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Old 11-15-2014, 07:46 PM   #15
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Please search postings from myself regarding agm.

There are a few folks here that have created good threads on the subject and wa8yxm, myself and others have provided good information that you should read.

If you are not now setup for AGM/VRLA it is expensive to convert and if done properly the outcome can be great but cut the wrong corner and performance can be short lived and expensive lesson.

AGM/VRLA are great products but must be used properly.
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:08 PM   #16
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What is there to set up with AGM batteries?
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:13 PM   #17
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Please search, read and learn...

In short...the support system needs to be propery designed to work with the batteries as they are real picky and will NOT tollerate over voltage.
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Old 11-16-2014, 12:45 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by buckeyemike View Post
What is there to set up with AGM batteries?

Really not much. Here is a link to the Lifeline batteries owners manual.

The recommended charging voltages fall within the range of normal flooded cell voltages.

http://www.lifelinebatteries.com/manual.php

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Old 11-16-2014, 03:37 PM   #19
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I need to replace my four 6 volt flooded batteries and would like to use AGM type batteries I have heard life line are the best but do not want to spend thousands. I do boondock several times a year but not full time. What AGM batteries offer the best value?
To answer your question, I would say Lifeline as most have already stated.
That is all you were asking.
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Old 11-16-2014, 04:06 PM   #20
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I believe GARYRVROHMER has the best advice. 6 volt golf cart batteries will last for a significant number of years with proper care. Adding water twice a year is not that much effort to save big $$$'s. Plus if you do check your batteries, you will have knowledge of what is going on in the battery bay.
MHO.
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Old 11-16-2014, 04:12 PM   #21
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On AGM's, check into:

Top Tier
-Lifelines
-Concorde
-Rolls

Other Tiers
-Deka
-Trojan
-Interstate
-Costco, SAM's, NAPA re-branded

But, many others exists, and again many are rebranded.

No real magic when it comes to batteries. I concur that the best bang for the buck all up is the GC 6V battery.

I went with Lifeline X4 L16's for 800AH bank. Replaced two Deka 8D's AGM's for house duty. I did go with a CAT 8D Maintenance Free for chassis duty.

I did the math, and for about $250 more for the full set, I felt the Lifeline's were worth the extra money over what I could have got a set of generic L16's AGM, with 15AH less per battery. I look at it as amortized over a 6 to possibly 10 year life usage.

As mentioned in this thread, be sure your charger has a charging setting for AGM's. Be aware that Lifeline's do have a higher/different charging settings then other AGM's.

Faster charging recycles. Higher safe discharge rates. Good reputation for standing behind their batteries. Are other reasons I went with Lifeline's.

I feel if you can find a battery distributor, or check online, that can give you quotes for any of what I consider Top Tier AGM's - you can't go wrong with any of them. The lower tiers, would need to be a substantial savings before I would go with them.

That being said, if you go with wet cells, I do suggest investing in the automatic watering system's. They can save a battery, and reduces the maintenance effort.

Best to you on your choices,
Smitty
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Old 11-16-2014, 04:36 PM   #22
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Am I wrong on this or should I look at flooded batteries?
It is rather complex.. But you need to put the advantages (the real ones) and disadvantages on the board and decide

AGM:
The ability to ignore "This side up" is likely not an advantage for you

The faster re-charge.. Well, if you do not upgrade your converter it will only be a few minutes,,

Lower self-discharge, Applies to storage for the most part, i stored my RV plugged in so that was not an issue for me. Plus I still used part of it dang near every day even with it was way below zero and a foot of snow on the ground (I'm a ham radio operator, I put the radios in the RV, oh, they run off the house batteries).

No need to water 'em from time to time,, This can be a biggie if they are hard to access. but this also applies to Maintence Free designs that are NOT AGM

Downside: COST

Flooded wet cells: Upside: COST

Downside, Need to clean, polish and water.. May take a few more minutes to recharge, and higher self discharge rate.

This is why I support flooded wet cells. They are lower in cost, last roughly the same amount or time if not longer (IN my case the AGM's lasted about half as long as the Flooded) but mostly it is the cost.
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Old 11-16-2014, 04:49 PM   #23
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As others have said, the wet cells are not what the OP asked about, but just for a comparison, Sam's Club sells their GC2 batteries for $84.52. Here in Florida, with tax that's $361.75 for a set of four. They are rated at 215 AH. I just bought the auto fill kit for about $115.


