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Old 02-08-2006, 04:25 PM   #1
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I just added photos of the RV to my webshots site at:
http://community.webshots.com/album/547378485uYuIDs


I just purchased a used Class C motorhome from a dealer that sells Travel Supreme, R-Vision and Coachman.

I was told that their RV mechanics checked EVERYTHING thoroughly. They estimated mechanical repairs at $900 and RV related repairs at $500.

I purchased last Monday 1/30/06. They were to have ALL repairs done by Friday 2/3/06 if not earlier.

On Monday 2/5/06 I get a call telling me the mechanical repairs will be closer to $5,000 and that doesn't cover everything. The RV dealership owner was not available until Tuesday. I met with him. His responses included:

"What did you expect!"
"Estimates are worthless."

In the discussion on Tuesday they then said they DID NOT inspect the generator and other issues.

I'm still in shock for having believed them. If it had been a private party I would have hired an independent mechanic.

The dealer is in York County, Pennsylvania. I immediately posted an ad to sell the RV on a free website. If I post on EBay I think it costs about $80.

I'm not even sure if it is safe to drive the RV to try to get other estimates.

Any advice would be appreciated. Thank you in advance.
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Old 02-08-2006, 04:25 PM   #2
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I just added photos of the RV to my webshots site at:
http://community.webshots.com/album/547378485uYuIDs


I just purchased a used Class C motorhome from a dealer that sells Travel Supreme, R-Vision and Coachman.

I was told that their RV mechanics checked EVERYTHING thoroughly. They estimated mechanical repairs at $900 and RV related repairs at $500.

I purchased last Monday 1/30/06. They were to have ALL repairs done by Friday 2/3/06 if not earlier.

On Monday 2/5/06 I get a call telling me the mechanical repairs will be closer to $5,000 and that doesn't cover everything. The RV dealership owner was not available until Tuesday. I met with him. His responses included:

"What did you expect!"
"Estimates are worthless."

In the discussion on Tuesday they then said they DID NOT inspect the generator and other issues.

I'm still in shock for having believed them. If it had been a private party I would have hired an independent mechanic.

The dealer is in York County, Pennsylvania. I immediately posted an ad to sell the RV on a free website. If I post on EBay I think it costs about $80.

I'm not even sure if it is safe to drive the RV to try to get other estimates.

Any advice would be appreciated. Thank you in advance.
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Old 02-08-2006, 04:55 PM   #3
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Georgeann, welcome to irv2 glad to have you aboard. If people can help you here you have to give us some more info. Type of chassis,age,model, what exactly is wrong with class c, what info on problems dealer is giving you etc,etc.
You should have a 30 day warranty at least, unless you took it as is. Give us a round down some people will be able to give some constructive advise. "007"
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Old 02-08-2006, 04:58 PM   #4
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Sorry to hear of your problem, georgeann. Unfortunately, estimates are just that - estimates. I don't think any dealer would guarantee something lebeled as an "estimate".

The right approach to this purchase would have been for you to offer to add the estimated cost of repairs to the purchase price and have the dealer fix it BEFORE accepting delivery. That way the risk of exceeding the estimate is borne by the dealer rather than you.

You didn't mention the nature of the problems, so I can't comment on whether it is "safe to drive". Few things are that serious, however.

A really ethical dealer would offer to take the Rv back and credit your purchase price towards some another rig on his lot. A very few might just refund your money. I gather this dealer isn't among either of those groups.
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Old 02-08-2006, 05:01 PM   #5
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Sorry to hear of the less than honest dealer. Did you happen to get the "estimate" in writting? They have an obligation to provide the service per the estimate if it is in writting. If not in writting....I wish you the best of luck.

In any case you might want to send a couple of hundred $$$ and talk to an attorney.

Ken
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Old 02-08-2006, 08:03 PM   #6
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I would second the advice of talking to an attorney. Would love to know the name of the dealer.
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Old 02-09-2006, 12:15 AM   #7
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Another 'vote' for 'talk to an Atty.' If the 'estimate' was from the dealer you purchased the unit from .... my guess is the 'low ball' figure may be considered "an inducement" to get you to purchase.

Given the dealer has a 'trained staff' missing the 'true number' by 90% may well be considered fraud.

Just my .02 cents.
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Old 02-09-2006, 12:53 AM   #8
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George,

If the dealer represented that he was selling you a coach that was inspected throughly by his experts and only needed $900 of mechanical repairs and $500 RV related repairs to make it 100% then you might have something to go on.

If he said my guy noticed that it needs a,b,c and that will cost you $1400 if you want that work done here. Then he called to tell you we noticed it also needs x, y, z while we were doing a,b,c which will cost an additional $3,600 if you want that done to, then that is another mater.

