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Old 07-09-2016, 06:08 PM   #1
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30a outlet at the RV dock.

So, here's my thought:
I want to run 120vac/30a service out to my RV dock.

Plan:
1. replace a 15A CB in the panel with a 30A,
2. run 10ga. wire to a small CB box where the 15A CB will be relocated to,
3. reconnect the house wiring back to the 15a breaker,
4. split off a 10ga. run from the small CB box buss out to the 30a receptacle at the dock.

The 30a breaker will protect the line out to the dock and the 15a breaker will protect the house wiring as before. I have the power to use, just not the CB panel room.


Any holes in this plan?
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Old 07-09-2016, 06:54 PM   #2
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I'll have to break out my " sub panel " wiring regulations , but right off the top of my head , I think to meet code you have to put a 30 amp and the 15 amp into the sub panel, you're not allowed to make wiring connections in a sub panel unless they are through a C/B.
30 amp C/B in the main will allow up to 60 amps total C/Bs in the sub.

If I find anything different in the regulations I'll re-post.

Edit : How long is the wiring run from the sub panel to the RV plug going to be , wiring size for the length of run there may be an issue.
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Old 07-09-2016, 08:51 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grumpy_g View Post
So, here's my thought:
I want to run 120vac/30a service out to my RV dock.

Plan:
1. replace a 15A CB in the panel with a 30A,
2. run 10ga. wire to a small CB box where the 15A CB will be relocated to,
3. reconnect the house wiring back to the 15a breaker,
4. split off a 10ga. run from the small CB box buss out to the 30a receptacle at the dock.

The 30a breaker will protect the line out to the dock and the 15a breaker will protect the house wiring as before. I have the power to use, just not the CB panel room.


Any holes in this plan?
Sounds like it's doable, just make sure you use the correct wire size for all runs.electrician calculators
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Old 07-10-2016, 04:44 AM   #4
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Thanks, guys.
Skip - the run will be a max of 60 feet, and judging by the calculators that Ray sent, very handy Ray, the voltage drop will be about 3.8% or about 115 at the load based on 120vac to begin with.
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Old 07-10-2016, 04:48 AM   #5
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So Skip, you're saying that I have to treat this little box as a sub panel and run a line from the main panel buss to it without coming off a breaker in the main panel, and then have my 30a and 15a breakers in the small box? (there is room for two breakers but I thought lines coming off the main should be protected when they leave)
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Old 07-10-2016, 06:35 AM   #6
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I am installing a 30 amp RV receptacle box at the rear of my property where an older one was installed when the property was being built by the original owner who lived in a small trailer. My main panel inside my garage has a 30 amp CB.

The conduit that was there had outdoor 10/2 gauge wire plus ground from one end to the other but because it is about 90 feet long I am removing the 10 gauge and installing 2 - 6 gauge single wires (black/white) plus ground to minimize the voltage drop.

I am assuming that I do not need a CB at the RV receptacle box plus there isn't any such area in the new box that I purchased from Lowe's to install one.

30 amp RV Receptacle Box

It is my understanding that if you plan to use a sub-panel it has be protected at the main panel with a CB. Then your sub-panel should have CB's to protect whatever circuits you are splitting off in the sub panel to their destination. It would seem logical to me that the cable size going to the sub-panel needs to be sized for the combined circuits that are being split off at the sub-panel.

Disclaimer: I am not a licensed electrician, only one that can be very dangerous at times to myself.

I yield to the knowledge of experienced and licensed electricians.

Dr4Film ----- Richard
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Old 07-10-2016, 07:14 AM   #7
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That sounds reasonable, so I should install a 60a breaker on the main panel with #6 wires going to the 2-breaker sub-panel and from there reconnect the house wiring to the 15a breaker and the #10 wiring out to the RV drop from the 30a breaker.

Does that sound right?
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Old 07-10-2016, 07:24 AM   #8
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I assume all of your breaker slots are full.....

Why not replace a breaker with two skinny or a dual breaker?
This would be much simpler as far a no changes to the existing 15A circuit.

You can buy a dual 15A breaker, and replace an existing 15A breaker....then remove the "target" 15A and move that wire to the new extra breaker....now you have an open slot for your new 30A circuit.

