gas comes from two ports thru the lower front of the tank. i have no idea if my setup is original, something to replace an in-tank pump assy that went kaflooey. also, if there's a screen or something in mine, it's not accessible from the outside lower front of the tank where the gas comes out.

leadman, the reg on mine is bolted to the intake manifold on the engine, driver side, just above the rear end of the valve cover. gas path is tank->pump filter->line to front->'y' joint->one side back to fuel tank, one side up to reg. it's rubber from the 'y' to metal entering the reg, then metal out of the reg into the carb.

at this point i think i need to find out what to do after i drain the gas tank. i really don't want to have to drop the tank to do this. as for the sock, it's beginning to look like i don't have one, but there may still be some sort of screen covering the exit hole at the threaded nipple where the gas comes out, but i really doubt it.

symptom wise, i can visualize a bunch of heavy-ish crap sliding around in the bottom of the tank that gets sucked forward until it covers the exit hole and blocks it, shutting off the fuel. it would have to be maybe a jelly-fish like mass acting like a flapper, rather than a bunch of particles which would be seen in the filters. whatever it is, it's too big to come out the gas hole to the pump during a drive, yet big enough to be consistent in how it creates the problem every time i drive.

(scratches head, again!)
patiently awaiting more ideas here, but thanks so far.
am
__________________
allegroman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 05:10 AM   #103
Senior Member
 
fleamarketer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Rochester
Posts: 789
Absolutely the pick up is upside down on the bench.I was just trying to show the sock and in this case what it looks like.
In most cases in my shop if I had fuel present in the clear filter and after a short run had none,two things are a high percentage to check.Filler cap vent plugged creating vacuum and a hot in tank fuel pump unable to pump fuel but still runs/plugged fuel filter.The first one is easy to detect.Remove the cap and see if the clear filter fills up as it should.
__________________
The one thing about a do over is you get to do what you knew in the first place.
fleamarketer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 05:29 AM   #104
Senior Member
 
fleamarketer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Rochester
Posts: 789
You want to exclude the obvious first.You would naturally clean out the tank and replace any in tank filter while replacing the in tank fuel pump.Having to drop the tank is all apart of the job in any case.To siphon the gas to lighten the tank is included.LOL these things never happen when you have a tank almost empty.And they are way too heavy to handle otherwise.The crush factor of you does come into play,so be very sure it is almost empty.

The bottom line is you can run dozens of tests,but it all comes down to a point where you really need to take it apart to see what is wrong.I think there is a good chance the fuel pump gets hot and stops pumping fuel but still runs.
__________________
The one thing about a do over is you get to do what you knew in the first place.
fleamarketer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 06:02 AM   #105
Senior Member
 
tekrsq's Avatar
 
Mid Atlantic Campers
Forest River Owners Club
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Richmond, Va
Posts: 240
It sounds to me that if the problem consistently occurs 10-15 minutes into the run then goes away after "rest" for 10-15 minutes, then you have a mechanical/electrical component failure issue (like the fuel pump). I don't think something floating around in the tank, would be that consistent/ predictable in creating a blockage.

If I remember right, the fuel pump is about a year old? That doesn't mean it hasn't gone bad. I've had them defective right out of the box.

Can you see the top of your tank if you squeeze up between the frame rails ? Is there some type of 4"-6" plate bolted to the top, likely in the center of the tank ? If so, that is where you can get in the tank to inspect and clean it once you drop it. It's not hard to drop once the fuel is pumped out. I've dropped mine twice.

