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Old 07-26-2007, 11:56 PM   #29
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The autoformer basically boost low voltage so when voltage is marginal it will help keep you running. It does have some measure of surge supression but I would still recommend a surge guard for the reasons previously stated.
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Old 07-27-2007, 01:34 AM   #30
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Kernel:
E Z Livin - I like your sign off.

Newbie here folks. Looking for edumacation!

I bought the autoformer (30a) online this week. ($327)

Questions:
1. What is the difference? (surge/autoformer)
2. Do you need a surge and?
3. Thoughts? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I went with both. The SurgeGuard will protect you from relatively high surges, extreme low voltage and cross wired hookups while the AutoFormer protects you from moderate surges, crosswired hookups and CORRECTS low voltage situations.

I have the SurgeGuard first to protect the AutoFormer and coach from high surges/wiring issues and the AutoFormer second in line to protect the coach from brownout damage.

Even though I had a SurgeGuard I had a ton of equipment failures last year attributed to extended brownouts that caused long term overheating and premature failures. This was most evident in the AC unit and Transfer Switch. Since I put in the AutoFormer, voltage inside the coach has been constant even though outside it has not been and I have not experienced any more equipment losses. My coach has been plugged in with the AC on constantly along with the fridge, entertainment center and lights available seeing daily use for the past three months on a 15 amp cord with no problems whatsoever.
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Old 07-27-2007, 02:54 AM   #31
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Last year I bought the Progressive Industries 50 Portable EMS, and our 6,000 mile trips this Summer, I never used it....I'm not sure it was a good investment at this point....
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Old 07-27-2007, 05:04 AM   #32
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FrontRangeRVer:
Last year I bought the Progressive Industries 50 Portable EMS, and our 6,000 mile trips this Summer, I never used it....I'm not sure it was a good investment at this point.... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
No offense, but it's not a very good investment if you never used it. If you had used it, you may have found out you had problems you weren't aware of. Just because everything in the coach works doesn't mean the electrical hook-up is good. The surge protectors cover a lot more problems beside electrical surges.

I am surprised at how many times we run into low voltage, high voltage, or missing ground. Those are the 3 most common problems we have met in that order. IMO, protection against these types of problems is even more important than surge protection because they are more common. With all the expensive electronics in coaches today, I don't think its worth the risk. More importantly, a bad ground is also a safety issue. I also find that 30 amp hook-ups are worse than 50; but 50 amp has its problems, too.
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Old 07-27-2007, 05:15 AM   #33
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This is one item I read about on IRV2 and felt that it was to much money to spend.
After thinking about it, I figured I could not afford not to have it. A lot cheaper investement than replacing a lot of electrical items.
Bought it, use it and it has saved me at least four times!
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Old 07-27-2007, 05:31 AM   #34
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FrontRangeRVer,

Could you please share why you never used your Portable EMS? If you mean you just left it in the box and never put it in the circuit, then I guess you are correct about it not being a good investment. My EMS HW-50C is hard wired in my power cord compartment and is always in use when I am hooked up to shore power. I want the 24/7 coverage that it provides.

Kernal,

Like Neil V, I also use both the Progressive Industries EMS / Surge Protector and Hughes Autoformer. If I could only have one it would be the Progressive. It will shut off the power if it becomes dangerously low (&lt;102VAC), amoung other parameters. How much you may need an autoformer depends on how much time you spent in RV Parks with known low voltage problems. We spend at least 3 weeks a year in a park that is noted for low power - our choice, so we have the autoformer. Why?? Location - location - location!!! We also volunteer campground host in the NFS system for a couple of months each season. Also not always the best power.

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Old 07-27-2007, 06:14 AM   #35
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<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by NeilV:
I have the SurgeGuard first to protect the AutoFormer and coach from high surges/wiring issues and the AutoFormer second in line to protect the coach from brownout damage.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is the way I used to have them wired also until the Autoformer stuck in high boost one day. I have a digital plug in meter inside the coach and happened to see the voltage keep increasing every couple of minutes. Found out the relay inside the autoformer was bad and was sticking in boost. I replaced the relay. But I also put the surgeguard on the "inside" of the autoformer so that if the autoformer sticks in "high", the surgeguard will shut off power because it thinks it has a surge coming in. Well it worked, cause the other day the autoformer stuck again and the surgeguard shut off the rig. I have had the autoformer for about 4 years now and I think that the circuit board or the transformer is going bad and it is causing the relay to stick in boost. I am waiting for Hughes to call me back. It is possible that regular use of the autoformer(hardwired into rig) has caused the premature demise of the unit.
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Old 07-27-2007, 03:49 PM   #36
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ISLAPP,

Thats good enough for me. So which one to mate "inside" of my 30A Autoformer.

