Go Back   iRV2 Forums > MOTORHOME FORUMS > MH-General Discussions & Problems
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-26-2014, 08:36 PM   #1
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 11
Starting Problem please Help

I have a 1995 monarch signature motorhome. It has been sitting for about a year and I have replaced the ignition switch thinking it was the problem already. What happens is I turn the key to crank it and the gauges go to zero. The batteries are both good. I have already jumpered the solenoid to check it just to hear it and it works. No voltage gets to the small wire on the solenoid though. What else can I try, I have a feeling its something very simple but i cannot figure it out.

Thanks,

PS I do not have a wiring diagram so of someone has one that would be great also.
__________________

__________________
cory0789 is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 10-26-2014, 09:22 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
mgscott4's Avatar
 
Workhorse Chassis Owner
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Kansas City, MO./Pollock, LA.
Posts: 1,549
This is old school starter and solenoid testing.

With the key "on", I used to use an old screwdriver and touch the "hot" terminal to the solenoid terminal, You get a bunch of sparks and burn marks on the old screwdriver, but if the starter and solenoid are good, it will turn over and start, if the solenoid is bad it won't turn over and you may still get a click but if it doesn't turn over it is bad.

Hey, you asked what else you could try. At least you will know if your starter is good or not.
__________________

__________________
06 Hurricane 34FT WH W20 Chassis 8.1L 132K, Steersafe, Koni Shocks, DIY Trac Bar, Tri-Metric 2025RV Battery Monitor, 4-6V Batteries, Scan Gauge 2, Crossfires, 735W Solar Morningstar MPPT-60, WG T4 In-Motion Sat, XM Radio, 07 Chevy Malibu Maxx Toad, Falcon 2, Brake Buddy, Escapee
mgscott4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2014, 10:00 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Lowell, Arkansas
Posts: 4,679
This is a routine issue with a high current demanding devices like starters. Every and I mean EVERY battery cable connection must be good. When you are trying to create a path for 1/2 amp of current flow it's not a problem. When you are trying to pass 150-amps it is a problem. High current needs big cables with good connections. You've said that the battery is good. I don't know how you tested it but. Now when you energize the solenoid you should hear the solenoid go click. If you have a lose or high resistance connection things go dead. Check both positive and negative connections at both ends from the battery to the solenoid, then to the starter. My guess is that you'll find a loose or corroded connection.

Let me relate to you a true story that happened to me in my auto class. PROBLEM: Intermittent cranking issue on an old pickup. PREVIOUS WORK: New starter, new alternator three new batteries and still intermittent no start over a 3-5 month time period. Several shops looked at it and nobody fixed it. The Principal brought the truck to the auto shop. We were studying the cranking circuit at the time. I reviewed the circuit and then started the lab for the day. I sent two kids out and within 5 minutes they came back and it was fixed.

Now the $64,000 dollar question??? What did everybody else miss????

The negative battery cable which connects to the block down around the cylinder head and is the ground path for current flow was simply loose. They cleaned the area, installed a lock washer, tightened it and problem solved.

You may have some other issues but first and foremost you have to eliminate cable connections first.

TeJay
__________________
TeJay Auto Instructor/4-yrs USAF/ Liz: RN/ WBGO 2014 Vista 30T/ F-53/CHF/5-Star/Koni * Bella & Izzy * Golden /Cocker mix/ Louie The Cat* All Retired
TeJay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2014, 10:22 PM   #4
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 8
On my 1990 Signature L-10 I also had starting issues. Sometimes I had to try the key 10 or 12 turns and then The starter would only turn part of a turn and stop.
I pulled the 80lb starter out several times and had it tested at 3 shops. I replaced the large solenoid on the starter and still no change. Finally found a small Ford type solenoid on the front firewall wiring harness area that sounded odd. Replaced that and turns over and starts in1 or 2cycles every time. I replaced all the starter primary wiring prior to pulling the starter out, both positive and negative side as well as setting up 2 different grounds on the frame and engine block. Have some one turn the key while you listen under the front cap, should be able to hear it click when try's to energize and pass current back to starter sloenoid.
__________________
DADSDOGHOUSE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-26-2014, 10:32 PM   #5
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 8
Forgot to mention the front small solenoid only passes the 12v trigger current to the large rear solenoid, it handles the 200 amps the starter needs to crank the engine over, so the front solenoid only has 12 guage wires to the large nuts on each side.
__________________
DADSDOGHOUSE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 09:06 AM   #6
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 11
I have tested the solenoid at tge starter by jumping across it already and it is good... As far as another small solenoid i dont know where it is or what it looks like. We havetightened and cleaned sll cable connections that we know of...

The small wire going to the big solenoid at the starter is getting no voltage when cranking.... What sends voltage to this wire?
__________________
cory0789 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 09:41 AM   #7
Senior Member
 
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Lowell, Arkansas
Posts: 4,679
We also had another solenoid on our 1999 DS up and to the right of the radiator that was bad. Probably the best way is to physically follow the heavy wires. these MH manufacturers will put stuff in out of the way places and of course there's not schematics or pictures to let you know.