All that is a lot cheaper than the AGMs I was looking at.


Anyway, good luck with it.


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Old 11-16-2014, 05:47 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wa8yxm View Post
It is rather complex.. But you need to put the advantages (the real ones) and disadvantages on the board and decide

AGM:
The ability to ignore "This side up" is likely not an advantage for you

The faster re-charge.. Well, if you do not upgrade your converter it will only be a few minutes,,

Lower self-discharge, Applies to storage for the most part, i stored my RV plugged in so that was not an issue for me. Plus I still used part of it dang near every day even with it was way below zero and a foot of snow on the ground (I'm a ham radio operator, I put the radios in the RV, oh, they run off the house batteries).

No need to water 'em from time to time,, This can be a biggie if they are hard to access. but this also applies to Maintence Free designs that are NOT AGM

Downside: COST

Flooded wet cells: Upside: COST

Downside, Need to clean, polish and water.. May take a few more minutes to recharge, and higher self discharge rate.

This is why I support flooded wet cells. They are lower in cost, last roughly the same amount or time if not longer (IN my case the AGM's lasted about half as long as the Flooded) but mostly it is the cost.

Solid and balanced info in this post, with a few areas more info sharing.

Some AGM's can have up to 5 times faster than wet cell's. Key word here is 'can', and not typical in RV AGM applications. But, two to three times faster is realistic. Lifeline's have different charging parameters than other AGM's. When you add the higher safe discharge rates, and the faster recharge times, AGM's are a solid improvement over wet cells. But, only if you need them. Heavy boondocking type camping is a good application for AGM. And another 'but' - you need to also have the proper gear to fully realize this faster charging time. And be willing to ante up the coin to add the gear and AGM's.

I will add my opinion that AGM vs Wet Cell should be penciled out with equal anticipated life expectancy. Depending upon the sophistication of the equipment used for charging, AGM's could last longer than Wet Cell. I also feel that most Wet Cells go South easier than AGM's. They're not as forgiving on deeper discharge, and let them go dry a bit, and you lose life out of them.

And if you want to have higher discharge rates, and faster recharge times even over AGM's - Lithium batteries are becoming more interesting and I see strong potential for these to become the RV house battery of the future. And not 20 years, more like within the next 5-10 years.

A general comment about battery discussions. They're like the old Dino vs Synthetic - everyone goes with what works for them, and what they feel comfortable with. And that is OK...

Best to all, and may the 'charge' be with you,
Smitty
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Old 11-16-2014, 11:29 PM   #25
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Could a disadvantage of wet cells be corrosion risks? One could say that should only be if you end up boiling the battery or tipping it over, but I've had many lead acid starter batteries over the years have extra rust and corrosion below the battery under the hood.
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Old 11-17-2014, 11:34 AM   #26
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Could a disadvantage of wet cells be corrosion risks? One could say that should only be if you end up boiling the battery or tipping it over, but I've had many lead acid starter batteries over the years have extra rust and corrosion below the battery under the hood.

I would say yes. AGM batteries can be shipped UPS or Fedex as they are recognized as "safe"......... Flooded wet cells cannot be shipped this way.
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Old 11-17-2014, 05:01 PM   #27
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Just about all the above comments hit the nail right on the head. My choice of going with Lifelines was clinched by the corrosion issue. No matter how careful and meticulous you are about battery charging, battery cleaning, battery filling, and all the other battery tasks, the corrosion with flooded wet cells is never ending and a real drag. Slide rails corrode, hold downs need to be replaced, battery trays scraped, painted and in some cases replaced, at most major maintenance cycles. Corrosion also allows current leakage which lowers battery life and cuts off the grid time or adds to generator run time.

I just finished a major maintenance cycle at 32,000 miles and 2 1/2 years of Lifeline use in this Bus and all I did was pull out the battery tray and blow the dust off. Don't get much better than that.
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Old 11-17-2014, 10:09 PM   #28
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Fullriver AGM batteries offer a good value in my experience. Generally less expensive than Lifeline and are backed by one of the best warranties available. I have four Fullriver DC220-6 Group 27 batteries and they are performing well. I would have gone with Lifelines but had problems getting a good fit with them in my battery bay.

The VMAX Charge Tanks might be good for those with limited means.
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