Regards,

Dan
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Old 07-10-2016, 07:37 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr4Film View Post
I am installing a 30 amp RV receptacle box at the rear of my property where an older one was installed when the property was being built by the original owner who lived in a small trailer. My main panel inside my garage has a 30 amp CB.

The conduit that was there had outdoor 10/2 gauge wire plus ground from one end to the other but because it is about 90 feet long I am removing the 10 gauge and installing 2 - 6 gauge single wires (black/white) plus ground to minimize the voltage drop.

I am assuming that I do not need a CB at the RV receptacle box plus there isn't any such area in the new box that I purchased from Lowe's to install one.

30 amp RV Receptacle Box

It is my understanding that if you plan to use a sub-panel it has be protected at the main panel with a CB. Then your sub-panel should have CB's to protect whatever circuits you are splitting off in the sub panel to their destination. It would seem logical to me that the cable size going to the sub-panel needs to be sized for the combined circuits that are being split off at the sub-panel.

Disclaimer: I am not a licensed electrician, only one that can be very dangerous at times to myself.

I yield to the knowledge of experienced and licensed electricians.

Dr4Film ----- Richard
You are correct. But don't give licensed electricians too much credit. Many of them look at a RV recpt. and automatically think 230 volts. I was called to a 4th of July fireworks show on the 3rd. They had a electrician wiring a recpt. for a travel trailer. I walked over and saw he was hooking the recpt. up to 230 volts. I said you better check the writing on the recpt. You will find it says 30 amp 125 volts travel trailer use only. He looked at it and said thank you, I have never seen this before. He wasn't dumb, just not used to RV wiring.
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Old 07-10-2016, 08:03 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dpinvidic View Post
I assume all of your breaker slots are full.....

Why not replace a breaker with two skinny or a dual breaker?
This would be much simpler as far a no changes to the existing 15A circuit.

You can buy a dual 15A breaker, and replace an existing 15A breaker....then remove the "target" 15A and move that wire to the new extra breaker....now you have an open slot for your new 30A circuit.

Regards,

Dan
Yes, the panel is full. That's a good idea and I would but they are not square-D and I am having trouble finding them. Zinsco or something. I did see a 120vac double 30a online at Amazon for around $56.
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Old 07-10-2016, 08:10 AM   #11
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30a outlet at the RV dock.

Something I have read and heard on true sub-panels is the handling of grounds. Depending on how it is installed determines the ground path setup. Sometimes there is a separate ground rod and ground connection. I had to do this on my shop that was split off from the meter box. If a sub-panel is coming from the main panel then you generally share the ground and run a ground wire from main like my sub-panel in our basement.
With that said I am not sure an RV box/outlet would be considered a sub-panel but should have a ground wire coming from main panel.
As to having a circuit breaker at the outlet, I did the same as you are describing Richard except 50 amp. Having a breaker at the box would be nice if you want to kill the power to the outlet before disconnecting. I just shut down everything inside coach then disconnect.

I too am not a licensed electrician so take my information lightly.🤓


Steve
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Old 07-10-2016, 08:36 AM   #12
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I'm not an electrician and I'm not certain about separate ground rods at the subpanel. The ground and neutral wires have to be separated at the subpanel. I don't know if you can buy a 120V subpanel. They may be 240V only. This might require a Double CB at the main panel and fed to the subpanel with a 3 conductor with ground cable.
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Old 07-10-2016, 08:43 AM   #13
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Steve,

I believe a sub-panel requires a ground rod buried in the ground whereas an outlet box does not. However, the location where the old outlet was happens to have a ground rod too which I will use since it is there but it will be grounded at the ground buss in my main panel in the garage too. No need to have a CB in the receptacle box as that circuit will be off unless it is being used by a guest staying at the house. A little walking never hurt anyone.

I am wiring a 50 amp box to my RV carport area located under my elevated beach house where my coach will be parked. That is only about 25 paces from the main power box inside the garage. No need to have extra CB's like what they usually have at RV Parks.

Dr4Film ----- Richard
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Old 07-26-2016, 04:01 PM   #14
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I seem to have gotten a bit lost. (Also not an electrician)
If I install a 30a breaker in place of a 15a on my main panel, then install a small sub panel, connected by #6/2 wire, with a 15a for the displaced main, and a 30a for the dock power, with the home depot 30a rv power outlet with breaker, do I ground the dock box or is the ground coming from the breaker panel with the #10/2 wire enough?
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