If this was mine, I think I would replace the fuel pump and filter since it is external, and fairly easy, and as a last resort pull the tank.
__________________
'87 Coachmen Leprachuan 27' on Ford E 350 w/ 460 cid, Hedman Headers, dual flowmaster exhaust
tekrsq is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 08:56 AM   #106
Senior Member
 
Dunner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Phx, Arid~zona
Posts: 11,106
AM, where is your gas level float? It should be a round hole with either screws or a retaining ring. On my Mustang, it was at the bottom where the pickup tubes are. I had to remove it and drill the dried varnish out of the pickup tube. The gasket from the float hole had also deteriorated and fallen into the tank, blocking the pickup at times.
__________________
2004 32' National Sea Breeze 1311 Class A on a F-53 Chassis, CHF, TST TPMS, 5Star Tune.
If Dunner (RVM23) can't fix it, it ain't broke!
Cheap Handling Fix Poll. Click Here to vote?
Dunner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 11:40 AM   #107
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunner View Post
AM, where is your gas level float? It should be a round hole with either screws or a retaining ring. On my Mustang, it was at the bottom where the pickup tubes are. I had to remove it and drill the dried varnish out of the pickup tube. The gasket from the float hole had also deteriorated and fallen into the tank, blocking the pickup at times.
It probably would not hurt to pour two or three cans of seafoam into the tank (one can per 10 gal) and let it slosh around to loosen any varnish in the tank and fuel lines, it will also take care of any water in there too
__________________
Bilito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 12:09 PM   #108
Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: wpbfl
Posts: 72
WOW! that's a lot to digest. thanks for the input.

however, i won't pull the tank until i'm certain that's the problem. with old stuff, i often find that disturbing one thing can have repercussions in three others, and i don't need to create more headaches for meseff. not yet, anyhow.

back to the question... 1) if i see my gas line attaches to the tank at the lower front of the tank, as seen by crawling under the camper, doesn't that preclude an inside the tank pump? if it does, then any discussions about sox and plugged pump lines are misdirected. 2) with my setup, is it likely there is a screen setup in the tank that covers the gas outlet screw-in nipple? (personally i doubt it) 3) tekrsq has a point there... maybe my pump went south, even tho i have verified it does keep running when the failure occurs. maybe the motor is running but the pumping part is not right.

for now, i need to first let a bunch of fuel run out the line that goes from the tank to the pump, into a can and look for any sort of debris. i bet it'll be clear, and i also bet i'm going to discover the pump is actually the culprit. however, pls don't laff too hard if my predictions don't work out. they seldom do, but it's fun to make them anyhow.

back to the dwg board!
am
__________________
allegroman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 01:33 PM   #109
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by allegroman View Post
WOW! that's a lot to digest. thanks for the input.

however, i won't pull the tank until i'm certain that's the problem. with old stuff, i often find that disturbing one thing can have repercussions in three others, and i don't need to create more headaches for meseff. not yet, anyhow.

back to the question... 1) if i see my gas line attaches to the tank at the lower front of the tank, as seen by crawling under the camper, doesn't that preclude an inside the tank pump? if it does, then any discussions about sox and plugged pump lines are misdirected. 2) with my setup, is it likely there is a screen setup in the tank that covers the gas outlet screw-in nipple? (personally i doubt it) 3) tekrsq has a point there... maybe my pump went south, even tho i have verified it does keep running when the failure occurs. maybe the motor is running but the pumping part is not right.

for now, i need to first let a bunch of fuel run out the line that goes from the tank to the pump, into a can and look for any sort of debris. i bet it'll be clear, and i also bet i'm going to discover the pump is actually the culprit. however, pls don't laff too hard if my predictions don't work out. they seldom do, but it's fun to make them anyhow.

back to the dwg board!
am
West Marine sells a fuel funnel that has a special filter built it that lets gas pass right thru but stops WATER and other debris from passing. Worth around the 10 bucks or so to filter out the crap before you pour the gas you drain out back in the tank
__________________
Bilito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 02:57 PM   #110
Registered User
 
Vintage RV Owners Club
Gulf Streamers Club
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Indiana
Posts: 4,954
Holy jeez!..

Can you please post a pic of what your tank and line routing looks like? If, like you say, and you have 2 lines coming from the bottom of the tank, there are at least 3 obvious problems that I can see:


The first thing would be crud in the tank blocking either the lines when the pump is sucking, or an internal screen. Either way, it needs to be cleaned.