TeJay
__________________
TeJay Auto Instructor/4-yrs USAF/ Liz: RN/ WBGO 2014 Vista 30T/ F-53/CHF/5-Star/Koni * Bella & Izzy * Golden /Cocker mix/ Louie The Cat* All Retired
TeJay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 10:32 AM   #8
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 9,800
The power from the ignition switch goes to the neutral safety switch, then on to the start solenoid. Try starting in neutral.
__________________
twinboat is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 10:37 AM   #9
Senior Member
 
D Lindy's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,635
x2 on TeJay's post, you've got in all likely hood a bad/corroded/loose primary ground off the batteries.
__________________
2012 Journey 40U (Our Incredible Journey)
2008 Dodge Dakota(TOAD) 2005 Honda Shadow in TOAD
AF-1 braking system
D Lindy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 11:24 AM   #10
Senior Member
 
Country Coach Owners Club
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Redding
Posts: 3,412
My rig has a starter solenoid and an ignition solenoid.

The ignition solenoid is mounted with the chassis fuse panel in the front driver side basement.

My ignition solenoid had a bad ground connection. Engine would not turn over. Batteries were good.

Of course, I first bought a new solenoid before checking the ground connection. So now have a new spare solenoid.
__________________
Dean
1995 CC Magna #5280
C8.3L 300hp Cummins, 31,000lbs
deandec is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-27-2014, 04:21 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
D Lindy's Avatar
 
Winnebago Owners Club
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 1,635
The KEY to CORY0798's problem is that he looses ALL dash gages etc when the key is turned to the START position. This means he has power to the dash UNTIL there is a big amp draw i.e. trying to engage the starter, then everything does dead - BAD GROUND.
__________________
2012 Journey 40U (Our Incredible Journey)
2008 Dodge Dakota(TOAD) 2005 Honda Shadow in TOAD
AF-1 braking system
D Lindy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2014, 08:05 AM   #12
Senior Member
 
Ford Super Duty Owner
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Lowell, Arkansas
Posts: 4,679
As stated in my original post. The symptoms described I've seen dozens and dozens of times. There has to be a bad connection somewhere in the circuit. He just has not located it just yet. If the batteries are good (That's a big IF) and all goes dead when he tries to crank it is a sure indication of not enough current getting through somewhere. SEARCH, SEARCH, SEARCH. Disconnect every possible connection and then look for more. Don't forget the NEGATIVE connections. Yes the bad connection could also be internal inside of a solenoid. You can't clean those internal contacts but you can replace the solenoid.

I heard about this the other day. Current flow and how it is utilized in today's highly evolved electronic systems has changed. Years ago it was common practice to use CHASSIS ground. That means that the chassis of a device (starter) used the body of the starter as a path to ground. Bolted to a metal body part then acted as the return path for the current flow. Many systems today don't rely on chassis grounds but actually have specific wires coming from an electrical device and leading to grounds.

WHY?? Well a lot today's systems use carbon fiber, plastic, etc and it's harder and harder to find a ground path for current flow. Even back in the 80's the computer systems controlled the ground side of a circuit instead of the positive side. Your throttle position sensor is just one example. The variable resistor controls the ground side of the 5-V going to the computer.

TeJay
__________________
TeJay Auto Instructor/4-yrs USAF/ Liz: RN/ WBGO 2014 Vista 30T/ F-53/CHF/5-Star/Koni * Bella & Izzy * Golden /Cocker mix/ Louie The Cat* All Retired
TeJay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2014, 09:05 AM   #13
Senior Member
 
OLYLEN's Avatar
 
Monaco Owners Club
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Olympia, Wa
Posts: 2,329
If you have a set of jumper cables. Go From chassis batteries GROUND to the frame then try start. If you start you have a ground problem. One EZ test that still may or may not work but might/could help with diagnosis.

LEN
__________________
2004 Clss C 31' Winnebgo
OLYLEN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-02-2014, 01:01 PM   #14
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 11
Update:::

I have replaced the starting solenoid on the back panel and it still did not work... I cleaned the ground off the starter to the chasis frame and still nothing... I tried putting jumper cable on negative battery side to chassis and nothing still...

Can someone explain what ground commections i need to check? What else i can do to find the bad ground?

Here is what i do know...

On the starting solenoid on back panel i get 12v to one side but when cranking it does not pass voltage to the other side... This is a new solenoid so its not that but what stops the current from going across...

I know the brown wire small goes to the neutral safety relay but i never get 12v to it either...
__________________

__________________
cory0789 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Okay ... I SOLVED THE AUTO PARK BRAKE PROBLEM! JerryPeck Workhorse and Chevrolet Chassis Motorhome Forum 144 10-03-2017 11:45 PM
Starting Batteries Joedean Class A Motorhome Discussions 6 12-12-2014 02:21 PM
Fleetwood RV starting problem Ford V10 TopherD Ford Motorhome Chassis Forum 12 06-25-2014 01:27 AM
Hadley problem Dave999 Class A Motorhome Discussions 1 01-12-2014 04:57 PM
Fridge Problem Rossi6998 Winnebago Industries Owner's Forum 22 01-10-2014 09:02 AM

» Virginia Campgrounds

Reviews provided by


Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 05:10 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.