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Old 11-04-2013, 10:33 AM   #1
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No City Water

I believe I posted this under Fleetwood when I first joined this forum. But I have never had water to both sides of the faucets when on city water pressure. When the water tank is full and the pump on I have hot and cold water at all faucets. I have tried almost every idea that has been suggested. Contacted Fleetwood and they worked with me over a week time frame trying different things, looking for hidden valves, etc. My system has two valves(that I can find)one on the discharge side of the pump and the heater bypass valve. When the bypass valve is in bypass mode it fills the water tank, the valve by the pump has to be open also. Supposedly when the bypass valve closed and the pump valve closed the city water is suppose to go thru the system. I have tried all different combinations of open and closed. Nothing there seems to do anything, I unhooked the outside shower hot water hose and capped the faucet side and plugged the hose, nothing happens. I replaced the shower valve last week no effect on the problem. My next item to replace is the kitchen faucet, when the city water connection is on, and the faucet on the cold water side, you can actually hear what sounds like water running. I just can't figure it out, but sooner or later I will. Just an update.

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Old 11-04-2013, 12:04 PM   #2
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Here is a "shot in the dark". Have you had the back-flow-preventer valve at the city water-fill connector apart to determine if it is somehow assembled backward? I don't even know if it is even possible to assemble it so. Do you get water flow at the toilet bowl on city water?
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Old 11-04-2013, 02:37 PM   #3
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Here is a "shot in the dark". Have you had the back-flow-preventer valve at the city water-fill connector apart to determine if it is somehow assembled backward? I don't even know if it is even possible to assemble it so. Do you get water flow at the toilet bowl on city water?

I turned it all on and I have water coming out the hot water side of every faucet(cold water) and no water coming out of the cold water side or to the toilet. I just have a feeling it's something to do with the faucet in the kitchen or with the way the the plumbing is done at the pump. The prev. owner had a blow out and replaced the pump, and I am wondering if it's correct. I have been trying to locate a Pace Arrow of the same year to check and see.
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Old 11-04-2013, 05:50 PM   #4
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4NADL posted this the other day in the Newmar Owners Group. Maybe this might help to think through what the issue is.
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Old 11-04-2013, 08:39 PM   #5
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I have the diagram from Fleetwood, just can't figure it out, since nothing is labeled and there is no glossary or schedule of the numbers used in identifying the different pipes, etc.
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Old 11-05-2013, 07:58 AM   #6
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I think you have two separate issues brother.

First, when the water heater by-pass is in the by-pass position the water that normally enters the water heater should be then prevented from entering the tank and be sent back out the 'hot' lines to the faucets. If in this setting you have water getting into the tank you have a problem with the plumbing itself. You should be able to open the drain valve on the water heater with the rig connected to city water and get nothing coming out.

I believe this is what's the main problem.

As for the valve at the pump, I'm confused. I've not seen a setup that required a valve. The setup I'm seeing (and all that's necessary IMHO) is a one-way check valve or back-flow preventer on the output side of the pump. Once you connect the city water supply the check valve prevents city pressure from going up-stream past the pump and into the fresh water holding tank. The only manual valve needed would be something to by-pass the check valve to allow you to fill the holding tank off the city water system.

Are you sure the valve you're referring to isn't some sort of antifreeze up-take arrangement?
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Old 11-05-2013, 08:23 AM   #7
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I agree with Murf2U on the hot water tank bypass valve.

When I was reading your very first post, what you had written about the hot water bypass immediately stuck out as being BASS Ackwards.

The bypass valve is for winterizing the water lines without filling up the entire hot water tank with anti-freeze.

Get that problem corrected FIRST and then go on to the second problem. While fixing the bypass situation you just may find what is causing your cold water problem.

It certainly sounds like someone either at the factory or the previous owner didn't have a clue as to what they were doing and messed things up on your water distribution system.

It won't be the first time that people who don't know what they are doing have really made a mess of things.

I found one in my coach that was done at the factory regarding a switch that turns on the engine Pre-Heat. It was wired ASS Backwards and as such the AH pump to heat the engine ran for ten years straight. At least I now know that the pump is an exceptional pump to run 24/7 for ten years without one problem.

Dr4Film ----- Richard
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Old 11-05-2013, 02:32 PM   #8
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Sounds like a reversed check valve somewhere. Or maybe in the wrong place.
Look closely at all the valves/fittings in the tank/pump area. Check valves do have an arrow on them pointing the direction of flow.
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Old 11-05-2013, 04:05 PM   #9
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The bypass valve on my rig is up beside the freshwater tank, it has a sign on it showing which way to set it. When in the bypass mode, the tank can be filled. And when in the normal position, it is suppose to allow usage of the pump or city water connection. The other valve I talked about it located on the discharge side of the pump and it says normal or closed. The owner's manual says it should be in the closed position when filling the tank or using city water. The prev owner stated that the system worked last time he used it, but he also stated they dry camped for 2 weeks, so that tells me he was using the pump. I have looked all over the rig for another valve, or some sort of check valve. the hot water heater can't be accessed unless I want to pull it completely out of the rig. I have found a 2001 Pace Arrow 33v at a RV lot, think I am going to take a ride down and look at the system. I still feel there is a valve that I can't find and the owner's manual don't mention, or the installation of the pump by the Prev Owner is wrong or he left something out. There is a local RV repair that will come out and look at the system without charging me, unless they fix it. I might catch him next time he is in the park and see if he sees something I am missing. It is weird that when the kitchen faucet is open, on the cold water side, you can hear what sounds like water running or air rushing out. It is a totally aggravating problem, and even Fleetwood can't figure it out..
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Old 11-06-2013, 07:13 AM   #10
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Ok, your description clears up a bunch of confusion. It sounds like you have one more valve you need to find. Neither of what you described is a water heater by-pass valve, but I'd bet there is one, and it's in the wrong position.