Is one of them the return? If so, does it return high or low in the tank? That could cause over heating of the pump. This leads to vapor lock..

Third is, if you have no internal pump, what is feeding the frame/engine pump? That is a loooong ways to suck and then pump fuel, especially through the typical tiny fuel lines. The only way I could see you avoiding vapor lock in this case is if you had a full tank of gas to provide enough head pressure for the pump.

The main thing here to see is that you are losing fuel pressure and/or volume after a set amount of run time.. That will almost always be the carb, pump, or tank. You have dismissed the carb, so have 2 left...
__________________
Midniteoyl is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 02:58 PM   #111
Senior Member
 
Dunner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Phx, Arid~zona
Posts: 11,106
My brother had a `37 Chevy that kept getting a fuel lock. Turned out to be the outside cellophane cover of a cigarette pack in the tank. Took forever to figure that one out. He could go for weeks without gas starvation.

On my Ranger Bass boat, I had part of the float level cover gasket fall apart and periodically, it would plug my left tank pickup tube. I carefully used a vacuum cleaner thru the float module hole to suck up the gasket parts. Never did get it all. I'm lucky the vacuum didn't blow up with all the gas fumes.
__________________
2004 32' National Sea Breeze 1311 Class A on a F-53 Chassis, CHF, TST TPMS, 5Star Tune.
If Dunner (RVM23) can't fix it, it ain't broke!
Cheap Handling Fix Poll. Click Here to vote?
Dunner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2012, 05:48 PM   #112
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 683
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunner View Post
My brother had a `37 Chevy that kept getting a fuel lock. Turned out to be the outside cellophane cover of a cigarette pack in the tank. Took forever to figure that one out. He could go for weeks without gas starvation.

On my Ranger Bass boat, I had part of the float level cover gasket fall apart and periodically, it would plug my left tank pickup tube. I carefully used a vacuum cleaner thru the float module hole to suck up the gasket parts. Never did get it all. I'm lucky the vacuum didn't blow up with all the gas fumes.
The cigarette cellohane reminds me of a story back when I was in the USAF in the late 50's. I had a 53 merc flathead V-8 and since we were so poor at thr end of the month we sometimes tied a string to our Zippo's and dropped them into the gas tank for a refill. One day the string broke and there went my Zippo into the tank. A year goes by and one day my engine just quits while pulling into the squadron parking lot. I coasted into a spot and after several hours of trouble shooting we pulled the fuel line off the carb and there was cotton wad stuck in the fitting, we pulled it out got a good fuel flow and off I went, sever months later it happened again, same thing, and then again a few weeks later, I knew the zippo was coming apart and the cotton in the fuel chamber was coming out. We were in Limestone Maine in the winter, snow up to here and 20 below, this went on and on till spring, we finally dropped the tank and shook the zippo out, along with some loose cotton. Everything was fine after that and the Zippo still worked. Traded that car in the fall for a 55 ford convertable for my car and a few hundred bucks, it needed a new rear plastic window. A case of beer later the parachute shop guys made me a new window and installed it too. Wish I had either of those cars now.
__________________

__________________
Bilito is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How to secure things in cabinets while under way? ChiefGeek Travel Trailer Discussion 20 04-09-2012 01:15 PM
how to adjust the power shades? lp5151 Jayco Owner's Forum 7 04-05-2012 12:05 AM
Does fuel mileage suffer with mud flap? MSHappyCampers Toads and Motorhome Related Towing 14 04-04-2012 09:36 AM
Does a Grey Water Tank have a safety overflow? first5thwheel 5th Wheel Discussion 18 04-02-2012 06:50 PM
How do i secure things to the (thin) walls? ChiefGeek Travel Trailer Discussion 17 04-01-2012 10:05 PM

» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 12:37 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.