$388 PT50C vs $283 PT30C

I think I already know the answer but . . .
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Old 08-13-2007, 07:42 AM   #37
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Here's a newbie question for you. In the product description of the Progressive EMS 50A, it has a bullet that reads:

Accidental 220V protection: If 220 volts is detected when plugging into source power the EMS will not allow power to the RV. If this condition occurs while power is applied to the RV, the EMS shuts off power instantly. The display will read the voltage, and the appropriate error code.

My 50A service is a 220v outlet. What am I missing?
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Old 08-13-2007, 08:36 AM   #38
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There is 220v across the 2 hot legs, and 120v between each hot leg and the neutral.

The EMS looks for 220v from each hot leg to neutral where there should only be 120v.

50amp service seems to cause a lot of confusion. It took me a while to get it straight in my head.

HERE is a link that explains 120/240 RV pedestal elec very well.
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Old 08-16-2007, 04:19 PM   #39
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I have the SurgeGuard 50 "permanently" wired in my electrical compartment (picture of the install is on the photo page). I say "permanently" wired as I bought 50 amp plugs to match what was on the coach and the end of the 50 amp land line. Now the land line plugs into the SurgeGuard and the SurgeGuard plugs into the coach. Should I trade later on it will be very easy to remove the SurgeGuard with no modifications made to the coach.

Also in answer to an earlier question -- the 50 amp SurgeGuard does work with 30 amp service. I only have 30 amp service at my home where I store the MH and it works fine with the 50 amp SurgeGuard.
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Old 08-19-2007, 11:05 AM   #40
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Bought a potable unit right after I bought the MH. Went to a friends in FL -- they had an electrician install a 30 A outlet for our MH. Since an 'electrician' installed it I did not hook up my Surge Guard--just plugged in and watched everything 'pop'. The electrician had wired as 240 volts--lost the front tv, inverter, microwave, satellite receiever, DVD player, and refrig.

When I got home I went out an bought the permanent mount unit so I would never 'forget' again. As others have said with all the sensitive electronics in today's MH it's worth it. BTW installation is a snap
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Old 08-19-2007, 03:41 PM   #41
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I just had a "close encounter" this weekend...was at a CG and plugged into 50A with my Progressive HW 50C watching..a very hot day...after about 2 hrs, the power went out...thought it was a CG outage..it was out for a minute and came back...happened again after a minute...shut off one of the ACs and was watching my inside power monitor and saw the power shut off with 102 volts!!! This product probably saved my 2 ACs from high amp burn up ...I packed up and left that CG asap!!
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Old 08-19-2007, 07:53 PM   #42
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I recently was at a KOA campground.

I hooked my Surge Guard into the pillar and turned the breaker on.

I got a warning light and it refused to connect power.

Seems that one of the 50 amp legs was dead. When I brought it to the attention of the manager, she sent an electrician down.

His first words were "Well, those surge suppressors are notorious for being wrong."
He was not going to waste his time on the problem until I talked to the manager again. In a huff he came back down and took the pillar apart. Gee! What do you know! Only one leg had power and it was 104 volts. The other leg was dead. He then said he was going to go up and turn all the breakers off and take the fuses out in the electrical building for that loop. He drove off and never notified the other 3 people who were in the area that we were assigned.

I did notify them and recommended that they unplug.

There was a couple with a new 5er from Canada next to me - and he had no protection. If he had not taken my advise to unplug till the lunkhead was done, he would have fried some electronics, I'm sure! He told me that he would get one as soon as he could get one.

We stayed on generator as I had no confidence in this Yahoo! The next day, they had a backhoe out there digging up the dirt road where the cables were buried.

It saved me once - and I don't hook up anything unless my Surge Guard is in place.
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