It will likely be right next to the water heater where the lines go in & out on the back. It is likely a brass valve with three lines going into it. This the water heater by-pass valve.
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Old 11-06-2013, 07:32 AM   #11
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Perhaps some places to look for a by-pass valve is in order. My present rig has the valve in the basement aft and below the water heater. Previous Pace had the valve located in the bathroom below the sink;had to remove a drawer to access the valve.
How many other hiding spots can others reveal?
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Old 11-06-2013, 05:23 PM   #12
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Ok, your description clears up a bunch of confusion. It sounds like you have one more valve you need to find. Neither of what you described is a water heater by-pass valve, but I'd bet there is one, and it's in the wrong position.

It will likely be right next to the water heater where the lines go in & out on the back. It is likely a brass valve with three lines going into it. This the water heater by-pass valve.
That is the valve that is beside my fresh water tank. 3 lines in, sign on front of valve shows which way to turn it to bypass or for normal operations. My biggest area of confusion is: Why everything works fine on the pump but not on fresh water? I have looked everywhere and Fleetwood assured me there was only one hot water bypass valve...As I stated above, there is no way to access the lines going in or out of my hot water heater. It is a sealed compartment and the lines go in and out of the top, can't find where they go or how to access them...
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Old 11-07-2013, 06:46 AM   #13
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That is the valve that is beside my fresh water tank. 3 lines in, sign on front of valve shows which way to turn it to bypass or for normal operations. My biggest area of confusion is: Why everything works fine on the pump but not on fresh water? I have looked everywhere and Fleetwood assured me there was only one hot water bypass valve...As I stated above, there is no way to access the lines going in or out of my hot water heater. It is a sealed compartment and the lines go in and out of the top, can't find where they go or how to access them...
Ok, I need a little clarification. In your first post you said "My system has two valves(that I can find)one on the discharge side of the pump and the heater bypass valve. When the bypass valve is in bypass mode it fills the water tank, the valve by the pump has to be open also. Supposedly when the bypass valve closed and the pump valve closed the city water is suppose to go thru the system."

The "water heater by-pass valve" cannot fill the "water tank" (assuming you mean fresh water holding tank) or did you mean to say "water heater"?

Aside from that, you're description sounds spot on for a manual system that would otherwise be accomplished with a check-valve and a fresh water fill port.

I can't recall ever seeing a water heater that wasn't accessible from the rear, be it under the bed, in a kitchen cabinet or behind drawers or something. All those gas and water lines, electricity supply etc., can't be done from the outside then the unit slid in. I also find it hard to believe any manufacturer would seal it in, they have a tendency to need replacing, pipes burst or leak, etc., there has to be access for service.
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Old 11-07-2013, 12:51 PM   #14
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Ok, I need a little clarification. In your first post you said "My system has two valves(that I can find)one on the discharge side of the pump and the heater bypass valve. When the bypass valve is in bypass mode it fills the water tank, the valve by the pump has to be open also. Supposedly when the bypass valve closed and the pump valve closed the city water is suppose to go thru the system."

The "water heater by-pass valve" cannot fill the "water tank" (assuming you mean fresh water holding tank) or did you mean to say "water heater"?

Aside from that, you're description sounds spot on for a manual system that would otherwise be accomplished with a check-valve and a fresh water fill port.

I can't recall ever seeing a water heater that wasn't accessible from the rear, be it under the bed, in a kitchen cabinet or behind drawers or something. All those gas and water lines, electricity supply etc., can't be done from the outside then the unit slid in. I also find it hard to believe any manufacturer would seal it in, they have a tendency to need replacing, pipes burst or leak, etc., there has to be access for service.

Not doubting your RV knowledge, but my owners manual says the fresh water tank can be filled either by using the fill on the side of the motorhome or by opening the by pass valve and opening the valve on the pump line. When both are closed the water pump will then draw water from the tank as normal. My water heater is in a sealed steel compartment(just like the storage ones)it is located in front of the rear tires and that is why I think it is sealed. The water lines go in from the top, down thru the floor(found them under the refrigerator). I am not sure what is normal and what is not, as every rig I look at is totally different depending on the floorplan. I have looked at other Pace Arrows and they look nothing like mine as far as plumbing, tank location,etc. Still trying to get down to the dealer and look at the 33v they have. I did an extensive search(one of many)last evening crawling under the rig, looking in behind drawers, refrigerator, pantry for a valve and I can't find another valve, factory installed or owner installed.

I will take some pics today and put on here so you can see what I am talking about..
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