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Old 09-12-2019, 07:57 AM   #1
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Weird Modified Starter for P30 Chassis

Not exactly sure how this happened, but the teeth on the Bendix gear have been worn down to nothing so it won't engage with the flywheel. Also, at least one tooth from the flywheel has broken off. The only indications I had that something was up was that warm starts were harder, and there would be an occasional 'SLAM' noise whilst cranking. I'm now wondering whether it was the teeth colliding.

As if that wasn't bad enough, the starter (a Denso model) is not standard for some reason. Instead of using the original gear an additional, smaller pinion has been welded onto it to make it sit further forward. Surely shimming would be better? Or is the clearance too far for that?

I don't know what to do - where the hell am I going to get a replacement starter?
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Old 09-12-2019, 08:05 AM   #2
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Maybe here?


https://www.gmpartsgiant.com/oem-che...0-starter.html
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Old 09-12-2019, 08:49 AM   #3
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starter

This link should help you.
https://www.chevyhardcore.com/news/c...all-situation/
if it was me i would replace it with a stock starter. If only one tooth is broken and the teeth next to it are good the flywheel will work.
A gear mis-match between a 168 tooth flywheel and the 153 tooth often looks like yours.
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Old 09-12-2019, 12:12 PM   #4
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That's a pretty amazing kludge there. Somebody wanted a high torque PMGR style starter but was bound and determined not to pay the money a custom fit one would cost. I guess. Such modified starters usually have nice custom machined aluminum mounts, not bent and welded oddball steel bits. And the pinion teeth are something I quite frankly have NEVER seen before. I'm more than a little surprised this setup worked at all.

I second buying a bone stock starter and trying it. The flexplate teeth look a little rough but changing the plate out is a big enough job I feel it very much worth seeing how it does. I also doubt that single tooth would be an issue by itself. But at some point the flexplate really ought to be replaced. Pretty much just a matter of personal choice to do it now or some time more convenient I believe.
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Old 09-12-2019, 07:38 PM   #5
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Just put a stock starter in
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Old 09-13-2019, 05:54 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GypsyR View Post
Such modified starters usually have nice custom machined aluminum mounts, not bent and welded oddball steel bits. And the pinion teeth are something I quite frankly have NEVER seen before. I'm more than a little surprised this setup worked at all.
Oddball is the word, for sure. To be honest this is the first starter I've ever looked at but I knew something wasn't right. No wonder I couldn't find a match - it's probably one of a kind. So, stock starter it is. All I have to do now is find a stockist in the UK...
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Old 09-13-2019, 03:01 PM   #7
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Chevrolet used the same style starter on all v-8 s for about 50 years...not hard to find. Just make sure you get a high torque (extended screw with 1 strap coming off) or super high torque ( extended screw with 2 straps)
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Old 09-14-2019, 06:48 AM   #8
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If you are going to try a stock starter I would clean up the flex plate teeth with a small file or maybe a wire brush in a drill.
Also don't forget to install the rear strap that goes from the starter motor stud to the block. This keeps the starter motor from torqueing sideways when engaged.
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Old 09-14-2019, 08:50 AM   #9
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Not all Chevrolet / GMC starters are the same. There are different bolt patterns on different years and engine sizes. Some starters have bolt patterns where the bolts are directly across from each other while other starters have a staggered bolt pattern. Not all blocks have the same bolt pattern. Some do have a third hole but not too many.
Over the years the Chevrolet engines used at least three different size flex plates. These were:
1) 13 11/16" 135 teeth
2) 12.85" 153 teeth
3) 14.13" 168 teeth.
Your engine may even be different.
I am suspicious the previous owner had a starter which was made for a 153 tooth flywheel and adapted the pinion gear from the starter he installed with a pinion gear from a 168 tooth flex plate starter.
Before you buy a starter, mark the flex plate, turn the engine over and count the number of teeth on the flex plate. Then take the starter to the parts store so the bolt pattern can be matched up with a replacement starter made for the flex plate you have.
The counterman will also want to know the make, year and model of your engine and the engine size to cross reference the application.
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Old 09-14-2019, 09:13 AM   #10
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You are in the UK, that explains why the cobbled starter. 7.4l parts that don't cross reference with GM euro engines are next to impossible to get there. Here in the US one of the companies I buy parts from does ship to the UK "Summit Racing' . Your GM part # is 10465167. Here is a link to that part at Summit.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ado-323-485
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Old 09-14-2019, 10:31 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNC View Post
You are in the UK, that explains why the cobbled starter. 7.4l parts that don't cross reference with GM euro engines are next to impossible to get there. Here in the US one of the companies I buy parts from does ship to the UK "Summit Racing' . Your GM part # is 10465167. Here is a link to that part at Summit.



https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ado-323-485


I second Summit and they have a great selection of brakes for the P30 too.
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Old 09-19-2019, 05:52 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNC View Post
You are in the UK, that explains why the cobbled starter. 7.4l parts that don't cross reference with GM euro engines are next to impossible to get there. Here in the US one of the companies I buy parts from does ship to the UK "Summit Racing' . Your GM part # is 10465167. Here is a link to that part at Summit.

https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ado-323-485
That appears to be the original starter very good post, take a very close look at the nose of the starter....it is heavily reinforced also a very narrow drive engagement opening. 454s are old news not very many builders or suppliers still build...or even rebuild them. Most part houses use a light duty 350 starter which will not hold up in a 454, above and beyond that the 454 design (exhaust manifold) starter location only makes things worse by super heating the starter. They do make a heat shield which is highly recommended those starters can be a real pain...

Here is another number that will work and hold up in a 454..336-1875A

https://www.amazon.com/ACDelco-336-1.../dp/B0031I9RGQ

Again notice the nose heavily reinforced...
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Old 09-19-2019, 06:42 PM   #13
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If you change starters, make sure you get a shim pak with the new one.....
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