Was it one of his trades or a consignment unit?

As for estimates being worthless well some states require they be within 20% of the actual cost, you need to check what the rule is in your state.

Two months ago I purchased a 95 Vectra from a truck service center that does consignment sales and made certain repairs that I would pay for and others that I would not pay for part of the deal. I did not pay for the repairs or the coach until after the repairs were all done at the estimated cost and to my satisfaction. If anything was out of order I could have simply refused to sign off and take delivery.

If you do sell the coach and try again, hold onto your cash and don't pay more than a minimal deposit until all is the way you agreed upon.

Regards,

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Old 02-09-2006, 02:38 AM   #9
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I am lookind at class A's in NH and once you buy you own.I want at least a 30 day warrenty and the 3 dealers I spoke with more or less said tuff luck.Buying new seems like the way to go.
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Old 02-09-2006, 03:45 AM   #10
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Thanks everyone for your replies.

Being new to this forum, I am not sure how to reply to a specific post.

Miles said he'd like to know the name of the dealer. The dealer's website is www.balzannasrv.com

I'll try to post more details soon but my internet connection is hit and miss at the moment.

I just posted some photos of the RV on my webshots site at: http://community.webshots.com/album/547378485uYuIDs

Below is from the mechanic's notes. Unfortunately when I drove 2 states away to title and tag the RV while the repairs were supposedly being done, my bag with my notebook was stolen. However his list seems almost identical to what I was told initially. The 'additional items' are what he added later.

Mechanical repairs for 1978 Ford Chateaux Camper Class C: (original estimate was $900)

2 front headlights and rings
1 bulb
oil change
air filter

front & rear brakes (dealer said it needed both brakes, mechanic now says it only needs one set - I think rear brakes)
waterpump
Thermostat & Gasket
Exhaust repair - manifolds?
plugs
6 tires

Additional items
cap
rotor
wires
Carb - Baseplate + Choke Repair
Brake Master & Booster Assembly
Radius Arm Bushings
Battery Hold downs

Repairs for RV: 1st estimate was 200-300, then $500, then later $350 for generator + $275 for steps. But the dealer who sold it to me and quoted the estimates said 'estimates are meaningless.'

Generator - wiring
Generator - switch
Generator - plug

Steps - $275 (they don't retract even though you can hear a noise when you push the button for them to retract.) If I get the RV repaired, I think I'd remove the steps for now and use some plastic steps I could buy at a store for now.)
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Old 02-09-2006, 04:12 AM   #11
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Georgeann,

Thanks for the link to Balzannas RV website. I clicked on their tab for Integrity and Service and it says "Under Construction".

Maybe when they complete the construction work on their integrity they'll become a better place to deal with.
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Old 02-09-2006, 06:14 AM   #12
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Georgeann, thanks for posting pic's and list. The coach looks in pretty good shape inside and out for a 78. The machanical repairs you need to find a reliable mach who can give you a fair price all the items can be fix by a good shop. AS to items in coach water pump you can replace, generator may not have been run enough and may need just a good cleaning by gen shop, if its done CW has them on sales during the year, you do not need unless you dry camp for now. The Vintage group on irv2 would welcome the challenge to help you in getting your vintage MH in tip top shape. Like I said you can be proud of owning a coach of that age with some money invested but don't look for dealer to put you there. "007"
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Old 02-09-2006, 06:58 AM   #13
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It sounds as though the servce department is willing to fix the estimated items for the estimated price, give or take a bit. That's in the nature of "estimate". Your issue seems to be that the original estimate did not cover quite a few items that also need repairs. As Fred Evans suggests, if the dealer represented that the estimated repairs were the ONLY needed repairs and you purchased based on that needed assumption, then you may have a legal reason to invalidate the sales contract. You probably need a lawyer to help with that, but you can raise the issue with the dealer yourself and see if he blinks. Since the discussion of repairs prior to sale was probably only verbal, it's your word against theirs.
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Old 02-09-2006, 07:07 AM   #14
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I only drove the RV for a brief test drive. The dealer drove it to the mechanic's shop very close by.

The dealer had represented that they thoroughly checked EVERYTHING out and the estimate included EVERY repair needed to make it safe for a trip to Florida and that the generator and all appliances worked.

I asked the mechanic if he knew of anyone willing to buy the RV. He made a few calls to his mechanic friends and one saw it last night. Another is supposed to come today. If I can sell it close to the $3,000 I paid and write off my cost to tag, title and insure, I will. Then I will be much more careful on the next purchase.

If I can't sell it quickly then I need to reconsider my options.
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